DCWat wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 12:45 pm

I enjoyed reading ClaretSpice’s perspective on transfers. Hopefully he’ll be back on soon.

Generous of both you and Bodge. Absence caused by nothing more than a family keeping my hands full - likely to be that way for a while!

I've always liked Delph as a footballer - does a bit of everything well. Theres always a worry when players are on their way down from an elite club in terms of whether they fit in/have the drive and his injury record is a concern, but theres no doubting his quality and the impression is his attitude has always been pretty good.

A quick bit of research reminds me he and Westwood played together extensively at Villa and appear from media reports to be (or have been) friends.

You'd have thought his wages would be a big issue, although 12 months before the euros perhaps game time is his biggest driver .

For what its worth I've always quite liked Davies too. Lost his way a bit, but same has gone tor plenty of players weve them signed and made something of.

Good to have you back on, Spice

Hasn’t Davies recently signed a contract extension

Bigvince wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 1:53 pm

Hasn’t Davies recently signed a contract extension

17 months ago

claretandy wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 8:52 am

Versatile is Delph, he would cover both full back positions as well as all the midfield slots.

Delph at RB???

Bigvince wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 9:48 am

Would revert to 4-5-1 when defending

So 451 all the game and 433 when we have a corner or set piece.

warksclaret wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 12:56 pm

You can see the reluctance of certain posters on here to go for Delph. I could understand that if our recruitment in general was at least as good as average PL sides in this area. However based on the last 2-3 years we are probably bottom or thereabouts in the PL recruitment rankings

The PL recruitment rankings? That's hilarious.

Reports suggesting now that Leicester want Tarks and we want £30m for him

warksclaret wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 12:56 pm

You can see the reluctance of certain posters on here to go for Delph. I could understand that if our recruitment in general was at least as good as average PL sides in this area. However based on the last 2-3 years we are probably bottom or thereabouts in the PL recruitment rankings

I know this is not an uncommon opinion but I just don’t get it. We’ve brought in Wood and Jay, Brownhill and even the likes of Pieters not many flops or over spending there. Compare that to just about any team and I would say we are near the top not the bottom of recruiting teams. Maybe Wolves are above us but they have an inbuilt advantage. I’d take our buys over the likes of West Ham Villa Fulham Palace Everton etc. Spending Lots of money is not a recruitment policy.

Hedontplayforyou wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 2:20 pm

Reports suggesting now that Leicester want Tarks and we want £30m for him

More bullshit for the gullible to get upset about.

£35 million just been paid for an unproven child...£30 million for a proven, high performing centre back with international experience? Add another 75% and you may be close..

Not much factoring in of just how cash strapped the club may be in some of these comments...

CFS wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 2:00 pm

Delph at RB???

A left -footed right back.

Still waiting for our new and improved scouting network along with Rigg to prove it's worth. Brownhill looks the part so that's a positive as is his age, not sure Delph makes any sense whatsoever given his high wages and his injury record.

Delph is definitely not what we need
Bernard I'd take and not Davies either .

Weren't we previously linked with Bogle from Derby?

Sky sports reporting Sheff Utd have had a £15m bid accepted for him and another lad called Lowe. Would suggest we either weren't interested or aren't in the market for a RB this summer.

Row Z wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 4:43 pm

Weren't we previously linked with Bogle from Derby?
Sky sports reporting Sheff Utd have had a £15m bid accepted for him and another lad called Lowe. Would suggest we either weren't interested or aren't in the market for a RB this summer.

Not looking for a RB this season when both of ours are in their 30's and out of contract next summer ?
It's called "forward planning"

jojomk1 wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:47 pm

Not looking for a RB this season when both of ours are in their 30's and out of contract next summer ?
It's called "forward planning"

Tbf, both Lowton and Bardsley are still good enough to play at this level, so next summer is more pressing than this.

We'll certainly not be splashing out £15m on a RB this summer, especially as we have 2 on the books already.

Priority signings are CB, possibly X2 if Tarks exits, right sided midfielder to replace Jeff, and maybe another CM, ideally I'd like a right winger, but that's looking unlikely given the fact that Brady's option has been triggered.

