Arijanet Muric

[claretgimmer]

Nobody was stopping that shot tonight so I certainly won`t be holding that against him, yes some of his distribution was a bit indifferent but so is Traffords so no difference there, his commanding of the area when collecting crosses was far superior to Traffords, his ability to move the ball quicker, to spot opportunities sooner , is what makes him first choice for me at the moment, the defence look more solid with him there, Trafford is much improved recently and will go on to make a good keeper but Muric should have the shirt at the moment.

[NewClaret]

It isn't a tough choice though is it ? If we are being honest. Muric will not be selected ahead of Trafford. No chance. It is pretty obvious now. Eighteen Millions reasons why he wont. Sadly

I think he’s not selected because Trafford is the better shot stopper and we face a lot of shots in this league.

[CoolClaret]

I think he’s not selected because Trafford is the better shot stopper and we face a lot of shots in this league.

Certainly face more if you struggle to get out of your own half.

[NewClaret]

I agree but genuinely not sure on the last point. Trafford is a great shot stopper but also has that knack of making it look better for the cameras or harder than it is, he's always at full stretch even when it's not that far over and gives it the salmon flop. Don't get me wrong he's been immense last 2-3 games but he knows how to look good.

Muric made a save midway through the second half from a snapshot, palms it with both hands strong right to his own man. Really top notch stop that he puts in the perfect place afterwards (something Traff doesn't always do, he sometimes palms to trouble). Trafford makes that, it's raved about.

I think Trafford possibly is the better shot stopper but don't think it's as clear cut as some think. Though to be fair I think the distribution debate is tighter than perceived- Muric has a broader range and is capable of better passes at any range, but also has the capacity to do something utterly baffling, while Trafford has been cutting out the poor choices lately even if his accuracy isn't improving much- still can lose possession but not so costly.

I agree that Muric is a decent shot stopper too and deals with things differently. I thought it today where Muric stepped across and made a powerful shot look a routine save - I imagine Trafford would’ve acrobatically tipped it over instead. I dare say he might’ve tipped the goal around the post though.

Also agree Trafford’s distribution is getting better, so they’re getting closer in my eyes.

I hope we hold on to Muric though. He’s a real talent and one we should be nurturing better.

[spt_claret]

I agree that Muric is a decent shot stopper too and deals with things differently. I thought it today where Muric stepped across and made a powerful shot look a routine save - I imagine Trafford would’ve acrobatically tipped it over instead. I dare say he might’ve tipped the goal around the post though.

Also agree Trafford’s distribution is getting better, so they’re getting closer in my eyes.

I hope we hold on to Muric though. He’s a real talent and one we should be nurturing better.

Don't think peak Buffon gets near that shot to be honest. We've seen plenty times early season what happens with Trafford in for those - the same as any human goalkeeper.

Muric, like Zaroury and to some extent Benson, is I think a real victim of how extremely young our summer business skewed. In goalkeeping terms he's still a kid. Tons of growth potential which we saw happen last year. Said it before but it's not like football manager where a player's fastest growth is 18-21, and after 24-25 they basically stop developing. Especially when so many teenage wonder kids with potential stall or go backwards. Federico Macheda at 17-18 looked like the next Paolo Rossi.
To me playing those 23-25 year olds who can still develop, while using the 19-21 year olds as sub and cup stars makes the most sense for the model we're after, but it's another argument I'm tired of making.

[CoolClaret]

Don't think peak Buffon gets near that shot to be honest. We've seen plenty times early season what happens with Trafford in for those - the same as any human goalkeeper.

Muric, like Zaroury and to some extent Benson, is I think a real victim of how extremely young our summer business skewed. In goalkeeping terms he's still a kid. Tons of growth potential which we saw happen last year. Said it before but it's not like football manager where a player's fastest growth is 18-21, and after 24-25 they basically stop developing. Especially when so many teenage wonder kids with potential stall or go backwards. Federico Macheda at 17-18 looked like the next Paolo Rossi.
To me playing those 23-25 year olds who can still develop, while using the 19-21 year olds as sub and cup stars makes the most sense for the model we're after, but it's another argument I'm tired of making.

Agree with a lot you say spt!

Muric is still young and has stuff to learn - think he's played less/similar amount of league games than Trafford as well! Still could get better.

