Be a surprise if he left with new owners and potentially more financial backing.
ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
If the relationship between Dyche and Garlick is the main reason MG wants to sell then I am disgusted.
If ALK are talking to SD before owning the club then I'm doubly disgusted.
If ALK are talking to SD before owning the club then I'm doubly disgusted.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Absolutely true that it would be highly unprofessional, but it goes on in the murky world of capitalism. It would also not surprise me if it were Dyche who in some way introduced ALK to the club since they tried to buy Sheffield and he’s good mates with Wilder (not saying he made the formal introduction - “Mike, meet Alan, I’d like him to buy your shares” - just ensured one took place).Rileybobs wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:11 pmIt would be extremely unprofessional for both parties to be communicating sensitive, and confidential information, behind the backs of the current owners and for that reason I doubt very much that will be the case.
I also think it's quite unlikely that the company set up with the name Kettering in has anything to do with Dyche's birthplace.
On its own, the Kettering company may be a red herring. But when you consider the Calder Vale company, they clearly have a track record of creating company names with a historical link. Of all the names they could choose, including entirely mundane nuances of ALK Capital, I find it very hard to believe it was chosen by complete coincidence!
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I wouldn’t, think the only reason he stays is that no other jobs available and obviously if Garlick goes .Steve-Harpers-perm wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:47 pmBe a surprise if he left with new owners and potentially more financial backing.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I'm not trying to be rude, but where are some of you getting these crazy ideas from? You think that Dyche may have been involved in introducing ALK to the club because he's mates with Wilder?NewClaret wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:49 pmAbsolutely true that it would be highly unprofessional, but it goes on in the murky world of capitalism. It would also not surprise me if it were Dyche who in some way introduced ALK to the club since they tried to buy Sheffield and he’s good mates with Wilder (not saying he made the formal introduction - “Mike, meet Alan, I’d like him to buy your shares” - just ensured one took place).
On its own, the Kettering company may be a red herring. But when you consider the Calder Vale company, they clearly have a track record of creating company names with a historical link. Of all the names they could choose, including entirely mundane nuances of ALK Capital, I find it very hard to believe it was chosen by complete coincidence!
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Mike Garlick won't be staying in any significant capacity once he's sold his shares - other than as a fan.
It may be that MG is required to do certain things over the next few months, maybe through the end of the season, to assist the new owners "get set up" and assist towards the club remaining in the Premier League. It may be that the final price to be paid for his shares will not be determined until certain performance criteria have been met - such as retaining PL status.
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Hi bb, that's not the case. MG has wanted to find a new owner for the club for at least 2 years, getting on 3 years now.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:49 pmIf the relationship between Dyche and Garlick is the main reason MG wants to sell then I am disgusted.
If ALK are talking to SD before owning the club then I'm doubly disgusted.
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I don’t of any instances within football, but it is commonplace in takeovers in most other industries for buyers to lock-in key employees with shares/share options. No reason why it shouldn’t be applied in football.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Hi New, that's a little "wild" if you don't mind me saying. Wilder is an employee of Sheff Utd. Sean Dyche has similar position at Burnley. Neither of these guys are "in the murky world of capitalism" as you describe it. They are simply employees.NewClaret wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:49 pmAbsolutely true that it would be highly unprofessional, but it goes on in the murky world of capitalism. It would also not surprise me if it were Dyche who in some way introduced ALK to the club since they tried to buy Sheffield and he’s good mates with Wilder (not saying he made the formal introduction - “Mike, meet Alan, I’d like him to buy your shares” - just ensured one took place).
Ownership of business entities may often be in the world of "smoke and mirrors" and "cloak and dagger" - but, it's really not that "murky."
Mike Garlick will have had his representatives looking for new investors for a long time. They will have contact with other people who act for people who may have expressed an interest in owning a football club. That's how it works. All done "quietly" as it should be.
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
A very good reason why it shouldn't be applied in football is due to the potential conflict of interest. Another is the very transient nature of football manager's employment. There's a lot of ways that football clubs are different than other industries.scouseclaret wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:56 pmI don’t of any instances within football, but it is commonplace in takeovers in most other industries for buyers to lock-in key employees with shares/share options. No reason why it shouldn’t be applied in football.
