Football's Magic Money Tree

This Forum is the main messageboard to discuss all things Claret and Blue and beyond
RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RVclaret » Sun Jan 15, 2023 3:40 pm

Interesting to see Chelsea give Mudryk (84m purchase) an 8.5 year contract. I take it this is their way to get away with FFP as the amortisation will be over the 8.5 year period, right?

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Sun Jan 15, 2023 3:57 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 3:40 pm
Interesting to see Chelsea give Mudryk (84m purchase) an 8.5 year contract. I take it this is their way to get away with FFP as the amortisation will be over the 8.5 year period, right?
exactly - previous signing this window was 7.5 years for same reason - expecting a few sales before financial year end to balance the books

The risk is the total cost with wages - if the player cannot be sold on, unless they are a huge success and perform at levels for the term of the contract

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Sun Jan 15, 2023 11:43 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 3:57 pm
exactly - previous signing this window was 7.5 years for same reason - expecting a few sales before financial year end to balance the books

The risk is the total cost with wages - if the player cannot be sold on, unless they are a huge success and perform at levels for the term of the contract
Thinking about this a bit more the length of these contracts are similar to what you see in America sports - which we know is different to Football in Europe and do not require transfer fees - In the US the Salaries are nuch higher so you would expect American owners of clubs at this level will be much comfortable with the annual numbers than we will be - particularly give their expectations as to potential revenue increases over that timeline

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:23 am

Swiss Ramble with a piece about something that is being highly anticipated in this part of the world- on substack so a much eaier read

The Impact of Promotion to the Premier League
Sweet Dreams (Are Made Of This)

https://swissramble.substack.com/p/the- ... email=true

I have archived this for future reading
https://archive.is/YgyDJ
This user liked this post: No Ney Never

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:29 am

Chester Perry wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 2:05 pm
Is the Premier Leagues Dream return to serious bidding rivals for domestic rights about to come true? - from the Mail

AHEAD OF THE GAME: Apple TV set to enter bidding war for Premier League rights

Apple TV are preparing a bid for the next set of Premier League domestic television rights that would transform the way the topflight is broadcast in this country.

The tech giant are looking to increase their live football coverage, with a 10-year contract to broadcast Major League Soccer beginning next month.

They have already dipped their toe into the Premier League market by making a documentary about the European Super League, called The War for Football, which was released yesterday.

The Premier League’s current three-year deal with Sky Sports and BT Sport expires in 2025, with the tender process for the next set of rights due to begin later this year.

Many clubs with American owners, such as Chelsea under Todd Boehly, are convinced that at £5.1billion over three years the current rights are undervalued and are looking to US tech companies to drive up the price.

A serious bid from Apple is the biggest threat to Sky Sports’ dominance of Premier League coverage since they gained exclusive rights to the competition in 1992, as they have the financial clout to challenge them.
...............................................................

Has anyone watched that documentary about the European Super League, "The War for Football" - it is on my to do list but not started yet
This dropped into my mailbox this morning - offers further hope to the Premier League - it is from Yannick Ramcke who does the Bundle Podcast from Unofficial Partner (the latest episode of which is here https://www.unofficialpartner.com/podca ... 23-preview and will talk about a fair bit of what is written below)

Hot - Take #7: Apple, Amazon, and Google going for Video Aggregation Primacy ... through Live Sports
https://www.offthefieldbusiness.de/sing ... ec46f309d5

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:41 am

Chester Perry wrote:
Thu Jan 12, 2023 4:02 pm
I am far from being totally convinced by this argument by Javier Tebas re the Premier League being financially unstable particularly as he is basing his arguments on results still impacted by Covid - we know what happened to the club that managed it's way sustainably through Covid (clue it is ours)

from the Guardian

Premier League ‘not financially sustainable’, says La Liga’s Javier Tebas
- ‘All clubs lose money’, claims La Liga president
- Tebas says English teams distort transfer market

https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... vier-tebas
Sean Ingle in the Guardian with something of a retort to Javier Tebas and his rant about the Premier League being financially unsustainable - again I am not totally convinced by this set of arguments, however much it looks promising for Premier League Broadcasting revenues currently

