They don't vote new leaders in..

SmudgetheClaret · Post by **SmudgetheClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 8:48 am

TM was hand picked and boy we now know why

don't for a minute think if she loses the vote to stay on (I don't think she will) they will perform a democratic ballot to replace her..

Claret-On-A-T-Rex · Post by **Claret-On-A-T-Rex** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:02 am

Why do you spout such utter rubbish?
The Tory party have a process to replace the leader if she loses a no-confidence vote, is ousted or resigns.

NottsClaret · Post by **NottsClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:06 am

The Tories can't have another vote on leader surely, we don't do second votes, right?

What is it the Tories are saying? They got it wrong and now they'd like to change their mind..

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:07 am

Perfectly possible she'll be gone by tonight.

Falcon · Post by **Falcon** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:10 am

I can't see her losing the vote tbh

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:11 am

NottsClaret wrote:The Tories can't have another vote on leader surely, we don't do second votes, right?

What is it the Tories are saying? They got it wrong and now they'd like to change their mind..

They didn't really have a vote to choose her. All the pro-brexit potential candidates either refused to even attempt to become leader, and the one that did was so incompetent she had to quit her campaign.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:13 am

Falcon wrote:I can't see her losing the vote tbh

I'd be surprised if she loses it. And it wouldn't surprise me if some of the letters are from her supporters to see her win the vote so that the speculation ends.

But if she does lose it then we should all remember that when they pick a new leader they won't be using FPTP, even though they think that's good enough for us to have to use to elect them.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:17 am

If she does lose it, then we really are in trouble.

Perfectly possible that the Conservative Party would elect someone who is actually incompetent*, and that is something that we cannot afford.

*more incompetent than May

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:20 am

I think quite a few Tory MPs minds remain to be persuaded one way or the other.
The vote is between six o'clock and eight o'clock tonight, so it'll be a long day for some.

Don't miss PMQs whatever you do....

Lord Rothbury · Post by **Lord Rothbury** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:22 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:If she does lose it, then we really are in trouble.

Perfectly possible that the Conservative Party would elect someone who is actually incompetent*, and that is something that we cannot afford.

*more incompetent than May

I do not think Dianne Abbott is allowed to put her name forward.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:29 am

I don't think she is either, as she is in the labour party.

You lot need to up your game, replies like that are really poor.

What happened to good old satire? its not that hard to do!

Foulthrow · Post by **Foulthrow** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:29 am

There’s no way she is losing this vote. Not unless a clear and obvious replacement emerges who can unite the party. I don’t know who that would be. However, the Tories have potentially shot themselves in the foot here as they risk going into the next general election with her as leader should it be called within a year.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:34 am

Why would it be called though?

There isn't any way it can be called, unless she loses a no-confidence vote in parliament or the DUP change sides.

The DUP are not going to vote for Corbyn. Under any circumstances.

Unlike the ERG, they know that if their bluff is called, then they have nowhere to go.

Labour should be absolutely either 100% behind the Tory Brexit or 100% behind the 2nd ref. No other option is on the table.

Lord Beamish · Post by **Lord Beamish** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:52 am

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/p ... 1544605558" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

May Gone, and no Brexit?

Double bubble!

Falcon · Post by **Falcon** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:58 am

She would say that though. Trying to scare them into voting for her.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:24 am

Well it's certainly more exciting than Coronation Street or Eastenders.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:26 am

This is proper history being made, right here.

Not up to watching the Berlin Wall coming down perhaps, but pretty close.

SmudgetheClaret · Post by **SmudgetheClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:27 am

Claret-On-A-T-Rex wrote:Why do you spout such utter rubbish?
The Tory party have a process to replace the leader if she loses a no-confidence vote, is ousted or resigns.

What like the last time where the media did a motherhood attack on Leadsome wake up pal this is no democracy..

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:30 am

Amazing.

People like you actually deserve to live in a country that isn't actually a democracy.

Take a look online Smudge, see the stuff that goes on in actual non-democracies. Then take a walk outside.