And even if for some bizarre reason ALK wanted to give some shares to Dyche, why would this process form part of the purchase of the club? Surely the shares would be transferred once the club is in ALK's ownership. Like I say, the idea that Dyche is in some way involved in the takeover is ridiculously far-fetched.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Hi Rb, I agree, any discussion with Sean Dyche about compensation has to wait until ALK are the club's owners.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:03 pmA very good reason why it shouldn't be applied in football is due to the potential conflict of interest. Another is the very transient nature of football manager's employment. There's a lot of ways that football clubs are different than other industries.
And even if for some bizarre reason ALK wanted to give some shares to Dyche, why would this process form part of the purchase of the club? Surely the shares would be transferred once the club is in ALK's ownership. Like I say, the idea that Dyche is in some way involved in the takeover is ridiculously far-fetched.
The idea of giving SD some share options, possibly vesting over the next "5 years" may be a good way of aligning the new owner's interests with the key employee. If the club does well for it's investors then SD shares in that success with his options. Similarly, if SD chooses to leave the club and pursue new opportunities then he also gives up his options. It will be a way, as with other employers, of squaring the circle - we can only give you "big rewards" if the club itself is successful.
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I didn’t say he was. I said it wouldn’t surprise me if he was. That’s how introductions happen - people connecting their contacts to others. In this case, those with the interests and means to buy a PL will be very few and far between, so not at all inconceivable that an unsuccessful bidder for one club is introduced to another via those involved, then directed through the official channels. Although did hear that we issued a prospectus and had a broker too, so there were other official and more likely ways the two parties came in contact.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Well can’t think of a job available at the moment for him and he isn’t going to give a multi pound a year job up with new owners who want him to stay on.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
But Dyche and Wilder have absolutely nothing to do with the sales of their respective clubs. The idea that Chris Wilder introduced ALK to Sean Dyche, who in turn introduced them to Mike Garlick is honestly one of the craziest things I've read on here.NewClaret wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:14 pmI didn’t say he was. I said it wouldn’t surprise me if he was. That’s how introductions happen - people connecting their contacts to others. In this case, those with the interests and means to buy a PL will be very few and far between, so not at all inconceivable that an unsuccessful bidder for one club is introduced to another via those involved, then directed through the official channels. Although did hear that we issued a prospectus and had a broker too, so there were other official and more likely ways the two parties came in contact.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Garlick is not selling because of any problems he has with Dycheboatshed bill wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:49 pmIf the relationship between Dyche and Garlick is the main reason MG wants to sell then I am disgusted.
If ALK are talking to SD before owning the club then I'm doubly disgusted.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
That suggestion needs - some crazy suggestions coming out now on this thread
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
There are always jobs available for the right managers, Joey.
Let's not be naive enough to believe that his agent isn't constantly on the lookout, as are all good agents. The thing is, where could he guarantee to better himself?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Dyche would have been gone by now had there been any vacancies. Other than West Brom for a few hours recently there hasn’t been a Premier League vacancy in 2020.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:40 pmThere are always jobs available for the right managers, Joey.
Let's not be naive enough to believe that his agent isn't constantly on the lookout, as are all good agents. The thing is, where could he guarantee to better himself?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Just realised Alan Pace was a manager at Lehman Brothers
That went well !!!!!!!!!!!!!
That went well !!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
But I think he's been looking for rather longer than that, and I believe you may have alluded to that in the past (Palace?)ClaretTony wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:42 pmDyche would have been gone by now had there been any vacancies. Other than West Brom for a few hours recently there hasn’t been a Premier League vacancy in 2020.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I’d have done a bit more research before posting that. Then I’m sure you wouldn’t have posted it.HunterST_BFC wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:43 pmJust realised Alan Pace was a manager at Lehman Brothers
That went well !!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Very much so. I was mocked by some on here when I dared suggest there was a problem between chairman and manager.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:44 pmBut I think he's been looking for rather longer than that, and I believe you may have alluded to that in the past (Palace?)
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
And absolutely wrongly, if I may say so.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:47 pmVery much so. I was mocked by some on here when I dared suggest there was a problem between chairman and manager.
It's obvious that all these professionals are looking for their best options all the time.