Premier League looks armour-plated, whatever La Liga thinks about its spending
La Liga president’s battle to rein in spending is on soft ground because England’s top flight is still on a firm financial footing

https://www.theguardian.com/football/bl ... ng-la-liga

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Mon Jan 16, 2023 12:00 pm

following recent talks with the Premier League and the FA, Rick Parry talks to the only people that will apparently listen to him - the media

EFL chief Rick Parry says regulator must have power over funding ‘reset’
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/64285556

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Tue Jan 17, 2023 12:41 pm

Jonathan Liew of The Guardian looks at the Everton situation and casts it in the broader light of what is happening to football - there is an element of warning here about how football clubs can dislocate themselves from those that feed them

Everton protests are not about money, they are about hope and connection
Fans have vented their frustration with banners and asked the players to show passion, but what will their efforts achieve?

https://www.theguardian.com/football/bl ... connection

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Tue Jan 17, 2023 12:54 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 3:40 pm
Interesting to see Chelsea give Mudryk (84m purchase) an 8.5 year contract. I take it this is their way to get away with FFP as the amortisation will be over the 8.5 year period, right?
Kieran Maguire gives his explanation as to how this spend has been achieved in the Daily Mail

SPECIAL REPORT: How CAN Chelsea spend £445m? Football finance expert reveals how £688m profit on sales - double ANY Big Six rival - and Todd Boehly's US-style contracts let them splash out and STILL keep within FFP
- Chelsea completed the £88m signing of Mykhailo Mudryk over the weekend
- It took club's spending to record levels this season after £445m splurge
- Questions have been raised as to how this complies with Financial Fair Play rules
- Mudryk has signed a 8.5 year contract allowing his fee to be spread thinly
- Chelsea have also made a £688m profit on player sales over the past decade
- These and other factors explain how Chelsea can spend and comply with FFP

https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fw ... s-FFP.html

Enola Gay
Posts: 646
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:55 am
Been Liked: 503 times
Has Liked: 583 times
Location: Galactic Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Enola Gay » Tue Jan 17, 2023 12:58 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 12:41 pm
Jonathan Liew of The Guardian looks at the Everton situation and casts it in the broader light of what is happening to football - there is an element of warning here about how football clubs can dislocate themselves from those that feed them

Everton protests are not about money, they are about hope and connection
Fans have vented their frustration with banners and asked the players to show passion, but what will their efforts achieve?

https://www.theguardian.com/football/bl ... connection
Liew has written some amount of twaddle in his time but that’s cobblers even for him.

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Tue Jan 17, 2023 1:20 pm

Enola Gay wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 12:58 pm
Liew has written some amount of twaddle in his time but that’s cobblers even for him.
I think the core context is on the button to be honest, which is why I posted it - there is plenty of fluff filling the column space but most of what we are hearing from fans up and down the country is about the loss of connection and hope - that is what came out in the fan led review too and what is behind initiatives like 'fair game' and much that the FSA does, even the protests against Super League covered this same ground.

think back to our own fanbase in the last years of Garlick - the hope faded and the connection was gone even though the club was financially strong - now they are consumed with hope and the club are juggling money like a superstar circus act. I anticipate that if and when ALK/VSL find new partner investors in their company - they will present returning money that they have borrowed from the club as new investment in the club. What's more I expect the vast majority of our own fans to believe it, particularly if we still have Kompany ball on the pitch.

GodIsADeeJay81
Posts: 14562
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:55 am
Been Liked: 3435 times
Has Liked: 6339 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Tue Jan 17, 2023 1:22 pm

There's some grumblings by the fans at WBA because the owners taken £5 million out but Simon Jordan stated it's because they're mid table in the championship that's making the fans agitated more than anything else.

