Suggestions of MSD involvement from this slightly confused story https://www.clubdoria46.it/2021/02/01/c ... ele-volpi/Chester Perry wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:10 pmdeliberately did not mention them - if this is true then the finances of ALK are very highly leveraged, I have been tracking the Serie A finances more this season and their TV rights negotiations are not going to plan at the moment, and a portion of that goes to Private Equity of the top - all in the MMT thread
ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
just what have you been reading?IanMcL wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:23 pmA very prudent local ownership, running the club on a very tight financial basis, whilst putting money away for a rainy day...even with aspirations of replacing the Cricket field stand.
Then these same folk, stash their pockets with borrowed money, entirely at the expense of the club they invested in on a very careful basis!
The manager has been asking for a limited borrowing, against assets, to strengthen said assets.
Instead, that has been done, big time, with the winners being the former (mostly still present) directors.
That does not say much for Mr G or Mr B or am I being too harsh on them? What are they planning for their new excessive gains?
this was a somewhat flippant post but there is something in it that I suspect has a grain of truth
Chester Perry wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 1:27 pmThen there is the possibility that Mike believed the single most important thing was for the club to keep Dyche (it is a popular notion after all), which wasn't happening if he stayed in charge so he took the least worst option on the table
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
MSD are indeed invovled...Chester Perry wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:10 pmdeliberately did not mention them - if this is true then the finances of ALK are very highly leveraged, I have been tracking the Serie A finances more this season and their TV rights negotiations are not going to plan at the moment, and a portion of that goes to Private Equity of the top - all in the MMT thread
https://www.forbes.com/sites/suse/2020/ ... nterprise/?
Our problem is not so much that ALK is highly leveraged, but that the debt has been shifted onto the clubs they own. If it goes tits-up, they lose their reported £15m investment, we could lose our football club.
Last edited by scouseclaret on Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Interesting also that Italian Burnley can be bought for less than a tenth of the price.aggi wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:29 pmSuggestions of MSD involvement from this slightly confused story https://www.clubdoria46.it/2021/02/01/c ... ele-volpi/
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I take you back to my post on Italian football financesscouseclaret wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 2:45 pmInteresting also that Italian Burnley can be bought for less than a tenth of the price.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Well, well, well. It's transfer deadline day and ALK have bought a whole squad of new players and they've even got their own team. All for less than £20 million.
Exciting times.
UTC
Exciting times.
UTC
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
There was a time when I thought the interests of the club always came first to them (being debt-free, long-term future etc) above a massive financial remuneration. Ah well, things change, at least they’ve had a gigantic pay day. Pleased for them, it’s nice work if you can get it.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
On the ownership point it seems that Velocity Sports Limited owns Kettering Capital Limited which owns Calder Vale which owns BFC.Paul Waine wrote: ↑Fri Jan 29, 2021 5:51 pmIt's a great question.
Companies House lists Velocity Sports Partners Limited, with Alan Pace and others as directors. However, VSPL is not mentioned in the "person with significant control" filings.
Of course, we know that Velocity Sports Partners were reported as the entity acquiring BFC.
I've googled "Velocity Sports Partners" - there's a report in the Washington Times that reports the takeover.
My expectation is that Velocity Sports Partners is the name of a US entity. Who knows, it may be a US LLP. Maybe it sits above Kettering Capital Limited, either directly, or with one or more other entities. Maybe "persons of significant control" filed for Kettering is in the process of being updated - 26-Oct-2020 the filing says "The company knows or has reasonable cause to believe that there is no registrable person or registrable relevant legal entity in relation to the company." Maybe there is some information in the way 50,000 shares were allotted for £200 and 49,000 for £1795.918?
I'm assuming that "significant control" filings apply to non-UK entities.
Exciting times.
UTC
However, just to add to the fun, there is more than one Velocity Sports Limited! Velocity Sports Limited, a company incorporated in Jersey, bought the first 1000 shares issued by Kettering Capital. It seems highly likely that the additional shares were also issued to Velocity Sports Limited (Jersey)
It seems that there was already an existing UK company called Velocity Sports Limited, which appears unrelated to ALK. It appears to be a completely independent private company involved in the business of sports pitches and has no connection to ALK or BFC.