You are incredibly lucky to be born in a country where democracy means something and the rule of law counts. Don't demean it to try to score points on an internet message board.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:32 am

SmudgetheClaret wrote:What like the last time where the media did a motherhood attack on Leadsome wake up pal this is no democracy..

lol. Wasn't it Leadsom doing the attacking about motherhood? Pretty sure she was the one who attacked May, not the other way around.

Lord Beamish · Post by **Lord Beamish** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:36 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:lol. Wasn't it Leadsom doing the attacking about motherhood? Pretty sure she was the one who attacked May, not the other way around.

I’m sure it was Leadsome who was aggrandising(see, Ringo) her own abilities as leader over May based on the fact that she was a mother and May wasn’t.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:38 am

Hells bells, it was as well.

Reality eh?

SmudgetheClaret · Post by **SmudgetheClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:46 am

Imploding Turtle wrote:lol. Wasn't it Leadsom doing the attacking about motherhood? Pretty sure she was the one who attacked May, not the other way around.

It was a media wound up attack to discredit Leadsome you really are naive beyond belief..

SmudgetheClaret · Post by **SmudgetheClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:48 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:Amazing.

People like you actually deserve to live in a country that isn't actually a democracy.

Take a look online Smudge, see the stuff that goes on in actual non-democracies. Then take a walk outside.

You are incredibly lucky to be born in a country where democracy means something and the rule of law counts. Don't demean it to try to score points on an internet message board.

people like me who don’t buy your BS if this is such a democracy how come Brexit is being reversed err err we didn’t have the info err err it was leave lies ! Democracy my arse ..

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:49 am

SmudgetheClaret wrote:It was a media wound up attack to discredit Leadsome you really are naive beyond belief..

So the media made her say it?

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:50 am

SmudgetheClaret wrote:people like me who don’t buy your BS if this is such a democracy how come Brexit is being reversed err err we didn’t have the info err err it was leave lies ! Democracy my arse ..

It's not being reversed.

Lord Beamish · Post by **Lord Beamish** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:50 am

SmudgetheClaret wrote:It was a media wound up attack to discredit Leadsome you really are naive beyond belief..

Did they manipulate Leadsome into bringing up the fact that she’d had children and that May hadn’t? That’s some going.

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:52 am

Lord Beamish wrote:Did they manipulate Leadsome into bringing up the fact that she’d had children and that May hadn’t? That’s some going.

Maybe they used mind control technology.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:52 am

Mad as a box of frogs.

But wants Brexit.

If I wanted Brexit, I'd be reading this board and seeing the sort of people who do and thinking "You know, I'm not sure they are voting for this for the right reasons"

Clarets4me · Post by **Clarets4me** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:55 am

In June 2016, Jeremy Corbyn lost a no confidence vote by Labour MP's by 172 to 40, with a 95% turnout, and he just ignored it ..... it still puzzles me how Labour MP's can in all sincerity ask for our votes at a General Election, effectively to put Corbyn into No.10, when they themselves have no confidence in him ....

Goddy · Post by **Goddy** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:00 am

SmudgetheClaret wrote:It was a media wound up attack to discredit Leadsome you really are naive beyond belief..

Is that you Donald? I wondered which 'soccerball' team you followed.

Mala591 · Post by **Mala591** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:03 am

All this turmoil is going to backfire against the Labour MP's who won't support May's very soft Brexit deal.

IMO the most likely result now, is a delay in the leave date and then a 'managed' WTO clean break Brexit.

Which is what I and 17.4 million others voted for.

martin_p · Post by **martin_p** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:06 am

Clarets4me wrote:In June 2016, Jeremy Corbyn lost a no confidence vote by Labour MP's by 172 to 40, with a 95% turnout, and he just ignored it ..... it still puzzles me how Labour MP's can in all sincerity ask for our votes at a General Election, effectively to put Corbyn into No.10, when they themselves have no confidence in him ....

Well no. They had a leadership election which he won.

Falcon · Post by **Falcon** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:13 am

The interesting difference here is under Tory party rules if May lost a no confidence vote by Conservative MPs she wouldn't then be allowed to run in the subsequent leadership contest.

