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Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:42 pm
by cricketfieldclarets
The most worrying thing about our window is that if we do succumb to relegation is how ill thought out our future plans are. From board and manager.
Go down and our ageing squad will lose what youth we do have. And youth is pushing it even with these: Pope. Tarkowski. McNeil. Taylor. And then many more will be out of contract.
Because we have been too tight to add to what we have. We will likely need an entire squad overhaul. All in one window.
I can’t believe how shortsighted we have been how obvious it’s been to anyone but the two in charge. On the pitch and in the board room.
Just have to hope that Dyche can work some magic and we can grind out enough wins to come 17th.
With no twelfth man. And a disgracefully short squad it’s not looking likely. Relegation would probably only be the start of our problems.
Where do we go from here? How did we even get here?
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:47 pm
by Bordeauxclaret
It’s a good question. Do we even have a strategy apart from expecting Dyche to perform miracles?
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:50 pm
by Spiral
I'm struggling to remember a time in the last decade where transfer windows weren't an absolute grind, our squad wasn't two windows away from being in need of overhaul, we weren't two players short of a settled squad, we weren't looking down the barrel of relegation (from Prem or Championship, take your pick)...basically all the things we are now and have been since forever; but we're quite clearly under a bit more stress this time because of the impact the pandemic is having on the game. Christ knows how we'd cope were we obligated to pay back debt owed to folk on top of all that.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:51 pm
by randomclaret2
Our problems now will be as nothing to next summers, despite what the happy clappers would like to believe. The refrain next summer will be " Oh but we've lost the Premier League TV money, what do you expect them to do ?"
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:54 pm
by DomBFC1882
cricketfieldclarets wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:42 pm
The most worrying thing about our window is that if we do succumb to relegation is how ill thought out our future plans are. From board and manager.
Go down and our ageing squad will lose what youth we do have. And youth is pushing it even with these: Pope. Tarkowski. McNeil. Taylor. And then many more will be out of contract.
Because we have been too tight to add to what we have. We will likely need an entire squad overhaul. All in one window.
I can’t believe how shortsighted we have been how obvious it’s been to anyone but the two in charge. On the pitch and in the board room.
Just have to hope that Dyche can work some magic and we can grind out enough wins to come 17th.
With no twelfth man. And a disgracefully short squad it’s not looking likely. Relegation would probably only be the start of our problems.
Where do we go from here? How did we even get here?
I liked this post and I had only got through half of it before liking it. Its farcical how negligent we've been in recent transfer windows. This is the season we go down and stay down
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:57 pm
by ksrclaret
It really doesn't matter anymore.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:59 pm
by Spiral
There are only so many ways you can say "we need a winger and a centre half" before you need to get a bit creative with the ways you say that, but I admire people's effort nonetheless.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:02 pm
by JohnMac
Anyone would think we had lost 12 players rather than two and suffered a few injuries.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:11 pm
by box_of_frogs
Get a Leon Cort type player in at the next window?
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:14 pm
by jrgbfc
Tbf there's been plenty of people on here pointing out that constantly signing 31 year olds is a recipe for disaster, but they're usually shouted down by the happy clappers. Going down with this squad would be a disaster.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:16 pm
by Spiral
Dyche has chosen to bring in plenty of banter donkeys in his time, lets be clear. Lets not pretend he's had these pensioners thrust upon him. Just this week he was celebrating the experience of older players.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:19 pm
by cricketfieldclarets
13 players out of contract next summer. We lost four this year and didn’t replace them.
At least 11 age 30 or over.
And those under thirty won’t be staying.
I hope I’m wrong. I hope Dyche And the players can work a miracle. The reality is even if they did we are still desperate for the future. That’s another reason why this window was so important not just for now. For future.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:21 pm
by cricketfieldclarets
Spiral wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:16 pm
Dyche has chosen to bring in plenty of banter donkeys in his time, lets be clear. Lets not pretend he's had these pensioners thrust upon him. Just this week he was celebrating the experience of older players.
Don’t disagree. It’s absolutely a two way thing.
The manager rightly thinks he has earnt the right to be backed.
The chairman rightly thinks we need to be cautious.
The reality is somewhere in between.
Dyche has earnt us our millions. But he has also squandered his fair share.
Just think how different it would feel. To fans and the opposition. If we had come out after that incredible run. United. Looking forward to the future.
It’s honestly more disappointing than the ‘dean marney injury’ window
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:25 pm
by warksclaret
JohnMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:02 pm
Anyone would think we had lost 12 players rather than two and suffered a few injuries.