If we get 3 or 4 of those positions sorted in this window, I'll be reasonably confident of sustaining another season at the top table, if we don't it could be a tough struggle to keep our heads above the bottom 3.

tiger76 wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 6:01 pm

We'll certainly not be splashing out £15m on a RB this summer, especially as we have 2 on the books already.

Priority signings are CB, possibly X2 if Tarks exits, right sided midfielder to replace Jeff, and maybe another CM, ideally I'd like a right winger, but that's looking unlikely given the fact that Brady's option has been triggered.

If we get 3 or 4 of those positions sorted in this window, I'll be reasonably confident of sustaining another season at the top table, if we don't it could be a tough struggle to keep our heads above the bottom 3.

Echo this.

The problem with age is that no amount of sports science can successfully hold the ravages of time back. It can help with the monitoring of players, improving their injury recovery time and managing stress on the body, but if a body is in the process of failing then it fails.

Delph has had his fair share of injuries over the course of his career, but he has done pretty well over the last two years. However, he has had the benefit of playing a lot less. One thing is for certain he isn't going to get fitter and more resilient to injuries the longer he players and that should be a concern.

30 isn't the new 25, it is 30. When people talk about older players being fitter they sometimes forget to consider that the younger players have also got fitter. That is why the overall physical demands in the top league have sky rocketed and why the pace of play has become a lot faster. Our players may be fit, but I wouldn't say that any of them are quick. Advancements in sports science mean that players can expect to have longer careers, but if they can't keep up with the youngsters it might mean dropping down a level or two for those final years.

Experience can be a good substitute to counter pure speed, but when a players legs go or they spend more time on the injury roster their experience and the sports science department can do nothing to counter it. Sadly, it isn't a case of will a player fade, but when.

Putting aside any fitness concerns about Delph I'm not keen because of the financial implications. If we assume he is on 90K a week ( with two years remaining on his contract ) he isn't going to move to us for less money. He is still playing a bit for Everton, and playing a bit probably suits him in terms of eking out as many playing years as he can.

So we would have to cover the difference in his wages at least. That could be a 1-5 -2m shortfall per year. Now, if he comes here he will probably want a better arrangement than he is on at Everton. It could be a healthy sign on fee or it could be the expectation of more game time. The former would bump up his price and the latter would put at least one big wage earner on our bench. I doubt that he will go through the inconvenience of upping sticks and moving to gain an equal or lesser deal.

For me, the bigger problem is our overall finances. We only managed to post a small profit last year because of the outstanding money owed to us from past transfers. With the recent departure of a few relatively big earners ( but nobody, except maybe Hart, in the earning range of Delph ) we have some money to play with.

However, if we allocate all of those wages to new in-comings we will be back in the same position, but without the positive transfer income. Covid will have hit us, although not as bad as it could, and the collapse of the Chinese TV deal could lower our revenue. The net result is that we will probably post a loss for the coming season.

Now, if we are optimistic and say that we have 30m in spare cash floating around a big chunk of that could be spent on players in this window. Fantastic, everything is sorted, except it isn't or at least it shouldn't be. Adding more older players to the squad might help us out in the next couple of years, but it could be the death of a thousand cuts.

Two years down the line we might find ourselves in a position that will require us to replace three midfielders, possibly two strikers, two defenders, two right backs, one left back and one winger. If we are still in the EPL what exactly will we use to fund the buying of 11 new players. Should Brady not sign a new contract this season we can bump that figure up to 12.

We don't need any more players in the latter part of their careers, swelling the same age range, we need players to carry the club forward into the future with potential resale value.

If we keep adding more older players to the squad the only short term outcome that I can envision is the sale of Tarks, Pope and McNeil in order to fund a massive squad overhaul. In addition to the cash we would also have the problem of finding players. At the moment we seem to be struggling to find and sign two or three new players, what would it be like if we needed eleven or twelve?

Has anybody seen the massive squad overhaul that Riggy masterminded for QPR, and the two that he oversaw at Fulham, along with the devastating impact they had on those clubs ?

Or what about the consistently poor recruitment that swallowed up all of the parachute payments Middlesbrough received after relegation from the top table. Their revolving door policy of signing average players for excessively large sums, who rarely lasted more than a season before they were moved on, is one of the reasons they now have a poor lower tier Championship squad and no cash.

I'm mentioning Middlesbrough because the majority of our new statistical scouting personnel used to be with their failed Rockliffe recruitment team.