I have not attempted to dig into the ownership of "our" Velocity Sports Limited (of Jersey) and I am not sure what information is easily accessible for a Jersey company.
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Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
ksrclaret wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:16 pmThere was a time when I thought the interests of the club always came first to them (being debt-free, long-term future etc) above a massive financial remuneration. Ah well, things change, at least they’ve had a gigantic pay day. Pleased for them, it’s nice work if you can get it.
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
You haven't answered the question.ksrclaret wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:16 pmThere was a time when I thought the interests of the club always came first to them (being debt-free, long-term future etc) above a massive financial remuneration. Ah well, things change, at least they’ve had a gigantic pay day. Pleased for them, it’s nice work if you can get it.
Perhaps they believe that the new owners will act in the best interest of the club.
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
Well spotted Tall Paul, I nearly got away without answering the question. Damn. So close.
I don’t begrudge them a massive pay day actually, I said I was pleased for them. I would have preferred it to have been in better, more sustainable circumstances, but hey ho. Beers on John B at the next away match. Count me in.
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
You realise that they still haven't taken any money out of the club, right? If it has been taken out (and we don't know for certain if it has), it's been taken out by the new owners, not Garlick and co.ksrclaret wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:26 pmWell spotted Tall Paul, I nearly got away without answering the question. Damn. So close.
I don’t begrudge them a massive pay day actually, I said I was pleased for them. I would have preferred it to have been in better, more sustainable circumstances, but hey ho. Beers on John B at the next away match. Count me in.
The only way MG and co weren't getting a big payout on selling is if they took the club back into the Championship or lower and I'm sure nobody wanted that.
Last edited by Tall Paul on Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Meanwhile, has no one noticed that Kettering has got £98 million equity - and has had this £98m since 30th Dec 2020. The lacuna in the Sportico article is that there's no mention of the £98 million and yet we all know it exists because the Companies House information is in the public domain.
What Sportico gets right is "it's unclear how ALK would repay the loans...." We should all ask ourselves how often we would lend money to someone if we felt it was unclear how they could repay is. Then think, would MSD, with all that groups financial resources and expertise, lend money to a risky football club that may not be able to repay them. The answer is they wouldn't - which suggests that Sportico hasn't got their "facts" right - just as The Athletic missed out on the £98 million equity (unless they've amended their article now the Companies House data is in the public domain).
The directors of Burnley Football Club have a duty to act responsibly with their company's finances. Yes, they can make intercompany loans, but they can't make those loans if they don't have confidence that those loans can be repaid to Burnley Football Club. If you get this sort of stuff wrong as a director you run the risk of (1) being personally liable to other creditors and (2) being disqualified from being the director of any company for a significant number of years.
At the present time, we don't know all the details of how ALK has structured and will fund the club's ongoing investments. I recommend we all keep in mind that, just as with the common saw "if it's too good to be true..." the same applies "if it's too bad to be true, it is most likely not true."
Exciting times.
UTC
What Sportico gets right is "it's unclear how ALK would repay the loans...." We should all ask ourselves how often we would lend money to someone if we felt it was unclear how they could repay is. Then think, would MSD, with all that groups financial resources and expertise, lend money to a risky football club that may not be able to repay them. The answer is they wouldn't - which suggests that Sportico hasn't got their "facts" right - just as The Athletic missed out on the £98 million equity (unless they've amended their article now the Companies House data is in the public domain).
The directors of Burnley Football Club have a duty to act responsibly with their company's finances. Yes, they can make intercompany loans, but they can't make those loans if they don't have confidence that those loans can be repaid to Burnley Football Club. If you get this sort of stuff wrong as a director you run the risk of (1) being personally liable to other creditors and (2) being disqualified from being the director of any company for a significant number of years.
At the present time, we don't know all the details of how ALK has structured and will fund the club's ongoing investments. I recommend we all keep in mind that, just as with the common saw "if it's too good to be true..." the same applies "if it's too bad to be true, it is most likely not true."