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:16 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 1:22 pm
There's some grumblings by the fans at WBA because the owners taken £5 million out but Simon Jordan stated it's because they're mid table in the championship that's making the fans agitated more than anything else.
What we have witnessed at West Brom in the past few months is much more than a few grumblings - it would be interesting to speculate how they would react to our current situation though, given our owners have borrowed almost 29 times that from our club.

RicardoMontalban
Posts: 611
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:51 am
Been Liked: 288 times
Has Liked: 310 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RicardoMontalban » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:21 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:16 pm
What we have witnessed at West Brom in the past few months is much more than a few grumblings - it would be interesting to speculate how they would react to our current situation though, given our owners have borrowed almost 29 times that from our club.
There’s an interview with someone from Action 4 Albion on the Second Tier Podcast episode from Sunday. Admittedly it’s not the cutting edge of investigative journalism, but it certainly doesn’t give impression this is just some grumbling based on poor performance. (Despite what the Simon The Oracle Jordan may suggest).

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RVclaret » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:25 pm

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footb ... s-FFP.html

Kieran Maguire on how Chelsea are staying within FFP, which we touched upon at the top of this page

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:29 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Tue Jan 03, 2023 4:05 pm
The Athletic outlines the reasons why Radrizzanni is selling (he is making a handsome profit) and treads the familiar road of why money is all important - which is true even though some fight gloriously against the tide for spells such as ourselves, and with greater money (though still not enough) Brentford currently and Leicester until recently

Radrizzani is right: Leeds United need 49ers takeover to change their trajectory
https://archive.is/KBbSW
this is an interesting follow-up on the Leeds takeover from The Athletic - note also that like almost every, not just American, takeover in football, 49ers Enterprises is a consortium not a family.

Leeds, Radrizzani and 49ers sale: A tale of revenue, reluctance and relegation threat
https://archive.is/v0bbe

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:30 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:25 pm
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footb ... s-FFP.html

Kieran Maguire on how Chelsea are staying within FFP, which we touched upon at the top of this page
it is already further up the page

RMutt
Posts: 1066
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:08 pm
Been Liked: 373 times
Has Liked: 88 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RMutt » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:32 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 1:20 pm
I think the core context is on the button to be honest, which is why I posted it - there is plenty of fluff filling the column space but most of what we are hearing from fans up and down the country is about the loss of connection and hope - that is what came out in the fan led review too and what is behind initiatives like 'fair game' and much that the FSA does, even the protests against Super League covered this same ground.

think back to our own fanbase in the last years of Garlick - the hope faded and the connection was gone even though the club was financially strong - now they are consumed with hope and the club are juggling money like a superstar circus act. I anticipate that if and when ALK/VSL find new partner investors in their company - they will present returning money that they have borrowed from the club as new investment in the club. What's more I expect the vast majority of our own fans to believe it, particularly if we still have Kompany ball on the pitch.
The problem being, of course, that fans only moan about losing connection and football finance etc when its going wrong on the pitch. United fans wouldn't be that bothered about the Glazers if they were winning the league every year. Newcastle supporters have been pretty quiet about their new owners. Even our fans have become more sanguine because we're doing well.
These protests would carry more weight if they happened when things were going well on the pitch, as for example the protests about the European Super League did.

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:40 pm

RicardoMontalban wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:21 pm
There’s an interview with someone from Action 4 Albion on the Second Tier Podcast episode from Sunday. Admittedly it’s not the cutting edge of investigative journalism, but it certainly doesn’t give impression this is just some grumbling based on poor performance. (Despite what the Simon The Oracle Jordan may suggest).
What is interesting about the Albion situation is that there has been underlying concern for a number of years within the fanbase, is that this has only come to a head because the owner has not repaid when he said he would - so far missed 3 self-imposed deadlines. There is also a huge lack of understanding (even within the media) as to how modern football is structured financially and organisational at an individual club level.

the fact that this could be the last year of Premier League monies after 20 years has also got everyone concerned from the boardroom down - hence the MSD loan gamble to fund operational costs to get promoted.

