Do you have details of his wages and you know what the plans were for his place in the team. The truth is that, like me, you know neither.Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:23 amCan’t imagine he’s on peanuts Tony. Rumoured to be on mid 30k a week (sounds about right).
I think he was signed to start alongside Westwood, I think they would compliment each other quite well.
ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Absolutely. It will be underwhelming when he’s the only signing and we virtually never see him.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:24 amNo, I totally agree with you on that.
I guess to some the signing of DS was seen as underwelming in the first place, and followed up by his constant non-availability this has led to some frustration at what looks the a loss of substantial money in wages.
Hopefully he will soon be available and then we can start judging. I saw him play an hour for the u23s recently. Showed a brilliant attitude, similar to the one I saw a few years ago from Steven Defour when he played for them. He was running the game too.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
It's not like crypto partners and the like is something only us are looking at. It's the whole of the Premier League (and plenty other sports beyond). If we weren't looking at it then people would be complaining that we're missing out on opportunities to maximise revenue.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I think it was also underwhelming as he had been discarded by Brighton.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:40 amAbsolutely. It will be underwhelming when he’s the only signing and we virtually never see him.
Hopefully he will soon be available and then we can start judging. I saw him play an hour for the u23s recently. Showed a brilliant attitude, similar to the one I saw a few years ago from Steven Defour when he played for them. He was running the game too.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I dont believe he was signed as a regular first teamer.Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:23 amCan’t imagine he’s on peanuts Tony. Rumoured to be on mid 30k a week (sounds about right).
I think he was signed to start alongside Westwood, I think they would compliment each other quite well.
He was in my view clearly signed as back-up and to strengthen the squad. Truth is that with the benefit of hindsight he's been a useless signing and waste of money.
When you say compliment, rather than complement, do you mean that Westwood and Stephens would be saying how good the other one is while they are starting alongside each other.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
This is based on these salary figures which I'd take with a hefty pinch of saltGodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:27 amhttps://blog.jacuzzi.co.uk/performance- ... n-2020-21/
The above link is about the cost of wages for injured players in the PL last season for every club.
Stephens was our only signing for the first team squad that season, so he gets a mention, but Barnes apparently cost us more in wages during his time out injured and Kevin Long was injured for the longest period.
https://salarysport.com/football/premie ... urnley-f.c./
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Yeah I have seen that, which is why I never made a thread about it, but it gives a rough ideaaggi wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:50 amThis is based on these salary figures which I'd take with a hefty pinch of salt
https://salarysport.com/football/premie ... urnley-f.c./
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
He looked severely past it when he featured, him stood on the sidelines waiting to be subbed on was like a SoccerAid substitution. Numerous sites reporting his wages are £37,500 a week, 2 year contract. Which is close to £6m paid in 2 years.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 9:22 amSadly, through no fault of his own, Dale Stephens has become a target for some, probably because Jeff Hendrick & Robbie Brady are no longer here to abuse.
It’s a shame because he’s a good player but he’s been injured virtually since signing.
Add on the reported £1m transfer fee.
We know transfers often include other fees (signing on fees, agent fees etc).
We also know the squad is highly incentivised in bonuses surrounding the team surviving in the Premier League, bonuses he will of been eligible to receive.
Based on the above, Is it unreasonable to suggest Stephens has cost the club £8m-10m?
I have no issue with him contributing nothing because quite frankly, he never was gonna contribute anything even if he was fit. My issue is, that money should've been spent elsewhere and considerably better. I don't think Stephens helped himself either with his ''**** Burnley'' sing song at Brighton.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Back when I was privy to such information, I was always surprised by how accurate the reported salary and transfer figures were (especially in Football Manager).
If anything the reported numbers at the time were short of the real figures.
If anything the reported numbers at the time were short of the real figures.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
(£37,500 x 52) x 2 = £3.9m. Not sure how you get to £6m?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I still don't understand why we signed him...
Benson could have progressed and maybe we could have developed a player, failing that I could have sat on the bench for £100 per match.
What difference would it make?
Benson could have progressed and maybe we could have developed a player, failing that I could have sat on the bench for £100 per match.
What difference would it make?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Well obviously it would make no difference if we knew Stephens was going to be injured for almost his entire duration here. But we didn’t know that. Stephens is a better player than Benson and we needed a backup midfielder. His signing was a very low risk and a relatively very low cost.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 9:27 pmI still don't understand why we signed him...