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I thought I'd found something only to see quoon beat me to it and get it posted on here.
This is the article I'd found
https://www.calcioefinanza.it/2021/02/0 ... ano-volpi/
I was told they were buying another club in Europe but Italy was not the country I was given.
This is the article I'd found
https://www.calcioefinanza.it/2021/02/0 ... ano-volpi/
I was told they were buying another club in Europe but Italy was not the country I was given.
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
Yes I do realise that, but it could only have happened had the sale been approved by the previous directors. So it’s a bit of technicality for me, that.Tall Paul wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:32 pmYou realise that they still haven't taken any money out of the club, right? If it has been taken out (and we don't know for certain if it has), it's been taken out by the new owners, not Garlick and co.
The only way MG and co weren't getting a big payout on selling is if they took the club back into the Championship or lower and I'm sure nobody wanted that.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Should we expect an Udinese/Granada/Watford style relationship incoming here?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
NOT the £20m surprise purchase I was hoping for today!Paul Waine wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:12 pmWell, well, well. It's transfer deadline day and ALK have bought a whole squad of new players and they've even got their own team. All for less than £20 million.
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
At least that's our annual prestigious European friendly sorted.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
He's said in interviews that he wanted to partner with other clubs and I was told before Christmas that he was buying a smaller club in Europe although that fell through apparently.jedi_master wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:37 pmShould we expect an Udinese/Granada/Watford style relationship incoming here?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Well, a cursory examination of their squad by nothing other than Wikipedia says that we should be hopeful for the arrivals of Mbala Nzola and Giulio Maggiore.
We can send them Kevin Long to get some first team experience.
We can send them Kevin Long to get some first team experience.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
"Sounds like reports of an imminent purchase of Spezia Calcio, or any club overseas, is inaccurate, but Alan Pace explained when he was unveiled to the press here that he would like to explore the possibility of partnerships with foreign clubs"
Chris Boden
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Hi Android,android wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:18 pmOn the ownership point it seems that Velocity Sports Limited owns Kettering Capital Limited which owns Calder Vale which owns BFC.
However, just to add to the fun, there is more than one Velocity Sports Limited! Velocity Sports Limited, a company incorporated in Jersey, bought the first 1000 shares issued by Kettering Capital. It seems highly likely that the additional shares were also issued to Velocity Sports Limited (Jersey)
It seems that there was already an existing UK company called Velocity Sports Limited, which appears unrelated to ALK. It appears to be a completely independent private company involved in the business of sports pitches and has no connection to ALK or BFC.
I have not attempted to dig into the ownership of "our" Velocity Sports Limited (of Jersey) and I am not sure what information is easily accessible for a Jersey company.
Velocity Sports Partners Limited, Company No 12880579 was incorporated on 15th September 2020. Alan Pace, Stuart Hunt and Michael Lee Smith are the 3 directors. So, firmly linked to ALK. However, this company doesn't appear to be directly involved in Kettering Capital or Calder Vale.
Velocity Sports Ltd, registration number 132376, is a Jersey company.
https://www.jerseyfsc.org/registry/docu ... ?Id=397547
Unlike Companies House (UK), the Jersey Companies Registry (still) charges for reports.
However, accessible for the first time today, Companies House has a 3 page pdf filed by Kettering Capital re the new Articles of Association. This document is signed "For and on behalf of Velocity Sports Ltd." So, the link between Kettering and VSP (Jersey) is confirmed on public record.
Exciting times.
UTC
EDIT: I should add that the 3rd page of the Kettering Capital pdf, which was signed "For and on behalf of Velocity Sports Ltd" has a footer: "Burnley - Shareholder Resolutions - Signature Page."
The "signature page" document is dated 22 December 2020.
There are near identical documents on Calder Vale's Company House filing. In the latter case, Calder Vale's signature page is signed "For and on behalf of Kettering Capital Limited."