We don't have 12 players to lose-that's the problem
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:26 pm
by Spiral
Reality is a matter of arithmetic, not will. I and a couple of others pointed out a few months back that Dyche was out of order for flapping his lips and airing his grievances in public the way he was because it creates division. People are now in 'camps' apparently, so there's that. I feel as defeated by this window as the next person, but Christ, look around at what's happening in the world right now.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:27 pm
by BOYSIE31
Lotus cheek having a medical at fulham
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:28 pm
by cricketfieldclarets
This also shows how fans who worry about foreign ownership have also been naive.
This whole charade is showing that the board from garlick to the rest first and foremost have their own interests at heart.
If they truly wanted the best for the club. If they truly wanted a legacy bigger than pound notes in their bank. They would invest this window and / or take a reduced offer that’s in best interests of the club.
Let’s say Garlick is holding out for £100m. More money than he could have ever dreamed of when he landed this position. And let’s say he is being offered ‘only’ half that. Unlikely as it may seem.
That’s more money than he could ever need.
Or investing In one or two players this window. To push us on or at least make us competitive. Again he is sacrificing a percentage of his future returns to Try and proactively protect the future of the club.
Of course it’s not that simplistic. And of course he wants a return. Rightly so.
But I don’t feel that Burnley fc and the future of are his primary interest.
Our most succesful manager and chairman of many years (if ever) are about to tarnish both of their legacies by being unable to put club interests first. And none of us are there to support the players and oppose the situation.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:30 pm
by expoultryboy
Not a good transfer window ( as usual ) , but we've just got to carry on . Last season after lockdown , we won 4 , drew 3 and lost 2 with basically the same squad as we've got now . Hopefully after the international break we'll have everyone fit apart from Cork and the emergence of Dunne and Benson is a plus . The alleged fallout between Garlick and Dyche certainly isn't good , but Sean's got to back the players and get that " no one likes us " mentality back into the squad . Utc
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:31 pm
by GandalfsBeard
This thread sounds dangerously close to criticism of the board, and I have been informed that if you do so, you aren't a real Burnley fan.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:33 pm
by BOYSIE31
cricketfieldclarets wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:42 pm
The most worrying thing about our window is that if we do succumb to relegation is how ill thought out our future plans are. From board and manager.
Go down and our ageing squad will lose what youth we do have. And youth is pushing it even with these: Pope. Tarkowski. McNeil. Taylor. And then many more will be out of contract.
Because we have been too tight to add to what we have. We will likely need an entire squad overhaul. All in one window.
I can’t believe how shortsighted we have been how obvious it’s been to anyone but the two in charge. On the pitch and in the board room.
Just have to hope that Dyche can work some magic and we can grind out enough wins to come 17th.
With no twelfth man. And a disgracefully short squad it’s not looking likely. Relegation would probably only be the start of our problems.
Where do we go from here? How did we even get here?
[/qusayimg
I have been saying the same thing on here for 2 years but always get the dyche lovers slagging me off
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:36 pm
by kentonclaret
Look back at previous windows and there were many posters on here saying how delighted they were with the business that had been done, often rating the window as a success. We went in to many of those windows needing 4/5 players but often ended up with just 1 or 2. There were not many dissenting voices, and those that there were soon became drowned out by the club apologists.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:39 pm
by FactualFrank
GandalfsBeard wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:31 pm
This thread sounds dangerously close to criticism of the board, and I have been informed that if you do so, you aren't a real Burnley fan.
We're all Burnley fans.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:44 pm
by diamondpocket
I don't think Garlick has taken into consideration the chance that injuries do occur. It's true that take away our injury situation and we'd look a decent squad, maybe on odd player short here and there but pretty much every position covered. But have 3 or 4 crucial ones and we're up the creek. That's why this window is important but clearly getting a few off the wage bill and not replacing them was clearly the plan to save a few quid. The future strategy if COVID drifts into next season is to then sell off everyone we have: Tarks, Dwight, Mee & Pope will all go if not in the Winter then next Summer. God knows who''ll come in.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:49 pm
by GodIsADeeJay81
diamondpocket wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:44 pm
I don't think Garlick has taken into consideration the chance that injuries do occur. It's true that take away our injury situation and we'd look a decent squad, maybe on odd player short here and there but pretty much every position covered. But have 3 or 4 crucial ones and we're up the creek. That's why this window is important but clearly getting a few off the wage bill and not replacing them was clearly the plan to save a few quid. The future strategy if COVID drifts into next season is to then sell off everyone we have: Tarks, Dwight, Mee & Pope will all go if not in the Winter then next Summer. God knows who''ll come in.