It has to be said that the concerns at West Brom stretch back to when Jeremy Peace borrowed a similar amount to buy shares which he subsequently sold for a vast profit, and had the debt absorbed into the sale price. Peace was similar to Garlick in a number of ways, under his reign they were touted as the model club, fiscally very sound and infrastructure (including an excellent Academy) developed sustainably - when he recognised he could not compete financially long term he sold out to the Chinese consortium - they at least paid cash and did not put debt on the club

GodIsADeeJay81
Posts: 14562
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:55 am
Been Liked: 3435 times
Has Liked: 6339 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:40 pm

RicardoMontalban wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:21 pm
There’s an interview with someone from Action 4 Albion on the Second Tier Podcast episode from Sunday. Admittedly it’s not the cutting edge of investigative journalism, but it certainly doesn’t give impression this is just some grumbling based on poor performance. (Despite what the Simon The Oracle Jordan may suggest).
His point was if they were challenging for promotion or sat mid-table in the PL, the fans discontent would be far less than it is now.

It's the no hope, no excitement thing that was being referenced on here.
The wba fans can't see àny positives on the pitch so they're looking at the clubs finances and getting angry about that.

The same applies to Everton at present.
The fans wouldn't care about £500 million of signings if the club was sat in the top half of the table

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RVclaret » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:43 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:30 pm
it is already further up the page
Ah, missed that, cheers

RicardoMontalban
Posts: 611
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:51 am
Been Liked: 288 times
Has Liked: 310 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RicardoMontalban » Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:52 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:40 pm
His point was if they were challenging for promotion or sat mid-table in the PL, the fans discontent would be far less than it is now.

It's the no hope, no excitement thing that was being referenced on here.
The wba fans can't see àny positives on the pitch so they're looking at the clubs finances and getting angry about that.

The same applies to Everton at present.
The fans wouldn't care about £500 million of signings if the club was sat in the top half of the table
I get that that is Simon Jordan’s point. I’m just not convinced it’s a cynical and binary as that, and listening to the chap from A4A doesn’t change that.

The poor ownership and poor team performance are intrinsically linked and for people to trot out “but what about the Glazers” kind of misses the point about what’s different about WBA and United, and for that matter Everton. Of course Everton fans wouldn’t be moaning if they were top half, the massive investment would have paid off, but it hasn’t. But that’s not the same scenario as WBA.

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Tue Jan 17, 2023 5:26 pm

Sometimes you begin to understand why the FA pay prize money for each round of the FA Cup

The grim financial reality of football's lower leagues: How League One Accrington Stanley made just £2.99 profit from hosting their FA Cup second round tie with Barnet
- Accrington's managing director tweeted a financial breakdown from the tie
- It showed 1,532 paying spectators contributed £9,771.66 after VAT was taken off
- But Stanley then had to pay for stewarding, floodlights and medical costs
- They also had to stump up over £5,000 for Barnet's travel and hotel expenses
- That left a grand total profit of just £5.99 - which had to be split with Barnet

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footb ... arnet.html
This user liked this post: NewClaret

GodIsADeeJay81
Posts: 14562
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:55 am
Been Liked: 3435 times
Has Liked: 6339 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Tue Jan 17, 2023 6:13 pm

They had to pay for Barnet's hotel and travel expenses??
Has that always been a thing?

Cirrus_Minor
Posts: 4394
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:20 pm
Been Liked: 1156 times
Has Liked: 1282 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Cirrus_Minor » Tue Jan 17, 2023 6:30 pm

Billionaire Sir Jim Ratcliffe now poised to buy Manchester United.

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RVclaret » Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:20 am

John Textor has been a feature of this thread on recent pages for various reasons.

Now looks like he wants to float there new multi-club company as a SPAC.

Palace fans I've seen online are questioning where the money is for new transfers this month.