Last edited by Paul Waine on Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I don't think it's a particularly good article but it does make reference to that in the article, it talks about them having first option on the parachute payments which lines up with what's on companies house.Paul Waine wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:33 pmMeanwhile, has no one noticed that Kettering has got £98 million equity - and has had this £98m since 30th Dec 2020. The lacuna in the Sportico article is that there's no mention of the £98 million and yet we all know it exists because the Companies House information is in the public domain.
What Sportico gets right is "it's unclear how ALK would repay the loans...." We should all ask ourselves how often we would lend money to someone if we felt it was unclear how they could repay is. Then think, would MSD, with all that groups financial resources and expertise, lend money to a risky football club that may not be able to repay them. The answer is they wouldn't - which suggests that Sportico hasn't got their "facts" right - just as The Athletic missed out on the £98 million equity (unless they've amended their article now the Companies House data is in the public domain).
The directors of Burnley Football Club have a duty to act responsibly with their company's finances. Yes, they can make intercompany loans, but they can't make those loans if they don't have confidence that those loans can be repaid to Burnley Football Club. If you get this sort of stuff wrong as a director you run the risk of (1) being personally liable to other creditors and (2) being disqualified from being the director of any company for a significant number of years.
At the present time, we don't know all the details of how ALK has structured and will fund the club's ongoing investments. I recommend we all keep in mind that, just as with the common saw "if it's too good to be true..." the same applies "if it's too bad to be true, it is most likely not true."
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Hi aggi, where are you seeing that information? I assume you are saying that MSD has first call on the parachute payments, if BFC is relegated? But, how does that mean that MSD's loans are repayable? And, that's without the debate that was going on last year that the Premier League wants to get rid of parachute payments. Do you think MSD would loan money on that basis, where there's a risk that there are no parachute payments?
It wouldn't get past any credit committee I've ever been aware of.
Exciting times.
UTC
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Reports from the Jersey Companies Registry are pretty bland too. No information on shareholders, beneficial owners, etc.Paul Waine wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:57 pmHi Android,
Velocity Sports Partners Limited, Company No 12880579 was incorporated on 15th September 2020. Alan Pace, Stuart Hunt and Michael Lee Smith are the 3 directors. So, firmly linked to ALK. However, this company doesn't appear to be directly involved in Kettering Capital or Calder Vale.
Velocity Sports Ltd, registration number 132376, is a Jersey company.
https://www.jerseyfsc.org/registry/docu ... ?Id=397547
Unlike Companies House (UK), the Jersey Companies Registry (still) charges for reports.
However, accessible for the first time today, Companies House has a 3 page pdf filed by Kettering Capital re the new Articles of Association. This document is signed "For and on behalf of Velocity Sports Ltd." So, the link between Kettering and VSP (Jersey) is confirmed on public record.
Exciting times.
UTC
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
They have a fixed charge over Trading Receivables and Other Debtors so that would include parachute payments (in the case of default obviously). I guess that would also cover revenue from selling players so that would also give some comfort that, in the case of default, they would recover the majority of the loan.Paul Waine wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:17 pmHi aggi, where are you seeing that information? I assume you are saying that MSD has first call on the parachute payments, if BFC is relegated? But, how does that mean that MSD's loans are repayable? And, that's without the debate that was going on last year that the Premier League wants to get rid of parachute payments. Do you think MSD would loan money on that basis, where there's a risk that there are no parachute payments?
It wouldn't get past any credit committee I've ever been aware of.
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Hi aggi, I agree all you say, but I still don't think MSD's credit committee would be minded to approve a loan to ALK/Velocity Sports/Kettering on the basis The Athletic and Sportico are suggesting. If MSD had already made the loan, before covid-19 impacted Premier League finances, before the Premier League suggested cutting parachute payments and for a purpose other than being part of the financing of a speculative punt at ALK buying Burnley Football Club, then, yes, I can agree that MSD would look for whatever mitigation was available to them. But, all these things had already happened before ALK acquired BFC and before a loan was advanced by MSD - and, at that time, Burnley Football Club's results weren't that great. It doesn't make sense approving a highly leveraged loan with the purpose of acquiring the club in those circumstances.aggi wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:24 pmThey have a fixed charge over Trading Receivables and Other Debtors so that would include parachute payments (in the case of default obviously). I guess that would also cover revenue from selling players so that would also give some comfort that, in the case of default, they would recover the majority of the loan.