Must be said that some saves will look less 'impressive' with Muric due to his sheer presence in the net - he takes up an awful lot of space in there...

[Walkerpool]

I still love the guy.

[JimmyRobbo]

Gave the goal away and tried to pass another straight to their lad near the end.

I think he shouldn't have been dropped but I don't see him beimg any better than JT.

[Quicknick]

Muric is a very good goalkeeper, but the throw out resulted in the goal. Definitely his fault and had Trafford done that, this board would be in uproar. At least, sections of it would be.

[Carlos the Great]

The team plays better with Muric .. if Trafford has a good game it’s usually because the defence is having a mare and he pulls off a handful of saves

[Quicknick]

The team plays better with Muric .. if Trafford has a good game it’s usually because the defence is having a mare and he pulls off a handful of saves

That is a very difficult claim to substantiate with stats as he has only played in the cups.

[Newcastleclaret93]

That game perfectly highlighted why he was dropped by VK. He’s an absolute liability with the ball at his feet. Consistently gave the ball away in dangerous areas. Fortunately we were only punished once.

On the flip side he was very dominate in the box at coming for crosses.

But I can 100% understand why he was dropped after watching that.

[CoolClaret]

That game perfectly highlighted why he was dropped by VK. He’s an absolute liability with the ball at his feet. Consistently gave the ball away in dangerous areas. Fortunately we were only punished once.

On the flip side he was very dominate in the box at coming for crosses.

But I can 100% understand why he was dropped after watching that.

[Newcastleclaret93]

Come on cool claret you can admit it.

Muric was a headless chicken at times last night. You love that side of his game clearly as you refer to him as a mad man.

But clearly VK wants someone with a calmer head in goal. You can’t have that types of player in a relegation battle. He will give too many goals away.

[CoolClaret]

Come on cool claret you can admit it.

Muric was a headless chicken at times last night. You love that side of his game clearly as you refer to him as a mad man.

But clearly VK wants someone with a calmer head in goal. You can’t have that types of player in a relegation battle. He will give too many goals away.

Conceding 1 away at Tottenham?

Watch the balls drilled into midfield and the way we were able to stretch the pitch. Do that against the teams in and around us and we're absolutely laughing. They struggled getting the ball off us in the 2nd half.

[Newcastleclaret93]

Conceding 1 away at Tottenham?

Watch the balls drilled into midfield and the way we were able to stretch the pitch. Do that against the teams in and around us and we're absolutely laughing. They struggled getting the ball off us in the 2nd half.

Yes but at the same he gave the ball 2-3 times in dangerous areas and was culpable for the goal with a stupid pass.

They are all the incidents/reasons why VK dropped him.

That will likely be his last ever Burnley performance. So we can finally end this debate.

[CoolClaret]

Yes but at the same he gave the ball 2-3 times in dangerous areas and was culpable for the goal with a stupid pass.

They are all the incidents/reasons why VK dropped him.

That will likely be his last ever Burnley performance. So we can finally end this debate.

Because they're the tactics? Do you even understand what you're watching? Little bit of ring rust, and the goal wasn't a daft pass - we broke with that to Amdouni earlier in the half. Amdouni even asked for it to feet - the context of the game is one thing but if we go up the other end and score it's genius.

Overall the team play was much better. Had a lot more of the play in the oppositions half and moved the ball more effectively.

[RVclaret]

I think, somewhat ironically, the reason a new keeper was prioritised is in the ‘nickname’ given to him by CoolClaret.

[Newcastleclaret93]

Because they're the tactics? Do you even understand what you're watching? Little bit of ring rust, and the goal wasn't a daft pass - we broke with that to Amdouni earlier in the half. Amdouni even asked for it to feet - the context of the game is one thing but if we go up the other end and score it's genius.

Overall the team play was much better. Had a lot more of the play in the oppositions half and moved the ball more effectively.

Your missing the whole issue Coolclaret,

The “madman” part of his game is exactly the reason he has been dropped.

Top managers want predictability and calmness in net. They don’t want a keeper that makes dangerous passes and try’s Cruyf turns.

Fans like watching it as it’s exciting but ultimately that’s the big reason why Muric has never made a decent shout of it in a top league.

You won’t be able to see it because you love that side of his game but unfortunately that is his biggest downfall.

