Surely they would just use GPS, or a black box telematic box which will send off the odometer data after a set period?clarethomer wrote: ↑Tue Jan 10, 2023 5:34 pmCharging per the mile seems the approach that I have seen mentioned most but I genuinely don't know how they would do it in reality. How would they know what miles are done.
New cars won't officially report the mileage to the government until they go into a MOT so I can imagine when you get to that point, you could get charged that way but then that brings up issues of when you sell and buy mid point between these - presume you would need to report the mileage on the Sale document and have lease companies be responsible for reporting or ensuring the tax is settled upon the return of a car.
Would it instead use camera technology that exists similarly to how they charge and capture payments for the dartford crossing/clean air zones/Bus Lanes/Congestion charges to capture use of car and time spent? Not sure how they would determine the miles I had done and whether it would charge a flat fee so it works so it doesn't matter whether you had done 100 miles in that area or driven 1mile and parked up for most of the day and driven a mile back out?
Currently charging at a public charger attracts 20% VAT I think compared to 5% at home, so the government are recouping some of that tax back already for the use of the car. Could this see governments seeking to use smart meters or energy companies to find a way of separating your domestic use energy and your car charging energy and increasing the VAT on that element?
Will be interesting to see what they do. Can't imagine they will want to show their hand/discuss it too early at the fear of pushing adoption further out.
Fully Electric Cars
Re: Fully Electric Cars
Re: Fully Electric Cars
Hopefully, gas/diesel guzzlers get charged and electric don't!
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
When a Car reaches 3 years old they have Odometers checked in the MOT every yearclarethomer wrote: ↑Tue Jan 10, 2023 9:25 pmI just cant see them expecting for cars to have these added aftermarket and I cant see that this would go down with privacy in mind
Re: Fully Electric Cars
I’ve recently been looking at PCP deals for a new car and considered an electric car. I was put off by the price and the fact that we have family dotted about around the country so range would be an issue. It’s a shame as I think they’re a good idea.
Re: Fully Electric Cars
The problems they have with charging per mile, which is probably why they have never done it, is that either they charge flat rate per mile, which is a disproportionate charge to people who live in the country miles from the shops or they charge by some sort of GPS system, which is perceived as an invasion of privacy. Neither is politically popular. Of course, with petrol/diesel cars it isn't needed because fuel duty has the same effect - them as use more, pay more.clarethomer wrote: ↑Tue Jan 10, 2023 5:34 pmCharging per the mile seems the approach that I have seen mentioned most but I genuinely don't know how they would do it in reality. How would they know what miles are done.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
In a Pay and display car park near me, there's an EV using the charging point and they've been given a parking fine for not purchasing a Pay and Display parking ticket ...
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Happens a lot this. Just because they are at a charging point doesn’t remove the parking restrictions in place for that area. So if you are in a car park then you abide by the same rules as everyone else in terms of paying, length of stay etc.GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 11, 2023 11:56 amIn a Pay and display car park near me, there's an EV using the charging point and they've been given a parking fine for not purchasing a Pay and Display parking ticket ...
On at street charging bays you need to read the signs. Most will limit the stay but you are usually allowed longer (usually around 3 hours) than the standard 40 minutes
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
EVs will be paying VED from next year. This tax will be applied to all EVs, not just the ones bought after the intro date. The great financial ‘claw back’ is gathering pace.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Albeit there are carparks where it does. Like you say, you can't just assume though. Do see a lot of people getting caught out by it though.1968claret wrote: ↑Wed Jan 11, 2023 1:51 pmHappens a lot this. Just because they are at a charging point doesn’t remove the parking restrictions in place for that area. So if you are in a car park then you abide by the same rules as everyone else in terms of paying, length of stay etc.
On at street charging bays you need to read the signs. Most will limit the stay but you are usually allowed longer (usually around 3 hours) than the standard 40 minutes
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
I'd never thought about that tbh, but I don't have an EV so...1968claret wrote: ↑Wed Jan 11, 2023 1:51 pmHappens a lot this. Just because they are at a charging point doesn’t remove the parking restrictions in place for that area. So if you are in a car park then you abide by the same rules as everyone else in terms of paying, length of stay etc.
On at street charging bays you need to read the signs. Most will limit the stay but you are usually allowed longer (usually around 3 hours) than the standard 40 minutes
The ticket had been issued at 9am, so I'm going to guess the person wasn't aware they had to pay and there's nothing on or next to the EV charging point informing them whether they need to pay for parking or not.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Often parking charges apply. I have had free parking at Tesla Supercharger in Inverness multi storey and in a 7kw charger bay (there was 6 bays and chargers) in Stirling, where parking and electricity was free for EV drivers bang in the centre!