We're not seeing all the picture and we are filling in the gaps with the wrong conclusions.
It would be great to get some more public domain info. Thanks for the bit on Jersey Company data - I knew it wouldn't answer all our questions.
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
A little bit of additional information on MSD.
On 15th Jan 2021, MSD unsecured loan note, EUR 24,023,813, coupon 7,779%, due 2030, was listed on The International Stock Exchange (TISE) Guernsey.
https://tisegroup.com/market/securities/12538
On 15th Jan 2021, MSD unsecured loan note, EUR 24,023,813, coupon 7,779%, due 2030, was listed on The International Stock Exchange (TISE) Guernsey.
https://tisegroup.com/market/securities/12538
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
That seems fairly standard practice for MSD, and the Dell family office moving it's capital around in a tax efficient manner to lend, they are taking a sizeable bet on football though so few players in that market from a (non financial institution) credit perspective, thy must have one of, if not the biggest exposure in EuropePaul Waine wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:43 pmA little bit of additional information on MSD.
On 15th Jan 2021, MSD unsecured loan note, EUR 24,023,813, coupon 7,779%, due 2030, was listed on The International Stock Exchange (TISE) Guernsey.
https://tisegroup.com/market/securities/12538
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Hi Paul, yes, I noticed Velocity Sports Partners Limited as an ALK company but we don't know where that fits with BFC at the moment, if at all.Paul Waine wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:57 pmHi Android,
Velocity Sports Partners Limited, Company No 12880579 was incorporated on 15th September 2020. Alan Pace, Stuart Hunt and Michael Lee Smith are the 3 directors. So, firmly linked to ALK. However, this company doesn't appear to be directly involved in Kettering Capital or Calder Vale.
Velocity Sports Ltd, registration number 132376, is a Jersey company.
https://www.jerseyfsc.org/registry/docu ... ?Id=397547
Unlike Companies House (UK), the Jersey Companies Registry (still) charges for reports.
However, accessible for the first time today, Companies House has a 3 page pdf filed by Kettering Capital re the new Articles of Association. This document is signed "For and on behalf of Velocity Sports Ltd." So, the link between Kettering and VSP (Jersey) is confirmed on public record.
Exciting times.
UTC
EDIT: I should add that the 3rd page of the Kettering Capital pdf, which was signed "For and on behalf of Velocity Sports Ltd" has a footer: "Burnley - Shareholder Resolutions - Signature Page."
The "signature page" document is dated 22 December 2020.
There are near identical documents on Calder Vale's Company House filing. In the latter case, Calder Vale's signature page is signed "For and on behalf of Kettering Capital Limited."
I just thought it was worth pointing out that it is Velocity Sports Limited in Jersey that is one of the holding companies for BFC and not Velocity Sports Limited of England in case anyone looks at the latter and gets confused as the English version appears to be unrelated to ALK.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Boden has now tweeted that the ALK/Spezia link is "wide of the mark".
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Thanks, Android. Your post is helpful. It prompted me to learn a little more about Jersey Companies Registry - or at least refresh my previous understand that it's not that easy to get good info on Jersey companies.android wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:53 pmHi Paul, yes, I noticed Velocity Sports Partners Limited as an ALK company but we don't know where that fits with BFC at the moment, if at all.
I just thought it was worth pointing out that it is Velocity Sports Limited in Jersey that is one of the holding companies for BFC and not Velocity Sports Limited of England in case anyone looks at the latter and gets confused as the English version appears to be unrelated to ALK.
I suspect Velocity Sports Partners Limited was set up before ALK had worked out the best way to organise their corporate structure. Whether Velocity Sports Partners Limited does anything in future, time will tell.
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Maybe we’re so rich now that Rigg’s scouted a player there and we’ve just decided to bid for the whole club instead? Keeps things simple.
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
That's an almighty nitpick.
Let's be 100% accurate about this. Mike Garlick, as owner of BFC, agreed a deal whereby a huge amount of money would be taken out of the club and passed through the channels to himself personally.