SmudgetheClaret · Post by **SmudgetheClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:15 am

martin_p wrote:Well no. They had a leadership election which he won.

I would now love JC to get in that would be better than no deal ..

aggi · Post by **aggi** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:20 am

SmudgetheClaret wrote:It was a media wound up attack to discredit Leadsome you really are naive beyond belief..

Bloody media, reporting what people say. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/vi ... -may-audio" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:45 am

According to Sky, at least 110 will be backing her.

tiger76 · Post by **tiger76** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 11:55 am

FactualFrank wrote:According to Sky, at least 110 will be backing her.

127 claiming to publicly support the PM,(of course what they do in private is another matter),that's the latest yes she will win,but suggestions are that if she has 100+ not backing her her position will be untenable,she's a stubborn beggar though so i can''t see her resigning.

This vote makes it clear the Conservatives are split down the middle on brexit.

But then again so are the opposition so heaven knows where we go,even a People's Vote isn't guaranteed to clear up this mess.

KateR · Post by **KateR** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:32 pm

but that's the big problem all along isn't it, each party is split, the voters are split and we went in to a negotiation with a very weak hand since they knew we were split, we continue to debate facts and try to reverse them because they don't suit a personal agenda rather than what the majority (slender) actually voted for.

In my simple logic there should have been cross party talks, experts who have very clear and credible experience in multi-billion pound mergers/acquisitions and projects that required lengthy negotiations as a panel to work with, instead we end up with what we have, complete disagreement that will only lead to more arguments, opinions about everything and how everyone in the street could have done a better job.

I only hope that those MP's who have gone against there own constituents vote in terms of they said leave but have consistently supported leave or another referendum do not get reelected. I don't expect it to happen, just hope.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:54 pm

tiger76 wrote:127 claiming to publicly support the PM,(of course what they do in private is another matter),that's the latest yes she will win,but suggestions are that if she has 100+ not backing her her position will be untenable,she's a stubborn beggar though so i can''t see her resigning.

This vote makes it clear the Conservatives are split down the middle on brexit.

But then again so are the opposition so heaven knows where we go,even a People's Vote isn't guaranteed to clear up this mess.

142 now.

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 12:57 pm

154 now

dsr · Post by **dsr** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:02 pm

tiger76 wrote:127 claiming to publicly support the PM,(of course what they do in private is another matter),that's the latest yes she will win,but suggestions are that if she has 100+ not backing her her position will be untenable,she's a stubborn beggar though so i can''t see her resigning.

This vote makes it clear the Conservatives are split down the middle on brexit.

But then again so are the opposition so heaven knows where we go,even a People's Vote isn't guaranteed to clear up this mess.

Obviously not. It was a people's vote that apparently started the mess. The very best that another vote can do is make it a tie and "best out of three".

Damo · Post by **Damo** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:04 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:Not up to watching the Berlin Wall coming down perhaps, but pretty close.

It's funny you mention the Berlin wall. A wall built to pen people into a socialist state to prevent the will of the people.
Thank God they had the courage to kick it down

Lancasterclaret · Post by **Lancasterclaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:06 pm

Not sure its the will of the people anymore Damo

Thats kinda the whole point

SmudgetheClaret · Post by **SmudgetheClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 4:50 pm

aggi wrote:Bloody media, reporting what people say. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/vi ... -may-audio" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

That recording confirms it was a media stitch up leading questions and Leadsome was honest that's all..

gawthorpe_view · Post by **gawthorpe_view** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:51 pm

It would appear that May has told her MPs that she will go after Brexit anyway.

FactualFrank · Post by **FactualFrank** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:26 pm

183 of 317 say they'll be backing May.

ElectroClaret · Post by **ElectroClaret** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:00 pm

She's survived.

200....117

Imploding Turtle · Post by **Imploding Turtle** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:03 pm

Strong and stable.

ClaretAndJew · Post by **ClaretAndJew** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:04 pm

This will signal the end of Brexit