There were actually a few times in the game after a bad pass from
Muric where you saw VK shouting calm down.

[CoolClaret]

Your missing the whole issue Coolclaret,

The “madman” part of his game is exactly the reason he has been dropped.

Top managers want predictability and calmness in net. They don’t want a keeper that makes dangerous passes and try’s Cruyf turns.

Fans like watching it as it’s exciting but ultimately that’s the big reason why Muric has never made a decent shout of it in a top league.

You won’t be able to see it because you love that side of his game but unfortunately that is his biggest downfall.

There were actually a few times in the game after a bad pass from
Muric where you saw VK shouting calm down.

Aye and it's been working so great for us with the big changes to the team early season hasn't it? Not like we've ponged for a good 15 out of 20 games.

Much better team performance for me.

[Newcastleclaret93]

Aye and it's been working so great for us with the big changes to the team early season hasn't it? Not like we've ponged for a good 15 out of 20 games.

Much better team performance for me.

Yes we have been shocking this season no doubt.

But it’s a team game and like I said on the post earlier Murics unpredictably is something no relegation candidate needs.

If he cuts out that side of his game he would be a good keeper and VK probably wouldn’t have signed Trafford. But it looks like it’s just his personality.

In all seriousness that’s likely to be his last game for us.

[Nori1958]

Because they're the tactics? Do you even understand what you're watching? Little bit of ring rust, and the goal wasn't a daft pass - we broke with that to Amdouni earlier in the half. Amdouni even asked for it to feet - the context of the game is one thing but if we go up the other end and score it's genius.

Overall the team play was much better. Had a lot more of the play in the oppositions half and moved the ball more effectively.

The pass out for the goal was stupid, they had just had a mad couple of minutes in our box with a few chances. The game needed slowing down and let us get back into shape, any decent goalkeeper having caught the ball would have fallen to the floor and allowed us to regroup, the last thing we needed was the ball to a player under pressure

If you take away his distribution, he had a good game, commanding his box and making some reasonable saves, albeit some resulting from his own poor distribution

[beddie]

He’s had no first team action for sometime but I thought he did really well. I’m usually nervous when the opposition are taking corners but with Muric in goal last night I felt much more confident. Trafford’s done well but Muric is far better at distribution and that could play a big part over the remaining games.

[CoolClaret]

The pass out for the goal was stupid, they had just had a mad couple of minutes in our box with a few chances. The game needed slowing down and let us get back into shape, any decent goalkeeper having caught the ball would have fallen to the floor and allowed us to regroup, the last thing we needed was the ball to a player under pressure

If you take away his distribution, he had a good game, commanding his box and making some reasonable saves, albeit some resulting from his own poor distribution

Wanted to grab a win - who wants a replay?

I think some on here can't appreciate that football is complimentary - it's far more than one off bits of play. The entire team looked so much more comfortable and capable of passing the ball around at speed and getting forward.

We literally just went to Spurs with a two man midfield of Cullen and Ramsey and ran them ragged. C'mon? Better finishing from Amdouni and thats a historic win away from home.

[RVclaret]

Wanted to grab a win - who wants a replay?

I think some on here can't appreciate that football is complimentary - it's far more than one off bits of play. The entire team looked so much more comfortable and capable of passing the ball around at speed and getting forward.

We literally just went to Spurs with a two man midfield of Cullen and Ramsey and ran them ragged. C'mon? Better finishing from Amdouni and thats a historic win away from home.

Ran them ragged is a bit of a stretch. It was a good team performance which we should undoubtedly be encouraged about, but we were also decent 2nd half v Liverpool and for the majority of Villa away (when Trafford was man of match / one of the best performers).

[Bordeauxclaret]

I thought we played well defensively but as for running them ragged?

[Nori1958]

Wanted to grab a win - who wants a replay?

I think some on here can't appreciate that football is complimentary - it's far more than one off bits of play. The entire team looked so much more comfortable and capable of passing the ball around at speed and getting forward.

We literally just went to Spurs with a two man midfield of Cullen and Ramsey and ran them ragged. C'mon? Better finishing from Amdouni and thats a historic win away from home.

Not once have I criticised the performance, I thought we played well, but the one off bit of play you refer to lost us the game
I think you will be the only person thinking we ran them ragged

[Newcastleclaret93]

Wanted to grab a win - who wants a replay?