I do sometimes worry that SD and his crew haven't become indispensable, and bigger than the club. I really didn't like SD sniping this summer.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Sean has been stitched up by the current boards reluctance to release funds to strengthen our team
The sooner we can get this takeover and funds for much needed squad improvements the better.
The money earned was a direct result of the best manager we've had and our dedicated support to push our team to greater heights .
The sooner we can get this takeover and funds for much needed squad improvements the better.
The money earned was a direct result of the best manager we've had and our dedicated support to push our team to greater heights .
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Not in my view he hasn't - the problem is because he and the chairman don't communicate. There were funds available.Woodleyclaret wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:02 pmSean has been stitched up by the current boards reluctance to release funds to strengthen our team
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
You could equally say that the faith shown in him while giving every penny the club has earned deserved better than him slagging off the board (albeit rather cryptically).Woodleyclaret wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:02 pmSean has been stitched up by the current boards reluctance to release funds to strengthen our team
The sooner we can get this takeover and funds for much needed squad improvements the better.
The money earned was a direct result of the best manager we've had and our dedicated support to push our team to greater heights .
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
If there was funds available why hasn't dyche took it ? Surely it will be better for his cv .ClaretTony wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:07 pmNot in my view he hasn't - the problem is because he and the chairman don't communicate. There were funds available.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Sean wanted what was best for our team and all he asked for was the tools to do an even better job than he has been doing with one hand tied behind his back
Asking for help off the board is a reasonable thing to do. Selling up and getting in new blood is probably the best option.
Asking for help off the board is a reasonable thing to do. Selling up and getting in new blood is probably the best option.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
That’s the thing , there’s been no decent vacancies, like I said and obviously it’s only my opinion he would be gone if there had been .boatshed bill wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:40 pmThere are always jobs available for the right managers, Joey.
Let's not be naive enough to believe that his agent isn't constantly on the lookout, as are all good agents. The thing is, where could he guarantee to better himself?
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
And left before the collapseHunterST_BFC wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:43 pmJust realised Alan Pace was a manager at Lehman Brothers
That went well !!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I certainly agree with the 2nd half of your post.
But let's be realistic here, SD has had almost total control at BFC; the training ground and complex being the obvious example. The money gets a bit tight and suddenly the board, MG in name, are some kind of "Scrooges" according to SD.
He has had backing beyond any other PL manager that I can think of
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
' 'Backing beyond any other PL manager that I can think of'..
you dont mean financially surely ?
you dont mean financially surely ?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
One interesting link to ALK's possible source of funds is an American billionaire called 'Jerry' jones who owns Dallas Cowboys, he has links to Dave Checketts who also, coincidently, has direct business links to Stan Kroenke at Arsenal.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
How on earth do you work that one out?boatshed bill wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:40 pmI certainly agree with the 2nd half of your post.
But let's be realistic here, SD has had almost total control at BFC; the training ground and complex being the obvious example. The money gets a bit tight and suddenly the board, MG in name, are some kind of "Scrooges" according to SD.
He has had backing beyond any other PL manager that I can think of
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
It's about time we had a new series of Dream Team
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
or Jossies Giants
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
By reading every available article and watching all available videos, and making my own opinion on them.
I may be in the minority here, but I'm by no means a member of the Sean Dyche "Love In", he's just like any other professional football manager and out for the best he can get for himself.
And, having said that, I think he's done a very good job....for a very supportive board.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Do you mean financial backing ?boatshed bill wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 9:18 pmBy reading every available article and watching all available videos, and making my own opinion on them.
I may be in the minority here, but I'm by no means a member of the Sean Dyche "Love In", he's just like any other professional football manager and out for the best he can get for himself.
And, having said that, I think he's done a very good job....for a very supportive board.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
To be fair I think they've given him as much as they could have.
He's also had the morale boosts of not being sacked when things haven't gone so well. That includes very poor runs and a relegation.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
You'd need to get Linda Block out of Corrie first
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Fair pointboatshed bill wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 9:24 pmTo be fair I think they've given him as much as they could have.