Mike Garlick, as current director of the club, sanctioned the withdrawal of all that money from the club in the knowledge that it would be passed to him personally.
There is a technical difference, but in all terms bar the tiniest legal niceties, Garlick has taken money out of the club.
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Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
I cannot agree with that in full, as a board member with a minority shareholding he has (according to reports) seen shares owned by former board members bought with club funds, he may or may not have voted for that, he may or may not have also know that was the intended approach of the new major shareholders, when they bought his shares - the same goes for all the other former board members - though they were in the position that Mike and John are in now - board members with experience but little real power.dsr wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 5:27 pmThat's an almighty nitpick.
Let's be 100% accurate about this. Mike Garlick, as owner of BFC, agreed a deal whereby a huge amount of money would be taken out of the club and passed through the channels to himself personally.
Mike Garlick, as current director of the club, sanctioned the withdrawal of all that money from the club in the knowledge that it would be passed to him personally.
There is a technical difference, but in all terms bar the tiniest legal niceties, Garlick has taken money out of the club.
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Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
Hi dsr, what you say can not be correct. I've no direct knowledge of BFC's cashflow position, but it should be obvious to all of us that if the Premier League tv money is distributed 2 or at most 3 times a year and BFC has got to pay players' wages every month, there will be periods when the cash balance is high, because the tv money has just been received. Equally, there will be times when there is very little cash coming in, but wages continue to need to be paid.dsr wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 5:27 pmThat's an almighty nitpick.
Let's be 100% accurate about this. Mike Garlick, as owner of BFC, agreed a deal whereby a huge amount of money would be taken out of the club and passed through the channels to himself personally.
Mike Garlick, as current director of the club, sanctioned the withdrawal of all that money from the club in the knowledge that it would be passed to him personally.
There is a technical difference, but in all terms bar the tiniest legal niceties, Garlick has taken money out of the club.
Exciting times.
UTC
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
I don't think it's nitpicking at all.dsr wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 5:27 pmThat's an almighty nitpick.
Let's be 100% accurate about this. Mike Garlick, as owner of BFC, agreed a deal whereby a huge amount of money would be taken out of the club and passed through the channels to himself personally.
Mike Garlick, as current director of the club, sanctioned the withdrawal of all that money from the club in the knowledge that it would be passed to him personally.
There is a technical difference, but in all terms bar the tiniest legal niceties, Garlick has taken money out of the club.
Pre sale Garlick and co owned an asset valued at £170m (say). The question is what is it worth now ALK own it?
Either MG and co have taken the £50m and ALK have acquired an asset worth £120m or ALK have effectively paid £120m for a £170m asset.
Has there been a distribution of profits or not?
Of course all this assumes the reports of the club's cash being taken out as part of the acquisition are correct.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
It's obviously a loan with a calculated risk of it not being repaid. You don't have an interest rate in the double figures if there is no risk of it being repaid. Of course none of us know what MSD's appetite for risk is.Paul Waine wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:36 pmHi aggi, I agree all you say, but I still don't think MSD's credit committee would be minded to approve a loan to ALK/Velocity Sports/Kettering on the basis The Athletic and Sportico are suggesting. If MSD had already made the loan, before covid-19 impacted Premier League finances, before the Premier League suggested cutting parachute payments and for a purpose other than being part of the financing of a speculative punt at ALK buying Burnley Football Club, then, yes, I can agree that MSD would look for whatever mitigation was available to them. But, all these things had already happened before ALK acquired BFC and before a loan was advanced by MSD - and, at that time, Burnley Football Club's results weren't that great. It doesn't make sense approving a highly leveraged loan with the purpose of acquiring the club in those circumstances.
We're not seeing all the picture and we are filling in the gaps with the wrong conclusions.
It would be great to get some more public domain info. Thanks for the bit on Jersey Company data - I knew it wouldn't answer all our questions.
Exciting times.