Link here to the FT article:

https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fw ... 469e543d6d

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Wed Jan 18, 2023 11:30 am

RVclaret wrote:
Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:20 am
John Textor has been a feature of this thread on recent pages for various reasons.

Now looks like he wants to float there new multi-club company as a SPAC.

Palace fans I've seen online are questioning where the money is for new transfers this month.

Link here to the FT article:

https://12ft.io/proxy?q=https%3A%2F%2Fw ... 469e543d6d
an archive listing of the same report -

New Olympique Lyonnais owners plan Spac listing
US multi-club business’s move would be a first for the football sector

https://archive.is/rsqE6

This is an intriguing one - as we know there was a surge in SPAC's with a direct focus on sports in late 2020 early 2021, which was widely reported. I remember an almost giddy level of speculation on this board, from one or two posters, about ALK being back by a SPAC. Less reported is that many of those SPAC's could not find what they thought was value in the market and so returned the monies to their investors and folded.

In America SPAC's have to declare their business area of interest at formation and then commit at least 80% of their funding to their first purchase, from this it would appear that that first purchase can be for a minority stake - this bit has surprised me.

When you look at the valuation of Eagle Holdings in this potential deal it seems wrong, significantly overpriced - yes Lyonais can be profitable (particularly with regular Champions League Football, but under the agreement with the Premier League and the other investors of Crystal Palace, Eagle Holdings must not give OL preferential investment. Palace are looking to spend a lot on ground development shortly. The other two are not really worth too much at all though Botafogo could grow strong under the reformed Brazillian League I have posted about.

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RVclaret » Thu Jan 19, 2023 7:00 am

https://theathletic.com/4104956/2023/01 ... lian-bank/

Leicester return to Macquarie to secure a loan secured against revenue for the 2024-25 season!

I’d be interested to know what the rate is on that.

They are currently in a relegation battle as it stands…

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:57 am

RVclaret wrote:
Thu Jan 19, 2023 7:00 am
https://theathletic.com/4104956/2023/01 ... lian-bank/

Leicester return to Macquarie to secure a loan secured against revenue for the 2024-25 season!

I’d be interested to know what the rate is on that.

They are currently in a relegation battle as it stands…
This is interesting on two counts

- the first as you say - their is currently no knowledge of which league they will be in - though if they go down this year most would expect promotion next - funded by the sale of the their star players. It would be reasonable to expect a cautious financier to look at the worst case scenario and Premier League earnings (via parachute payments at current rates) could be as low as £34m which means the loan value itself is likely to be relatively low possible £20m and certainly not above £30m
- the 2024/25 season is expected to be the first under the charge of an Independent football regulator and dependent on the powers given (and the agreements struck by the Premier League with the rest of the game including the EFL) there could be a seismic shift in earnings, solidarity payments (paid by the Premier League) and parachute payments (which may or may not disappear completely)

GodIsADeeJay81
Posts: 14562
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:55 am
Been Liked: 3435 times
Has Liked: 6339 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:01 am

RVclaret wrote:
Thu Jan 19, 2023 7:00 am
https://theathletic.com/4104956/2023/01 ... lian-bank/

Leicester return to Macquarie to secure a loan secured against revenue for the 2024-25 season!

I’d be interested to know what the rate is on that.

They are currently in a relegation battle as it stands…
Didn't Bolton and/or Leeds do something similar years ago, borrowing against future revenue? (Ticket or TV money) 💰

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:03 am

RVclaret wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 3:40 pm
Interesting to see Chelsea give Mudryk (84m purchase) an 8.5 year contract. I take it this is their way to get away with FFP as the amortisation will be over the 8.5 year period, right?
SwissRamble takes his turn at assessing whether Chelsea are breaking FFP rules - this is the substack version not twitter, which I have archived for future reference

Will Chelsea's Transfer Spend Break Financial Fair Play Rules?
https://swissramble.substack.com/p/will ... email=true
https://archive.is/g6B2v