Benson could have progressed and maybe we could have developed a player, failing that I could have sat on the bench for £100 per match.
What difference would it make?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Benson was on about £5k a week which over two years is close to £327m.
It’s no wonder we let him go.
It’s no wonder we let him go.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I can’t understand the ‘theory’ of signing ‘back up players’. All new signings should be to compete with and eventually replace the oldest/weakest members of our first team squad. Alan Pace needs to make this clear to Sean Dyche for all future signings.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 9:32 pmWell obviously it would make no difference if we knew Stephens was going to be injured for almost his entire duration here. But we didn’t know that. Stephens is a better player than Benson and we needed a backup midfielder. His signing was a very low risk and a relatively very low cost.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
No, that really isn't the point I'm making.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 9:32 pmWell obviously it would make no difference if we knew Stephens was going to be injured for almost his entire duration here. But we didn’t know that. Stephens is a better player than Benson and we needed a backup midfielder. His signing was a very low risk and a relatively very low cost.
Either would have been on the bench barring injury to 2 out of Cork, Westwood and Brownhill.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
What do we call Lennon?
For the life of me I can’t understand why we resigned him. Surely some of our U23s would be worth a punt
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Is this thread still going? Christ! ALK Substantially funded by outside investors and will, Covid permitting; do again in the coming windows. I am privy to to certain aspects of the business courtesy of my source, who to be fair has been pretty bang on.
Money will be available again in January and summer etcetera.
Don't get me wrong. Dyche is on more borrowed time than the previous owners. He has a remit. He has to stay up as a bare minimum. Board expected an improvement on last season but Covid may save his bacon but Dyche will be sacked if, during a normal season results don't improve on field. That I can guarantee you now.
Borrowed time. Player wise, Covid permitting; you can expect multiple bids for players mentioned on other threads. We are not short of money.
Money will be available again in January and summer etcetera.
Don't get me wrong. Dyche is on more borrowed time than the previous owners. He has a remit. He has to stay up as a bare minimum. Board expected an improvement on last season but Covid may save his bacon but Dyche will be sacked if, during a normal season results don't improve on field. That I can guarantee you now.
Borrowed time. Player wise, Covid permitting; you can expect multiple bids for players mentioned on other threads. We are not short of money.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Some interesting comments there. I would be incredibly interested to find where the money is coming from.BenWickes wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:02 pmIs this thread still going? Christ! ALK Substantially funded by outside investors and will, Covid permitting; do again in the coming windows. I am privy to to certain aspects of the business courtesy of my source, who to be fair has been pretty bang on.
Money will be available again in January and summer etcetera.
Don't get me wrong. Dyche is on more borrowed time than the previous owners. He has a remit. He has to stay up as a bare minimum. Board expected an improvement on last season but Covid may save his bacon but Dyche will be sacked if, during a normal season results don't improve on field. That I can guarantee you now.
Borrowed time. Player wise, Covid permitting; you can expect multiple bids for players mentioned on other threads. We are not short of money.
Dyche on borrowed time already?
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
It isn’t a theory. Every squad needs back up players. Not every signing can be at the ability to compete with or eventually replace other members of the squad. I would prefer to have a tried and tested player such as Stephens as our fourth choice midfielder than a young player who isn’t deemed good enough.
If you think that every signing we make should be pushing for the first eleven then you’re deluded.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
In which case it would be much better to have Dale Stephens on the bench than Josh Benson or Boatshed Bill.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 9:53 pmNo, that really isn't the point I'm making.
Either would have been on the bench barring injury to 2 out of Cork, Westwood and Brownhill.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I'm not bad for 70 very soon
But the liklihood of 2 out of 3 out the same week is fairly remote, and we could even have put another of our high earning virtual non-performers (Pieters) in in an emergency.
The whol;e thing about signing Stephens seemed a bit odd to me.
BTW, I'm not knocking Dale Stephens for him both signing for the club and being unable to play.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
If you couldn’t get a game when David Edgar was playing in midfield then I think you’ll struggle nowboatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:17 pmI'm not bad for 70 very soon
But the liklihood of 2 out of 3 out the same week is fairly remote, and we could even have put another of our high earning virtual non-performers (Pieters) in in an emergency.
The whol;e thing about signing Stephens seemed a bit odd to me.
BTW, I'm not knocking Dale Stephens for him both signing for the club and being unable to play.