I'm sorry to come across as being negative again, but if we want to make steady forward progress then we need to bring in quality younger players. If we can't afford domestic talent then that means we need to look abroad. The mention of Santamaria actually got me a bit excited, but Delph would be another treading water until we drown type of signing.

A team is only as strong as its weakest link and at the moment our weakest link is our recruitment.

I'm tempted to think that the other clubs have worked that one out. Burnley are a very tough nut to crack, they have an excellent manager, excellent playing staff, a framework that makes them difficult to break down, a united squad that give everything, committed fans that back the club and an under achieving recruitment team.

If we want to break them all we have to do is put their recruitment team under pressure.

They build out from a strong defence, so if we sign that Tarks bloke it will really hurt them and their recruitment team won't be able to replace a player like him in four weeks. Given they are currently struggling to fill the gaps they have just created in their squad that should be more than enough to tip the fine margins against them and push them towards relegation.

They added Peters to their squad last season. In their first run of matches they conceded a goal a game more than they do with Taylor on average. All the talk was how their stalwart defence no longer seemed like Burnley for the first 20 games. Adding a couple of extra assists to their output counted for very little and if he has to play with a weakened central defence their primary strength will become a major weakness.

I wouldn't be surprised to see us bring in one or two depreciating assets on high wages just so we can spunk a huge amount on a single headline grabbing young player. For my money, I would prefer us to spread our money around on three sub 10m young players with a bit of proven quality instead of throwing everything at one player.

If that is the case then Hopefully, it isn't a flair player for the right wing, because it would lead to us becoming soft in the middle ( like we were against Brighton ) and combined with a weaker defence we would be cannon fodder.

As for the 4-3-3 idea, it would mean three of our strikers sitting on the bench soaking up money and getting grumpy because they aren't playing.

And if someone can explain to me how it is good business to let a 10m asset walk out of the club for nothing, because an attractive contract offer and midfield playing assurances weren't put on the table until it was too late, and then pay a big wedge of cash to replace him with depreciating asset is good business then I'm all ears.

Nixon laughing at an Everton fans reply, pull the other one ( that was damage limitation ), he was laughing at us and rightly so.

jojomk1 wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 5:47 pm

Not looking for a RB this season when both of ours are in their 30's and out of contract next summer ?
It's called "forward planning"

I never really rated Bogle as highly as others seemed to, but Lowe is a very good player. Looking at Sheffield last season their weakness was that they were heavily reliant on Stevens and Baldock for width and making their whole formation tick. Had anything happened to either of them they would have struggled.

Bringing in Bogle and Lowe will solve that problem and they are both still young enough to develop in terms of their playing ability and financial worth. 15m is a snip to cover that weakness.

So far they have brought in a quality keeper and sorted their left and right back depth out. They aren't doing anything risky like trying to change the way they play, they are building on what they have and providing for their future. They might have a rich Shiek backing them, but their spending has been moderate and calculated. They did have something of a big splurge last season, but so did we the second time we came up.

People keep talking about the need to replace our two right backs, but Pieters will be out of contract next season as well ( albeit with the option of an extension ). So we might be looking for a left back next year. Had we brought in a younger player last season when we had the chance that wouldn't be the case.

Sheffield are definitely " forward planning " we seem to be content plugging gaps in a risky and haphazard manner.

We could get very lucky and get through the season without needing many replacements. Problem will be if we don't get lucky, and we get injuries in the wrong places.

Another great post LTL!
My favourite poster.
Keep it up

tiger76 wrote: ↑

Sat Sep 05, 2020 7:09 pm

Bonkers fee, and people think the European market is cheaper to shop in, he may turn out to be a good signing, but that's a big fee for someone unproven in a major league.

Again, its an entirely different european market to what we will be looking. We aren't going to be able to sign one of Europes bigger clubs top young talent are we?

He may well have been laughing at us Long Time Lurker, that's if you accept that is 'news' is true.
Given his recent track record, maybe we should be laughing at him.

superdimitri wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 6:26 pm

We could get very lucky and get through the season without needing many replacements. Problem will be if we don't get lucky, and we get injuries in the wrong places.