He's been at the helm for a while now, I'm fairly sure he takes into consideration injuries.
However we had quite a few more than we normally get.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:51 pm
by kentonclaret
JBG and Brady are hardly ever off the treatment table.
Fingers (and toes) crossed for both players during a round of Internationals.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 9:59 pm
by agreenwood
There’s been no obvious progression in our recruitment strategy in recent years. “Bare minimum” has become the mantra.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:06 pm
by huw.Y.WattfromWare
FFS. The only player we have lost from last season, of any value to a match, is Hendrick. The rest got us to 10th and if Ben Mee had stayed fit it could have been higher.
This international break will bring more back into the fold.
Stop the fecking whinging and get behind the team.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:09 pm
by cricketfieldclarets
huw.Y.WattfromWare wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:06 pm
FFS. The only player we have lost from last season, of any value to a match, is Hendrick. The rest got us to 10th and if Ben Mee had stayed fit it could have been higher.
This international break will bring more back into the fold.
Stop the fecking whinging and get behind the team.
Top teams fail to defend titles when they don’t invest.
It’s the same filtered down. Don’t invest you go backwards.
Lockdown results were great. But they were a ‘false economy’.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:19 pm
by huw.Y.WattfromWare
cricketfieldclarets wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:09 pm
Top teams fail to defend titles when they don’t invest.
It’s the same filtered down. Don’t invest you go backwards.
Lockdown results were great. But they were a ‘false economy’.
I get that and agree with it but as I’ve said, many times on here, professional sport is like a tug of war. Everybody has to be pulling together. If Garlick and SD are having a spat we can live with that and SD is out of order raising it in pressers so often. When fans start taking sides the fragmentation begins and it only leads one way.
How often, on here, are we reading that Lowton, Bardsley, Long, Dunne, Stephens are not good enough? How must they feel if that gets back to them. As a fan I support any player that pulls on a Claret shirt for us. He is only there because the manager thinks he is good enough and that will do for me.
BTW 30 is not too old by modern sporting standards. With all the technical background the manager has access to he will know if any player is starting to show their age.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:22 pm
by diamondpocket
I don't think they'll give two hoots what they read on here to be honest. They'll be tucked away with their 30+grand a week nicely. They'll have had enough criticism over the years from managers, players, etc. to care what we think on here. We're behind the club, just venting some frustrations at what the situation is. We aren't not supporting the club by discussing it in a negative way!!!
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:26 pm
by Vegas Claret
usually I'd jump on a thread like this but I can't be arsed
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:33 pm
by Right_winger
You dont get anywhere by blowing smoke up someone’s arse. Once a problem has been pointed out and admitted can the said problem then be tackled.
The concerns have been there for a long time regarding our recruitment. It’s utterly shambolic.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:05 pm
by jrgbfc
Problem is Dyche knows the big rebuild will be some other poor sucker's problem. His main concern now is avoiding a relegation on his CV and ruining his next career move.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:11 pm
by tiger76
The problem isn't only the chairman, the only players we've signed in recent windows that you could say are building for the future is Brownhill & Gibson.
Relegation in itself doesn't bother me, what worries me more is how we'll cope in the Championship with an ageing squad, whether we stay up our go down we have loads OOC next summer, so either way we face a huge rebuilding job.
If we really are struggling for funds, why did we offer Robbie 'sicknote' Brady a year's extension, this is the kind of thinking I don't understand, and already just a few games into the season he's picked up another injury.
If we do drop down to the Champ, then the one glimmer of hope is that some of the fledgling youngsters might break through into the 1st team, and we may find ourselves with no choice but to thrust them into the fray next season, the brief glimpses we've seen of them suggests that they could cope with Championship level footy.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:52 pm
by diamondpocket
Brady probably got his extension because he's already in the building and the scouting dept hadnt identified a possible target in our range so was probably deemed the best option. But I agree after 2 years of no footy it seemed as strange idea. Maybe hoping we could get something back on him selling him to a Champ club maybe in Winter if we can find a replacement.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:41 am
by JohnMac
Glennon, Goodridge, Benson, Thomas and Dunne will be delighted to be part of our first team squad and if just two of these can become established that is fantastic.
Why bother with the expense of an Academy and a Development squad if all you have to do is buy players every window?
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2020 9:03 am
by TsarBomba
jrgbfc wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:05 pm
Problem is Dyche knows the big rebuild will be some other poor sucker's problem. His main concern now is avoiding a relegation on his CV and ruining his next career move.