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:07 am

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:01 am
Didn't Bolton and/or Leeds do something similar years ago, borrowing against future revenue? (Ticket or TV money) 💰
you don't have to look that far away - we did the same with Barclays after the 1st promotion under Dyche - it covered all 3 potential parachute years and expired in October 2019

Thankfully it didn;t impact us the same way - and wouldn't have done given our budget planning and adherence

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:21 am

An interesting latest blog read from long time fan activist, former Tottenham supporters trust board member, 'Fair Game' founder and contributor to the Fan Led Review - Martin Cloake

Sack the board
If fans want a say in how our clubs are run, we have to to be prepared to deal with the tough questions.

https://martincloake.substack.com/p/sac ... email=true
https://archive.is/JWSln

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:55 am

I said it was that time of year last week

today Deloitte have published their annual money league report - the 26th edition.

Premier League clubs form:

- 3 of the top 5
- 6 of the top 10
- 11 of the top 20 and
- 16 of the top 30

you can access it here

Deloitte Football Money League 2023
Get up, stand up

https://www2.deloitte.com/uk/en/pages/s ... eague.html

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 1:57 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:55 am
I said it was that time of year last week

today Deloitte have published their annual money league report - the 26th edition.

Premier League clubs form:

- 3 of the top 5
- 6 of the top 10
- 11 of the top 20 and
- 16 of the top 30

you can access it here

Deloitte Football Money League 2023
Get up, stand up

https://www2.deloitte.com/uk/en/pages/s ... eague.html
Matt Slater of The Athletic on that Deloitte report and the significance of what I pointed out from it - including a suggestion that it is just a matter of time before all 20 Premier League clubs will appear in the top 30, that comes from one of the authors of the report not Slater

Premier League clubs dominate Deloitte’s latest Football Money League report
https://archive.is/oAtx0

the chaps at Vysyble have long been critics of this reports focus and today without referencing it directly displayed their scorn with this tweet - my bold emphasis

'The curse of all curses is the revenue line'... the late Robert Goizueta, Chief Exec. Coca-Cola 1981-97. Achieved a 7,100% stock price uplift during his tenure.
https://twitter.com/vysyble/status/1616 ... 7ZpO0sAAAA

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 2:10 pm

Ron Gourlay the Chief exec at West Brom talks to The Athletic about the issues that have got the fams worried (those same fans appear to have faith in Gourlay btw) - it is well worth a look at

Ron Gourlay interview: Lai loans, protests, Corberan and takeover prospects
https://archive.is/JLc9p

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 2:14 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:03 am
SwissRamble takes his turn at assessing whether Chelsea are breaking FFP rules - this is the substack version not twitter, which I have archived for future reference

Will Chelsea's Transfer Spend Break Financial Fair Play Rules?
https://swissramble.substack.com/p/will ... email=true
https://archive.is/g6B2v
The Athletic has been looking at this too and have pursued the line of though I mentioned above
Chester Perry wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 11:43 pm
Thinking about this a bit more the length of these contracts are similar to what you see in America sports - which we know is different to Football in Europe and do not require transfer fees - In the US the Salaries are nuch higher so you would expect American owners of clubs at this level will be much comfortable with the annual numbers than we will be - particularly give their expectations as to potential revenue increases over that timeline
Chelsea’s long contracts: The risks and rewards of a policy influenced by baseball
https://archive.is/cjLhF

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RVclaret » Thu Jan 19, 2023 2:15 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Thu Jan 19, 2023 2:10 pm
Ron Gourlay the Chief exec at West Brom talks to The Athletic about the issues that have got the fams worried (those same fans appear to have faith in Gourlay btw) - it is well worth a look at

Ron Gourlay interview: Lai loans, protests, Corberan and takeover prospects
https://archive.is/JLc9p
Yeah read this before. Very interesting. Lai seems very ‘hands off’ with the club. Gourlay also seems confident they aren’t in trouble if they don’t go up… hmm. I do wonder how much they paid/pay for the ‘frees’ of Swift and Wallace last summer. I bet both are on big wages.