Everyone get ready to go shopping on Ebay, or out lamping ( the vegans can pick four leaf clovers ). We may need to corner the market in luck

Long Time Lurker wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 6:12 pm

And if someone can explain to me how it is good business to let a 10m asset walk out of the club for nothing, because an attractive contract offer and midfield playing assurances weren't put on the table until it was too late, and then pay a big wedge of cash to replace him with depreciating asset is good business then I'm all ears.

Nixon laughing at an Everton fans reply, pull the other one ( that was damage limitation ), he was laughing at us and rightly so.

Did we not offer Hendrick a new contract more than a year ago ?
As for “midfield playing assurances” is that something anyone else in our team has build into their contract or even a verbal agreement you are aware of ? Did Westwood have one of them when he spent the best part of 2 years on the bench whilst Hendrick was playing ?
You seem to make a lot of assumptions about why Hendrick left to suit your agenda against Rigg - but whatever contract we put in front of Hendrick will surely have been down to a combination of Dyche, Rigg and ultimately Garlick will be the person agreeing the amount we can offer.
Maybe rather than blaming Rigg for this Hendrick did what lots of other footballers do in running down their contract and getting their agent to sound out other clubs to pick him on a free and give him a far more attractive wage that we can offer and a big signing on fee ? And whilst I understand that is also making some assumptions it seems a lot more plausible to me than blaming some bloke who has nothing to gain from a first team player leaving.

Blades are interesting. They kept more or less the same squad for the first part of last year and did really well. Since then they’ve started splashing the cash. I would not be surprised if they ended up having a Fulham or Villa Like season after they spent big.

It is never easy to change the team. SD seems to have a feel for it or at least someone at the club does. 2-3 players every year rather than suddenly having 5-6 to integrate.

Blades are interesting. They kept more or less the same squad for the first part of last year and did really well. Since then they’ve started splashing the cash. I would not be surprised if they ended up having a Fulham or Villa Like season after they spent big.

It is never easy to change the team. SD seems to have a feel for it or at least someone at the club does. 2-3 players every year rather than suddenly having 5-6 to integrate.

You can say that again

some interesting point, 30 is 30 and not the new 25, love that one, Ronaldo and Messi must have been lying about age on birth certificates to be able to start play around 12, different people/players age in different ways, quite a few 30+ players I would have in the team for sure for the right price.

JH for me is no big loss but I don't really know, its just an opinion, however I'm fairly sure he was offered something and that was from professionals who measured his worth, he and his agent measured his worth as something different and he left, obviously (to me) the different valuations were not close.

SD has already said he is looking to bring 2 or 3 players in, we will see who and what benefit they will bring in the not to distant future, but if I go on past history they will be fine and so will BFC.

KateR wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 8:12 pm

some interesting point, 30 is 30 and not the new 25, love that one, Ronaldo and Messi must have been lying about age on birth certificates to be able to start play around 12, different people/players age in different ways, quite a few 30+ players I would have in the team for sure for the right price.

JH for me is no big loss but I don't really know, its just an opinion, however I'm fairly sure he was offered something and that was from professionals who measured his worth, he and his agent measured his worth as something different and he left, obviously (to me) the different valuations were not close.

SD has already said he is looking to bring 2 or 3 players in, we will see who and what benefit they will bring in the not to distant future, but if I go on past history they will be fine and so will BFC.

TBH, i'd rather SD didn't actually mention how many players he's looking to bring in. That sort of thing can have quite the effect round these parts if we don't get any in - and there's a chance we won't, unless we are happy to just take what is left at the end of the window. Before we know it it'll be "garlick out" and poison like that spreads like wildfire.

bobinho wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 8:20 pm

TBH, i'd rather SD didn't actually mention how many players he's looking to bring in. That sort of thing can have quite the effect round these parts if we don't get any in - and there's a chance we won't, unless we are happy to just take what is left at the end of the window. Before we know it it'll be "garlick out" and poison like that spreads like wildfire.

I think it works both ways.

Normally he's tight-lipped and fans are never really in the loop. And fans complain about it.

Saying we're interested in 2-3 players is better, but will still get complaints if we don't get them.

As it's a lose-lose, I'd sooner he mentions things like that.

KateR wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 8:12 pm

some interesting point, 30 is 30 and not the new 25, love that one, Ronaldo and Messi must have been lying about age on birth certificates to be able to start play around 12, different people/players age in different ways, quite a few 30+ players I would have in the team for sure for the right price.