This season is a free hit for Dyche.
If he keeps us up, it will arguably match our 7th place finish for achievement.
If we go down, then it will be because Dyche hasn’t been backed.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2020 9:05 am
by DomBFC1882
jrgbfc wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:05 pm
Problem is Dyche knows the big rebuild will be some other poor sucker's problem. His main concern now is avoiding a relegation on his CV and ruining his next career move.
Can't argue with that as we don't seem to have any plan moving forward
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2020 10:05 am
by boatshed bill
JohnMac wrote: ↑Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:41 am
Glennon, Goodridge, Benson, Thomas and Dunne will be delighted to be part of our first team squad and if just two of these can become established that is fantastic.
Why bother with the expense of an Academy and a Development squad if all you have to do is buy players every window?
Exactly this. Well said.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2020 10:13 am
by Colburn_Claret
randomclaret2 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:51 pm
Our problems now will be as nothing to next summers, despite what the happy clappers would like to believe. The refrain next summer will be " Oh but we've lost the Premier League TV money, what do you expect them to do ?"
You're confusing happy clapper, with someone who lives in reality. NOBODY, including the so called happy clappers, are happy with the situation we are in, only some of us can see that the board haven't created this problem, they are victims of circumstance.
If it wasn't for the dry powder store, we would be borrowing money from the bank now, just to maintain running costs. Infact in order to avoid going into debt, Tarks would probably have gone, and been replaced by nobody.
With no sugar daddy we cannot go into debt, even should that mean relegation. Some people are completely lacking a grasp on reality here, if they think going into debt is a good thing for the future of BFC. It doesn't matter what other clubs do, they aren't in our situation, so comparisons are pointless.
Of course its disappointing, but its the right thing to do, the right way to run a business in the football world where we have to live within our means.
If you can grasp that FACT, then you can stop banging your head against the wall, and stop hurling abuse at the board.
Will next summer be as difficult, probably, but at least we'll still have a club.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2020 11:06 am
by tiger76
JohnMac wrote: ↑Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:41 am
Glennon, Goodridge, Benson, Thomas and Dunne will be delighted to be part of our first team squad and if just two of these can become established that is fantastic.
Why bother with the expense of an Academy and a Development squad if all you have to do is buy players every window?
Heck of an ask expecting them to step up to PL level though, maybe we'll get a pleasant surprise, but apart from Dwight who else has come through our youth system in recent seasons.
And if someone like Benson is so highly rated, why did we bother signing Dale Stephens, his arrival will just make it that much harder for the likes of Benson to emerge, and he's yet another 31 year old sucking wages out of the club, and who's also got no sell-on value, plus on his early showings he doesn't look good enough for the PL.
I don't disagree we should where possible fast track the academy players, and that might be one good aspect of having a small squad, so let's see how much they feature this season, either on the bench, or even in the starting XI.
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2020 12:21 pm
by diamondpocket
Colburn_Claret wrote: ↑Tue Oct 06, 2020 10:13 am
You're confusing happy clapper, with someone who lives in reality. NOBODY, including the so called happy clappers, are happy with the situation we are in, only some of us can see that the board haven't created this problem, they are victims of circumstance.
If it wasn't for the dry powder store, we would be borrowing money from the bank now, just to maintain running costs. Infact in order to avoid going into debt, Tarks would probably have gone, and been replaced by nobody.
With no sugar daddy we cannot go into debt, even should that mean relegation. Some people are completely lacking a grasp on reality here, if they think going into debt is a good thing for the future of BFC. It doesn't matter what other clubs do, they aren't in our situation, so comparisons are pointless.
Of course its disappointing, but its the right thing to do, the right way to run a business in the football world where we have to live within our means.
If you can grasp that FACT, then you can stop banging your head against the wall, and stop hurling abuse at the board.
Will next summer be as difficult, probably, but at least we'll still have a club.
Yeah, because if we get into a little 10 million debt this year then even with relegation then we won't have a club next summer! Yeah right, that's with your reality goggles on, too!
Re: Future strategy
Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:50 pm
by Indecisive
Can’t help feeling there was an attempt at a change in strategy when Mike Rigg was brought in. I always assumed that was a move that would have been welcomed by Dyche, as we looked to refine and develop a wider recruitment network.
However, I have heard rumours that it wasn’t a widely discussed appointment, rather a unilateral decision made by the chairman. Could that have been both the start of a souring relationship between manager and chairman... and also a point at which effective recruitment has gone the other way?
I’m not saying who is to blame, but there does feel to be a negative cloud lingering over the Turf right now.