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RVclaret » Thu Jan 19, 2023 3:01 pm


Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 3:41 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Thu Jan 19, 2023 3:01 pm
https://www.pnefc.net/news/2023/january ... ighlights/

16.8m loss for PNE
The Hemmings family certainly dig deep

There are justifiable questions about management at the top - Risdale is broadly hated by the fans - as to how such sums can be continually wasted on poor decision making/recruitment (much like at others including Everton and those down the road) but it is possible to get a lot right and still not win promotion - only 3 get promoted, only 1 wins a cup.

RVclaret
Posts: 13836
Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2016 8:30 am
Been Liked: 3707 times
Has Liked: 2499 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by RVclaret » Thu Jan 19, 2023 8:08 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Thu Jan 19, 2023 11:03 am
SwissRamble takes his turn at assessing whether Chelsea are breaking FFP rules - this is the substack version not twitter, which I have archived for future reference

Will Chelsea's Transfer Spend Break Financial Fair Play Rules?
https://swissramble.substack.com/p/will ... email=true
https://archive.is/g6B2v
Been thinking about this and is it possible it could play into our hands a bit, as they might be happy to quickly sanction a sale of Maatsen in the June period, so they can book it before the end of the accounting year?

Swizzlestick
Posts: 3978
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2016 9:40 pm
Been Liked: 1503 times
Has Liked: 578 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Swizzlestick » Thu Jan 19, 2023 8:26 pm

PNE have made some poor decisions on the player trading front, both in terms of signings with little to no resale and not selling assets at the right time, notably Riis. c. £80m owed to the Hemmings family and counting. They’ve had some huge opportunities to achieve promotion - not least the first year we went up - but blown it each time. You wonder what’s around the corner with Hemmings senior now no longer with us and the family seemingly looking for an out.

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Thu Jan 19, 2023 10:54 pm

Chester Perry wrote:
Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:42 am
Deadlines come deadlines go and still Lyon are willing to give John Textor more time, this is based on the proviso that all agreements and finances are in place bar one - the ok of the Premier League - this is because Lyon takeover means that Textor will have new investors in his group which holds the major share in Crystal Palace and the Premier League need to put them through their owners and directors ringer (interestingly this will apply to any future investor in Velocity Sports Limited in regard to our club). Apparently the new deadline as no specific end date which is probably a good job as Newcastle fans well remind anyone who cares to listen that it took 20 months for the Premier League to approve their takeover

JOHN TEXTOR GIVEN FURTHER EXTENSION TO COMPLETE LYON TAKEOVER
https://www.getfootballnewsfrance.com/2 ... -takeover/
It appears that this whole saga has caused quite the stink in the boardroom of Crystal Palace and John Textor himself quite a bit of money. There also seems lots of bad feeling remaining between all parties too - from the Guardian

Palace chairman Steve Parish falls out with club’s biggest investor John Textor
Textor increases stake in club to more than 40% despite tension
Investor had Lyon acquisition delayed by decision Parish took

https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... ohn-textor

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Fri Jan 20, 2023 3:44 pm

Interesting interview with John Textor here

https://twitter.com/OL/status/1616388876238524416

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Fri Jan 20, 2023 4:07 pm

we have become so inured to stories of bribery within FIFA in regards to the last two editions of the men's World Cup that this one of TV executives doing the same to help their bids for TV rights seems to have lost the bite it should

Witness: Bribes helped Fox execs get soccer TV rights
https://apnews.com/article/world-cup-sp ... 33c6d82a76

GodIsADeeJay81
Posts: 14562
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:55 am
Been Liked: 3435 times
Has Liked: 6339 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Fri Jan 20, 2023 6:57 pm

I see both Leicester and Arsenal's new signings are getting 5+ yr contracts

GodIsADeeJay81
Posts: 14562
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:55 am
Been Liked: 3435 times
Has Liked: 6339 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Fri Jan 20, 2023 10:56 pm

tiger76 wrote:
Wed Jan 04, 2023 1:37 pm
Juventus back in financial trouble, why am I not surprised.https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/64150753
15 point deduction announced tonight