He's also had the morale boosts of not being sacked when things haven't gone so well. That includes very poor runs and a relegation.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
The point about the transient nature of the game is a good one and almost certainly the reason it’s never happened, but I don’t see any conflict of interest- share options are a good way of aligning interests. It is also possible they may have already made him an offer out of fear he may leave - most “ITK” posters seem to think he would have left already given the chance.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:03 pmA very good reason why it shouldn't be applied in football is due to the potential conflict of interest. Another is the very transient nature of football manager's employment. There's a lot of ways that football clubs are different than other industries.
And even if for some bizarre reason ALK wanted to give some shares to Dyche, why would this process form part of the purchase of the club? Surely the shares would be transferred once the club is in ALK's ownership. Like I say, the idea that Dyche is in some way involved in the takeover is ridiculously far-fetched.
I’m not for a minute saying this will or has happened, but I don’t think it’s a completely fanciful idea.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Wow so the takeover thread has now decended in to SD salary and benefits. For God sake let the ink touch the paper before we start second guessing them.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Fair enough points. But the only way I could see Dyche benefiting from being a shareholder is by taking a dividend. And considering how insignificant his shareholding would be I doubt that would be very rewarding. And that is assuming the new directors will be taking dividends as the current ones don’t. Of course the share value could increase, but as this is a limited company he would only benefit from this if the club was sold. Again I doubt this would be significant enough to make it worthwhile.scouseclaret wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 9:37 pmThe point about the transient nature of the game is a good one and almost certainly the reason it’s never happened, but I don’t see any conflict of interest- share options are a good way of aligning interests. It is also possible they may have already made him an offer out of fear he may leave - most “ITK” posters seem to think he would have left already given the chance.
I’m not for a minute saying this will or has happened, but I don’t think it’s a completely fanciful idea.
The bloke is reportedly paid a salary of £3.5m. I think any incentives are more likely to be provided through performance-related bonuses.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
If that’s the case, why did they fall out, if it wasn’t about funds for team strengthening?ClaretTony wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:07 pmNot in my view he hasn't - the problem is because he and the chairman don't communicate. There were funds available.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I absolutely wasn’t suggesting that at all RB
In my original post, I said:
“It would also not surprise me if it were Dyche who in some way introduced ALK to the club since they tried to buy Sheffield and he’s good mates with Wilder (not saying he made the formal introduction - “Mike, meet Alan, I’d like him to buy your shares” - just ensured one took place).”
I explicitly stated I was not saying he made the introduction himself.
To perhaps word that differently, I was saying it wouldn’t surprise me (i.e. not certain, or even likely, just not inconceivable) if the fact that he holds a relationship with a very senior person at SU played a role in an introduction taking place with BFC. Not directly through him, or facilitated by in some sort of “fixer” capacity, or indeed in an underhand/elicit way. And as acknowledged in reply, the appointment of a broker would provide an alternative more likely channel.
What I don’t necessarily subscribe to is that SD is “just an employee”. Again, it’s my opinion, but I think he’s far more powerful than he might have us all believe. By pure fact that he’s the highest paid person at the club signifies his importance, but if CT’s comments are correct and he’s had fund’s available but chosen not to use them. Why?
I could write a long list of questions on things that just don’t really add up based on what we know so far. I won’t, because I’m not a conspiracy theorist, and don’t really want to come in for more criticism, but I don’t think it would be completely outlandish to suggest there might be more to all this than meets the eye.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Oh? So not beyond ridiculously far-fetched then?Rileybobs wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 9:46 pmFair enough points. But the only way I could see Dyche benefiting from being a shareholder is by taking a dividend. And considering how insignificant his shareholding would be I doubt that would be very rewarding. And that is assuming the new directors will be taking dividends as the current ones don’t. Of course the share value could increase, but as this is a limited company he would only benefit from this if the club was sold. Again I doubt this would be significant enough to make it worthwhile.
The bloke is reportedly paid a salary of £3.5m. I think any incentives are more likely to be provided through performance-related bonuses.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
That's quite striking; a full calendar year and only one vacancy. I wonder when that last happened in the top flight?ClaretTony wrote: ↑Mon Dec 28, 2020 7:42 pmDyche would have been gone by now had there been any vacancies. Other than West Brom for a few hours recently there hasn’t been a Premier League vacancy in 2020.