Free parking at every Tesla supercharger, I think, although some time limited.
Free parking at every Tesla supercharger, I think, although some time limited.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
The SUC that I see catching people out is Scotch Corner I think it is because they don't register their reg details at reception to ensure the cameras discount them from the parking charges. £100 fine for people that miss the notice to do so.IanMcL wrote: ↑Wed Jan 11, 2023 6:31 pmOften parking charges apply. I have had free parking at Tesla Supercharger in Inverness multi storey and in a 7kw charger bay (there was 6 bays and chargers) in Stirling, where parking and electricity was free for EV drivers bang in the centre!
Free parking at every Tesla supercharger, I think, although some time limited.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
You might well be right and if so, thanks for correcting me. Tbh, I didn’t take that much notice as I’ll never be buying one.
Re: Fully Electric Cars
Yes the reception isn't always manned!clarethomer wrote: ↑Thu Jan 12, 2023 5:00 pmThe SUC that I see catching people out is Scotch Corner I think it is because they don't register their reg details at reception to ensure the cameras discount them from the parking charges. £100 fine for people that miss the notice to do so.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Tesla have dropped their prices today
Tesla Model 3: £48,490 -> £42,990 (-£5,500, -11.34%)
Tesla Model 3 Long Range: £57,490 -> £50,990 (-£6,500, -11.30%)
Tesla Model 3 Performance: £61,490 -> £57,990 (-£3,500, -5.69%).
BMW 3 series brand new starting at £38,990 before you add on all of the extras on to get some of the stuff that comes as standard on the Tesla.
£4K difference
Tesla Model 3: £48,490 -> £42,990 (-£5,500, -11.34%)
Tesla Model 3 Long Range: £57,490 -> £50,990 (-£6,500, -11.30%)
Tesla Model 3 Performance: £61,490 -> £57,990 (-£3,500, -5.69%).
BMW 3 series brand new starting at £38,990 before you add on all of the extras on to get some of the stuff that comes as standard on the Tesla.
£4K difference
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Newcastle upon Tyne will be introducing a clean air zone in 2023, won't affect the private car initially, these things are always introduced in phases.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Not good news that Britishvolt has gone into administration today
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Good article on RTE news about getting the best from your electric battery.
https://www.rte.ie/brainstorm/2023/0117 ... cond-hand/
https://www.rte.ie/brainstorm/2023/0117 ... cond-hand/
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
I used to shine a torch across the mileage at an angle to read it if the display wasn't lit up.
Worked 99% of the time.
Re: Fully Electric Cars
Britain being left behind again. The only such battery production in the UK will controlled by the Chinese.Lancasterclaret wrote: ↑Tue Jan 17, 2023 2:33 pmNot good news that Britishvolt has gone into administration today
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
I'm not at any stage expecting to treat GB News as a viable news source on stuff like this
its bankrolled by climate change deniers and fossil fuel magnates
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Balanced as alwaysLancasterclaret wrote: ↑Tue Jan 17, 2023 4:58 pmI'm not at any stage expecting to treat GB News as a viable news source on stuff like this
its bankrolled by climate change deniers and fossil fuel magnates
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Nope. However if you were in an accident, the insurance company could potentially see whether you have under declared your annual mileage and that would be the only reason why they were interested in your mileage.Taffy on the wing wrote: ↑Tue Jan 17, 2023 5:28 pmDon't insurance companies ask for Odometer readings every year?
Mine does over here.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Have you actually read that sham of an article? It starts with the sentence;
’Electric car owners have been warned that the range of battery-powered vehicles can halve by up to 50 per cent…
How the hell can something halve by up to 50%? I should have stopped reading there because if a ‘journalist’ has written that, then read it back and still decided it’s publishable then they have little credibility.
However, the article then goes onto state;
’Car Magazine suggest that the cold weather can trim off anywhere between 10 and 15 percent of a motor’s range.
So the claim made in the fake news click bait headline has exaggerated the effect that cold weather has on a battery range by up to 500% (see what I did there). And you fall for this rubbish? Presumably because you’re so desperate to believe it.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
…the article also states that a Tesla’s range was reduced by just 5.6% in the cold weather. I suppose you could round that up to 50% though just to be on the safe side.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Not in the UK.Taffy on the wing wrote: ↑Tue Jan 17, 2023 5:28 pmDon't insurance companies ask for Odometer readings every year?
Mine does over here.
They ask how many miles you're likely to do, most people tend to put 10k ish, but it's not uncommon to exceed that and the insurance companies don't check the MOT history.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Got to the kids school yesterday really early as I had a meeting finish sooner and it wasn't worth going home to come back. I spent 75 mins with heated seat and climate on at 21.5 degrees. Lost 1 mile from my range.