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Sat Jan 21, 2023 12:18 am

RVclaret wrote:
Sun Jan 15, 2023 3:40 pm
Interesting to see Chelsea give Mudryk (84m purchase) an 8.5 year contract. I take it this is their way to get away with FFP as the amortisation will be over the 8.5 year period, right?
This is Interesting in terms of the FIFA statute on contract length, but for now that is also the longest period they can amortise over in my understanding - Chelsea cannot just trigger the extensions immediately, they have to wait until contracts and statutes allow - From the Mail

AHEAD OF THE GAME: Chelsea are accused of using long-term deals to cheat FFP rules
Chelsea have been accused of cheating the Premier League's Financial Fair Play

By MATT HUGHES FOR THE DAILY MAIL

PUBLISHED: 22:30, 20 January 2023 | UPDATED: 22:45, 20 January 2023

Chelsea have been accused of using long-term contracts to cheat the Premier League’s Financial Fair Play rules.

According to FIFA statutes, clubs are only permitted to give players contracts of up to five years, but Chelsea have been routinely handing out far longer deals this season.

Ukraine winger Mykhailo Mudryk signed for eight-and-a-half years and French defender Benoit Badiashile for six-and-a-half years this month, after the arrivals of Wesley Fofana and Marc Cucurella on seven- and six-year deals respectively last summer.

Chelsea have got round FIFA’s restrictions by registering the additional years in each player’s contract as a club-triggered option to extend, but some of their Premier League rivals are convinced this is really a ruse to circumnavigate FFP.

Chelsea have spent a Premier League-record £416million on new players this season, an incredible outlay which has been possible only due to accounting rules that permit transfer fees to be spread across the duration of a player’s contract for FFP purposes.

The £88m Mudryk fee will therefore cost Chelsea just £10m a year when they submit their accounts to the Premier League for FFP monitoring at the end of the season.

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Sat Jan 21, 2023 1:19 am

Chester Perry wrote:
Wed Jan 18, 2023 11:30 am
an archive listing of the same report -

New Olympique Lyonnais owners plan Spac listing
US multi-club business’s move would be a first for the football sector

https://archive.is/rsqE6

This is an intriguing one - as we know there was a surge in SPAC's with a direct focus on sports in late 2020 early 2021, which was widely reported. I remember an almost giddy level of speculation on this board, from one or two posters, about ALK being back by a SPAC. Less reported is that many of those SPAC's could not find what they thought was value in the market and so returned the monies to their investors and folded.

In America SPAC's have to declare their business area of interest at formation and then commit at least 80% of their funding to their first purchase, from this it would appear that that first purchase can be for a minority stake - this bit has surprised me.

When you look at the valuation of Eagle Holdings in this potential deal it seems wrong, significantly overpriced - yes Lyonais can be profitable (particularly with regular Champions League Football, but under the agreement with the Premier League and the other investors of Crystal Palace, Eagle Holdings must not give OL preferential investment. Palace are looking to spend a lot on ground development shortly. The other two are not really worth too much at all though Botafogo could grow strong under the reformed Brazillian League I have posted about.
Are SPAC's like buses?

It takes forever for a SPAC to be mentioned as an actual investment vehical into European Football and then we get two in a week

Report: Watford and Udinese minority stakes to be sold off by Pozzo family in US investor deal
Unnamed SPAC would acquire ‘significant’ share in Serie A club and 10% of Championship outfit.

https://www.sportspromedia.com/news/wat ... zo-family/

Chester Perry
Posts: 19167
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 11:06 am
Been Liked: 3115 times
Has Liked: 481 times

Re: Football's Magic Money Tree

Post by Chester Perry » Sat Jan 21, 2023 1:20 am

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Fri Jan 20, 2023 10:56 pm
15 point deduction announced tonight
Given their history I think they have gotten off quite lightly

Post Reply