I think some on here can't appreciate that football is complimentary - it's far more than one off bits of play. The entire team looked so much more comfortable and capable of passing the ball around at speed and getting forward.

We literally just went to Spurs with a two man midfield of Cullen and Ramsey and ran them ragged. C'mon? Better finishing from Amdouni and thats a historic win away from home.

I think ran them ragged is a bit of a porky pie.

They had the vast majority of possession. The most corners, most shots, most shots on target, highest Xg.

We had a good game with some strong performances. Suggesting we ran them ragged is just not accurate

[CoolClaret]

Ran them ragged is a bit of a stretch. It was a good team performance which we should undoubtedly be encouraged about, but we were also decent 2nd half v Liverpool and for the majority of Villa away (when Trafford was man of match / one of the best performers).

By 'ran them ragged', I'm alluding to the fact that we had them chasing the ball for large parts, and we moved it with some serious pace - something that we've barely managed to do.. and that was with a heavily rotated side.

We were decent against Villa - though I think a lot of that was Lyle's unreal performance and them playing that offside trap with a rotated defence.

Still to me think last night's performance is more typical of what we were under VK last year.

[Robbie_painter]

Don’t think there’s much between traff and muric myself.
Was a good performance from the young lads last night but we certainly didn’t run anyone ragged.

[taio]

Good performance last night that was comparable with some good performances of late. We did not run them ragged in any sense though.

[123EasyasBFC]

Yes but at the same he gave the ball 2-3 times in dangerous areas and was culpable for the goal with a stupid pass.

They are all the incidents/reasons why VK dropped him.

That will likely be his last ever Burnley performance. So we can finally end this debate.

Trafford also gives the ball away in dangerous positions and is nowhere near as commanding in his box, people talk like muric is 38 and no improvement, he’s 25 he could easily improve

[Newcastleclaret93]

Trafford also gives the ball away in dangerous positions and is nowhere near as commanding in his box, people talk like muric is 38 and no improvement, he’s 25 he could easily improve

I’m not sure I agree. He certainly doesn’t give it away as much in such dangerous areas.
Most of the time he gives it away from trying to go long to full backs.

Muric can get better but unfortunately I’m not sure his temperament will change. He’s so erratic

[wbfc]

He had a good game..the throw out to Amdouni is what Muric does ...

I have no preference to either keeper ....they are both okay ..but would buy another one if there were not more pressing gaps

[123EasyasBFC]

On Monday Night against Luton, if Luton’s first 3 or 4 crosses are caught by Muric they suddenly have to rethink their game plan. When Trafford is glued to his line they can then continue to pump crosses in the box, that would be my sole reason for Muric starting Monday.

Who would have thought a back two of O’Shea and Delcroix would look right at home against a big 6 side and it was all because they had a loud confident keeper behind them.

Trafford’s shot stopping in the last few games will mean he will continue number 1 but I think it’s incredibly harsh on Muric

[123EasyasBFC]

I’m not sure I agree. He certainly doesn’t give it away as much in such dangerous areas.
Most of the time he gives it away from trying to go long to full backs.

Muric can get better but unfortunately I’m not sure his temperament will change. He’s so erratic

Trafford has played some terrible passes to O’Shea and Berge in last few weeks and has kicked the ball out of play trying to find full backs so many times, muric picked out Odobert 3 or 4 times last night with ease.

Trafford shot stopping has meant there will be no change but it’s harsh on muric

[Cooclaret]

Why so serious BVK! It's just a bit of fun.

Aye a bit rough around the edges but Amdouni wanted that. Bloody entertaining though.

UTC

Some of your ‘fun’ doesn’t hit the mark squarely.

[BurnleyFC]

The goal was on Amdouni. The quick play out from the back is what Muric always does - he gets us going.

Amdouni was trying to either nutmeg or knock it past Porro and it didn’t come off. He then jogged back after him at a snail’s pace.

[warksclaret]

I am not a Muric fan, but have to say he did well. One thing Trafford can learn from him though is that Muric the minute he collects the ball is looking to start an attack, and is capable of hitting some brilliant long passes. Trafford just deliberates for ages, almost teasing the opposition to take it off him, but by this time the whole of the opposing team are back defending. Cant the coaches see this, and for the first time in many years we now have attacking pace

[Cooclaret]

One left Man City for 4 million the other 18 million.