We know Dyche likes to have two players for every position, so having 4 central midfielder players would seem to be the minimum requirement. We clearly weren’t in a position to spend £10-£15m on a 4th midfielder - it wasn’t exactly a priority position for us - so we took the cheap, experienced option. The fact that Stephens has hardly featured due to injuries is neither here nor there.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Can't disagree with anything you've said there.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:24 pmIf you couldn’t get a game when David Edgar was playing in midfield then I think you’ll struggle now
We know Dyche likes to have two players for every position, so having 4 central midfielder players would seem to be the minimum requirement. We clearly weren’t in a position to spend £10-£15m on a 4th midfielder - it wasn’t exactly a priority position for us - so we took the cheap, experienced option. The fact that Stephens has hardly featured due to injuries is neither here nor there.
I just think Dyche is too inclined towards experience at any cost over youth and its potential.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
No arguments from me that he’s been a bad signing & waste of money. Looked an odd one at the time and I can only imagine it was our only option given Garlick’s reluctance to invest.
That said, I’m not sure he’ll be getting the quoted amount whilst injured/not playing/we’re finishing 17th, given how our wage structure is performance driven.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Merry Christmas, Alan.BenWickes wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:02 pmIs this thread still going? Christ! ALK Substantially funded by outside investors and will, Covid permitting; do again in the coming windows. I am privy to to certain aspects of the business courtesy of my source, who to be fair has been pretty bang on.
Money will be available again in January and summer etcetera.
Don't get me wrong. Dyche is on more borrowed time than the previous owners. He has a remit. He has to stay up as a bare minimum. Board expected an improvement on last season but Covid may save his bacon but Dyche will be sacked if, during a normal season results don't improve on field. That I can guarantee you now.
Borrowed time. Player wise, Covid permitting; you can expect multiple bids for players mentioned on other threads. We are not short of money.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Dyche is definitely inclined towards experience, but in fairness it’s served him, and us well. So it’s difficult to be too critical. But he has recently demonstrated that when he is given the funds he has been more comfortable taking a gamble with a player (Cornet/Collins), with more of an eye on the future than a short term fix.boatshed bill wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 10:41 pmCan't disagree with anything you've said there.
I just think Dyche is too inclined towards experience at any cost over youth and its potential.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I think, to some extent, it's held us back.Rileybobs wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 11:01 pmDyche is definitely inclined towards experience, but in fairness it’s served him, and us well. So it’s difficult to be too critical. But he has recently demonstrated that when he is given the funds he has been more comfortable taking a gamble with a player (Cornet/Collins), with more of an eye on the future than a short term fix.
Yes, I accept it's a gamble investing in younger players with potential, but constantly signing "experienced" players will eventually cost more than we will ever have available.
We are now in a situation where a number of 30+ year olds will need replacing and you have to wonder where all that money will come from.
Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
No idea why I mixed the figures up, the point still stands though. You were weirdly delighted I posted incorrect figure somehow but go ahead, have your funBordeauxclaret wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 9:42 pmBenson was on about £5k a week which over two years is close to £327m.
It’s no wonder we let him go.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I'm with you on this Tony. He's a good player who hasn't had a proper chance. He's also something different to what we currently have in centre midfield. I hope he gets a chance this year to show what he can do.ClaretTony wrote: ↑Thu Dec 23, 2021 9:22 amSadly, through no fault of his own, Dale Stephens has become a target for some, probably because Jeff Hendrick & Robbie Brady are no longer here to abuse.
It’s a shame because he’s a good player but he’s been injured virtually since signing.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Unfortunately, he won’t be afforded a poor game or two by many, which puts him under quite a bit of pressure, particularly on the back of a long injury lay off.superdimitri wrote: ↑Fri Dec 24, 2021 7:04 amI'm with you on this Tony. He's a good player who hasn't had a proper chance. He's also something different to what we currently have in centre midfield. I hope he gets a chance this year to show what he can do.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I keep looking at the thread topic: ALK Capital ....takeover and wondering what all this transfer window stuff is doing on this thread.
Let's keep this one for all the club finance and shareholder stuff.
Merry Christmas.
Exciting times.
UTC
Let's keep this one for all the club finance and shareholder stuff.
Merry Christmas.
Exciting times.
UTC
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Here here Paul. Merry Christmas to you and all Clarets.Paul Waine wrote: ↑Fri Dec 24, 2021 4:20 pmI keep looking at the thread topic: ALK Capital ....takeover and wondering what all this transfer window stuff is doing on this thread.
Let's keep this one for all the club finance and shareholder stuff.
Merry Christmas.