Not that I was worried but it shows should I get stuck on a motorway closure, on a full moon night, where the wind is blowing easterly and its minus 20 that I will at least keep warm and not impede my range too much. Unless I only have a few miles of range less perhaps.
Not that I was worried but it shows should I get stuck on a motorway closure, on a full moon night, where the wind is blowing easterly and its minus 20 that I will at least keep warm and not impede my range too much. Unless I only have a few miles of range less perhaps.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
The cold weather doesn’t do much to my Tesla. 5%-10% probably the max drop off.
A bigger issue is that it used to have a maximum of about 295 miles on the capacity and now a year or two later it is 266. I can use it up with a trip to the Turf and back with a few side trips in between. There are no superchargers on the way either nor any in Burnley when I get there.
A bigger issue is that it used to have a maximum of about 295 miles on the capacity and now a year or two later it is 266. I can use it up with a trip to the Turf and back with a few side trips in between. There are no superchargers on the way either nor any in Burnley when I get there.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
So you’re saying your range literally halved by 0.4%? Scary.clarethomer wrote: ↑Tue Jan 17, 2023 8:13 pmGot to the kids school yesterday really early as I had a meeting finish sooner and it wasn't worth going home to come back. I spent 75 mins with heated seat and climate on at 21.5 degrees. Lost 1 mile from my range.
Not that I was worried but it shows should I get stuck on a motorway closure, on a full moon night, where the wind is blowing easterly and its minus 20 that I will at least keep warm and not impede my range too much. Unless I only have a few miles of range less perhaps.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Sounds like you’re the one with the problem, calm down you’ll do yourself some damage.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Tue Jan 17, 2023 8:00 pmHave you actually read that sham of an article? It starts with the sentence;
’Electric car owners have been warned that the range of battery-powered vehicles can halve by up to 50 per cent…
How the hell can something halve by up to 50%? I should have stopped reading there because if a ‘journalist’ has written that, then read it back and still decided it’s publishable then they have little credibility.
However, the article then goes onto state;
’Car Magazine suggest that the cold weather can trim off anywhere between 10 and 15 percent of a motor’s range.
So the claim made in the fake news click bait headline has exaggerated the effect that cold weather has on a battery range by up to 500% (see what I did there). And you fall for this rubbish? Presumably because you’re so desperate to believe it.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Can you tell me which news outlet is accurate?Lancasterclaret wrote: ↑Tue Jan 17, 2023 8:46 pmIts GB news
They are backed by climate deniers and fossil fuel magnates
I have absolutely no idea if that effects their editorial output, but the clips I see of their shows suggests that accuracy isn't their strongpoint
Re: Fully Electric Cars
Theres a youtube programme with monthly films about Electric car ownership
Look up on youtube "Petrol Ped" ... very informative
Look up on youtube "Petrol Ped" ... very informative
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Had to use my 2 year old Tesla for two return trips to Glasgow in the past week. Range of my car is apparently 340 miles but on both occasions I have had to charge it en route, to ensure I get to the destination, which was 220 miles away. Both times driven at the speed limit and as if mMiss Daisy herself was in the back.
So apparently I’ve lost up to a half of a third of the range of the vehicle
So apparently I’ve lost up to a half of a third of the range of the vehicle
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
I’m struggling with that. On a decent journey I’d say I’m losing 20-30% now compared to the autumn when I got the car.CrosspoolClarets wrote: ↑Tue Jan 17, 2023 8:15 pmThe cold weather doesn’t do much to my Tesla. 5%-10% probably the max drop off.
A bigger issue is that it used to have a maximum of about 295 miles on the capacity and now a year or two later it is 266. I can use it up with a trip to the Turf and back with a few side trips in between. There are no superchargers on the way either nor any in Burnley when I get there.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
95% of electric cars are still on the road. The other 5% actually made it home.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Piles of nonsense being posted about electric cars on here......all of it by people who don't own one.
I've had mine for 4 years.......best car i've ever had...by miles.
I smile every time i drive past a Gas station....i smile a lot.
I've had mine for 4 years.......best car i've ever had...by miles.
I smile every time i drive past a Gas station....i smile a lot.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Some will just parrot whatever they are told on Talk Radio, GB News etc.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
Years of reading the tabloids and watching right wing news has some people absolutely terrified of any kind of change.
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Re: Fully Electric Cars
not bad ...1882Clarets1882 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 18, 2023 3:30 pm95% of electric cars are still on the road. The other 5% actually made it home.
Re: Fully Electric Cars
If you leave your EV at Manchester airport for a fortnights holiday will it hold the charge sufficiently to get you home to Burnley when you get back or does it lose some charge over time?
Re: Fully Electric Cars
Have you thought about a Hybrid? Very good solution.