That tells a tale

[bumba]

Trafford has played some terrible passes to O’Shea and Berge in last few weeks and has kicked the ball out of play trying to find full backs so many times, muric picked out Odobert 3 or 4 times last night with ease.

Trafford shot stopping has meant there will be no change but it’s harsh on muric

It won't change VK has made his mind up but Muric's shot stopping last night was better than Traffords, Everything he saved he pushed out to the wings away from danger. Trafford has an habit of pushing it back towards the penalty spot

[taio]

It's a fairly close call between Trafford and Muric - a case can be made for either. I don't know why some people can't just leave it at that rather than trying to be so divisive. Both have strengths but also a careless mistake in them - as we have seen with Trafford and we saw last night with Muric for Spurs' goal.

[Newcastleclaret93]

I am not a Muric fan, but have to say he did well. One thing Trafford can learn from him though is that Muric the minute he collects the ball is looking to start an attack, and is capable of hitting some brilliant long passes. Trafford just deliberates for ages, almost teasing the opposition to take it off him, but by this time the whole of the opposing team are back defending. Cant the coaches see this, and for the first time in many years we now have attacking pace

I am very confident that is exactly what VK doesn’t like about Muric and exactly what he does like about Trafford.

It’s that kind of behaviour that led to us losing the game last night

[123EasyasBFC]

One left Man City for 4 million the other 18 million.

That tells a tale

That means absolutely nothing, we paid 2m for koleosho and 15m for Tresor

[Swizzlestick]

One left Man City for 4 million the other 18 million.

That tells a tale

I don’t think it tells us anything other than we’ve seemingly overpaid for one of them at the moment.

Who would you rather see play in this team - Tresor, who’s going to cost us £18m, or Koleosho, who cost us £3m?

[bumba]

The pass out for the goal was stupid, they had just had a mad couple of minutes in our box with a few chances. The game needed slowing down and let us get back into shape, any decent goalkeeper having caught the ball would have fallen to the floor and allowed us to regroup, the last thing we needed was the ball to a player under pressure

If you take away his distribution, he had a good game, commanding his box and making some reasonable saves, albeit some resulting from his own poor distribution

Strange you blame Muric yet VK put the blame on others!
Sounds like an agenda

[123EasyasBFC]

I am very confident that is exactly what VK doesn’t like about Muric and exactly what he does like about Trafford.

It’s that kind of behaviour that led to us losing the game last night

What have you seen that makes you think Trafford is calm, all I see in Trafford is a nevy young lad who obviously has talent. He’s 6ft 3 but looks about 5ft 10 when he is trying to defend from corners, muric is 6ft 6 and looks all of that 6ft 6

[Carlos the Great]

Strange you blame Muric yet VK put the blame on others!
Sounds like an agenda

You have explained the difference between Muric and Trafford really where Trafford slows the game down so much there is no clear pass available to any of our players and the opposition is set up .. Muric however has a wide range of accurate passing that can catch out other teams .. Muric didn’t have to make that many saves against a good team like spurs and how refreshing was it to see him cooly collecting from corners or high balls into the box … Trafford is nowhere near as good or confident with the ball at his feet .. I’d prefer Muric in nets against Luton

[StayingDown4Ever]

How good was it to see him come out to the penalty spot to claim a high cross? Trafford would have been back on his line ponying himself.

[Newcastleclaret93]

What have you seen that makes you think Trafford is calm, all I see in Trafford is a nevy young lad who obviously has talent. He’s 6ft 3 but looks about 5ft 10 when he is trying to defend from corners, muric is 6ft 6 and looks all of that 6ft 6

I think in comparison to Muric he’s incredibly calm. Muric is erratic he does things that can’t be predicted.

Whilst everyone was raving in the first half all I thought was we looked so shaky at the back, and a lot of that was because Muric was putting players (that aren’t good enough to play this way) under a lot of pressure with poor passes. The one that stood out to me was a hospital pass to Ramsey in the first half (on the edge of our box) where Kulevski was touch tight to him.

That kind of pass is because he’s erratic.

If I’m honest I’m not sure there’s a lot between the two keepers but after last night I totally understand why VK dropped Muric.