UTC
We're definitely not seeing all the picture and probably won't for a few years (if ever given the overseas companies that are cropping up) so we have little idea what are right or wrong conclusions.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Ha, worth bearing in mind. When I first found out that the ground had been sold off the company database I was using had mixed up Lionbridge in the UK and Lionbridge in the BVI with the result that when the local papers picked up the story they happily regurgitated that incorrect fact. In fact I think it ended up with Dave Thomas (author, not player) phoning the UK company up before it became clear that it was nothing to do with them.android wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:53 pmHi Paul, yes, I noticed Velocity Sports Partners Limited as an ALK company but we don't know where that fits with BFC at the moment, if at all.
I just thought it was worth pointing out that it is Velocity Sports Limited in Jersey that is one of the holding companies for BFC and not Velocity Sports Limited of England in case anyone looks at the latter and gets confused as the English version appears to be unrelated to ALK.
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
ALK paid £170m for an asset worth £170m including £50m in the bank. If that £50m has been paid out to MG , -ALK have loaned £120m for an asset now valued at £120mTall Paul wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 6:25 pmI don't think it's nitpicking at all.
Pre sale Garlick and co owned an asset valued at £170m (say). The question is what is it worth now ALK own it?
Either MG and co have taken the £50m and ALK have acquired an asset worth £120m or ALK have effectively paid £120m for a £170m asset.
Has there been a distribution of profits or not?
Of course all this assumes the reports of the club's cash being taken out as part of the acquisition are correct.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
It’s just a good job Mike did his due diligence and didn’t sell to those pesky Egyptians.
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
No they paid MG and other major shareholders £170m for which they got loans for £120m and used the Clubs cash funds of £50m.
The Club now has no funds and a debt of £120,00 on which the annual interest will be approx £10m
But it what all those calling for MG’s head wanted apparently.
Should have been more careful of what they wished for.
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
So you think the value of the club has decreased by £50m?
Bearing in mind that MG & co owned an asset worth £170m before the sale and now have cash of £170m and ALK had nothing before the sale and now have an asset worth £120m and a debt of £120m, who has had the benefit of that £50m?
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
The directors who were formerly very prudent and keeping our funds for a rainy day like relegation or a replacement stand?Tall Paul wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 7:38 pmSo you think the value of the club has decreased by £50m?
Bearing in mind that MG & co owned an asset worth £170m before the sale and now have cash of £170m and ALK had nothing before the sale and now have an asset worth £120m and a debt of £120m, who has had the benefit of that £50m?
All Mr Dyche was requesting was for them to use some funds or borrow a few quid, to strengthen the playing squad. They said they had to ve prudent. Now they use all the money and acrue debt beyond our wildest nightmare?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Interesting
Last edited by Milltown1882 on Mon Feb 01, 2021 8:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: ALK CAPITAL BUYS BURNLEY WITH AGGRESSIVE DEBT STRUCTURE, DOUBTS EXIST ABOUT THEIR ABILITY TO SERVICE LOANS
What has been a bit lost is that the club, as a company, can't just give that money away to the previous directors to pay for shares. If the club's bank balance (and I'm not convinced there was a £50m bank balance to be used) was used/is to be used to fund the purchase then there must be a matching transaction. Possibly a loan to somewhere else within the group for instance which means the club is theoretically owed the cash. The money can't just disappear, there needs to be a matching transaction somewhere.IanMcL wrote: ↑Mon Feb 01, 2021 7:55 pmThe directors who were formerly very prudent and keeping our funds for a rainy day like relegation or a replacement stand?
All Mr Dyche was requesting was for them to use some funds or borrow a few quid, to strengthen the playing squad. They said they had to ve prudent. Now they use all the money and acrue debt beyond our wildest nightmare?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Interesting post from Tariq Panja:
Interesting talk today about owners of newly acquired Premier League scrabbling around to raise £30m (by trying to sell equity stake at far higher valuation). Cash needed to repay debt owed to previous owner. Crazy business
All points to Burnley.
Interesting talk today about owners of newly acquired Premier League scrabbling around to raise £30m (by trying to sell equity stake at far higher valuation). Cash needed to repay debt owed to previous owner. Crazy business
All points to Burnley.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Fasten your seat belts...