JH for me is no big loss but I don't really know, its just an opinion, however I'm fairly sure he was offered something and that was from professionals who measured his worth, he and his agent measured his worth as something different and he left, obviously (to me) the different valuations were not close.

SD has already said he is looking to bring 2 or 3 players in, we will see who and what benefit they will bring in the not to distant future, but if I go on past history they will be fine and so will BFC.

"SD has already said he is looking to bring 2 or 3 players in, we will see who and what benefit they will bring in the not to distant future, but if I go on past history they will be fine and so will BFC."

Sean may well have said that, but what he didn't say, was how many players he expected to lose.

Only time will tell what really happens, but there's plenty of that left before the window closes.

Signing old players means there is no resale value. Very simple stuff. We don’t need to take it to the extremes of signing 21 year old but just mid 20s etc.

People suggesting Delph isn't good enough need to remember that most of our squad has come from the Championship or below. Signing Ashley Westwood was greeted with the same sort of welcome and that didn't work out too bad did it.

KefkaClaret wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 8:25 pm

Signing old players means there is no resale value. Very simple stuff. We don’t need to take it to the extremes of signing 21 year old but just mid 20s etc.

We don’t need a full starting 11 of players with a resale value. At the minute we have Tarkowski, Pope and McNeil in the team who would all go for big money. There is a balance to be had between young players and experienced ones which Dyche has used well throughout his time here. Plus we don’t know if any of our own youngsters might make the grade like McNeil has.

KefkaClaret wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 8:25 pm

Signing old players means there is no resale value. Very simple stuff. We don’t need to take it to the extremes of signing 21 year old but just mid 20s etc.

Signing old players may actually keep us in the PL. But we will struggle to make a profit whist doing this

My concern about Delph is his fitness level and why someone who has 11 seasons experience of playing in this league has played so few games in recent seasons and in his 11 seasons in the league averages about 16 matches/season?

Delph is a no for me. Ageing, injury prone & expensive - worst possible combination. That’s not to say it couldn’t be a master stroke, just that it’s too much of a risk for me.

Nothing against experienced players, or those with no sell on potential, just we should try and make sure they are free (to cover their higher wages) and not injury prone.

Another quiet weekend on incomings...

Wasnt it Delph whose rash tackle put Ash Barnes out for a year ?

Read the thread on the Everton forum a grand old team. A massive majority have no time for him whatsoever. Has done virtually nothing in the last four years, his injury record is abysmal and he’s a billy big ********, wouldn’t want him anywhere near this team.

I can't see Delph being a target, we all know the demands made on our midfield so someone with his injury record would be a disaster of a signing. His wages would also no doubt be far too high for us to take the gamble on.

Tom Davies on the other hand would seem to fit alot better and is unlikely to be on big wages given he came through their youth set up.

arise_sir_charge wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 9:02 am

I think Delph would be a great signing for us. He’d fit our system perfectly.

& our treatment table!

jrgbfc wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 11:12 am

For the money Delph would be on I'm not sure he'd be worth the risk with his injury record. Have we completely given up on having any kind of European scouting network?

Is that what is known as a rhetorical question?

Silkyskills1 wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 3:17 pm

A left -footed right back.

Hells bells, people go apoplectic on here about playing 2 right-footed CB's!

Row Z wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 4:43 pm

Weren't we previously linked with Bogle from Derby?

Sky sports reporting Sheff Utd have had a £15m bid accepted for him and another lad called Lowe. Would suggest we either weren't interested or aren't in the market for a RB this summer.

Saw Lowe 3 times on TV last season & he looked decent, thoughts anybody?

rob63 wrote: ↑

Sun Sep 06, 2020 11:28 pm

Hells bells, people go apoplectic on here about playing 2 right-footed CB's!

Sorry but you're wrong

People go apoplectic about playing 2 left footed CB's

I read this as Tarky shop windowing himself, and at times to the detriment of the club with comments like “I think any professional footballer can play a ball to his left-back, get it back and play it back to his keeper. The question is can he play under pressure? Which I believe I can and I proved it at Brentford. We don’t play as much like that at Burnley, but it doesn’t mean I can’t go into a team that plays expansive football." but may be I am reading too much in to it.


https://www.leicestermercury.co.uk/spor ... id-4490883