Exciting times.
UTC
Exciting times in 2022 (hopefully) - come on AP!
NewClaret
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Why buy an injured player in the first place bearing in mind what happened with Wells.
Re: Something different, what do you think
Very forward thinking of ALK and I am very supportive having been a long term investor in crypto assets.
I guess this is the problem they will face though. A lot of older supporters will be ignorant to the financial benefits and closer engagement these securities can bring to the club and the fans. They have probably just heard crypto and fraud mentioned in the same sentence and assumed they are all the same.
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Re: Something different, what do you think
That’s a pretty harsh view.Steddyman wrote: ↑Fri Dec 24, 2021 5:37 pmVery forward thinking of ALK and I am very supportive having been a long term investor in crypto assets.
I guess this is the problem they will face though. A lot of older supporters will be ignorant to the financial benefits and closer engagement these securities can bring to the club and the fans. They have probably just heard crypto and fraud mentioned in the same sentence and assumed they are all the same.
I am pretty heavily invested into crypto, even I think it looks a bit dodgy.
INX looks like it was made by a 17 years old on his mums laptop
Re: Something different, what do you think
What looks dodgy about it?Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 24, 2021 5:40 pmThat’s a pretty harsh view.
I am pretty heavily invested into crypto, even I think it looks a bit dodgy.
INX looks like it was made by a 17 years old on his mums laptop
Re: Something different, what do you think
I think I’ll trust Alan Pace (30+ years working at the worlds largest banks heading Global Securities divisions, a certificate in crypto and bitcoin from UC Berkeley and an MBA International Finance from IESE Business School) than someone who pops a few £100 in every now and then with the hope some random coin ‘goes to the moon’.Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 24, 2021 5:40 pmThat’s a pretty harsh view.
I am pretty heavily invested into crypto, even I think it looks a bit dodgy.
INX looks like it was made by a 17 years old on his mums laptop
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Re: Something different, what do you think
I don’t think anyone can judge until the crypto actually is released. So little information on it atm, but right now INX looks on the dodgier side of crypto.RVclaret wrote: ↑Fri Dec 24, 2021 5:58 pmI think I’ll trust Alan Pace (30+ years working at the worlds largest banks heading Global Securities divisions, a certificate in crypto and bitcoin from UC Berkeley and an MBA International Finance from IESE Business School) than someone who pops a few £100 in every now and then with the hope some random coin ‘goes to the moon’.
Re: Something different, what do you think
Most big clubs around Europe are doing this now. It isn't so much about investment and profit as it is about engagement and ownership. These assets can allow the fans to feel much closer to the club and players.Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 24, 2021 6:03 pmI don’t think anyone can judge until the crypto actually is released. So little information on it atm, but right now INX looks on the dodgier side of crypto.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
and Merry Christmas to you and your family too, no grudge from my end!
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Re: Something different, what do you think
Nothing to do with older supporters, more to do with people having serious concerns.Steddyman wrote: ↑Fri Dec 24, 2021 5:37 pmVery forward thinking of ALK and I am very supportive having been a long term investor in crypto assets.
I guess this is the problem they will face though. A lot of older supporters will be ignorant to the financial benefits and closer engagement these securities can bring to the club and the fans. They have probably just heard crypto and fraud mentioned in the same sentence and assumed they are all the same.
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Re: Something different, what do you think
TBH I feel close enough without crypto.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
Well lets face it we have signed enough of cryptos over the years.
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Re: Something different, what do you think
From the press release, I understand that ALK are exploring digital security token that would trade on INX platform. Digital securities are not the same as cryptocurrencies.Newcastleclaret93 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 24, 2021 6:03 pmI don’t think anyone can judge until the crypto actually is released. So little information on it atm, but right now INX looks on the dodgier side of crypto.
From INX website:
https://securities-support.inx.co/hc/en ... ecurities-
What is the difference between cryptocurrencies and digital securities?
Both cryptocurrencies and digital securities use blockchain technology. Crypto currencies are digital representations of value that can function as a medium of exchange, a unit of account, or a store of value. This is similar to the way gold and fiat currencies such as USD and the Euro are used. Digital securities (also commonly known as security tokens) are considered securities, not currencies, and therefore require registration with the SEC under the U.S. Securities Act.
Digital security ownership functions in a similar fashion to traditional securities, such as stocks and bonds. The owner of a digital security has the opportunity to benefit from the performance of the underlying issuer in the form of dividends, interest payments or capital appreciation, depending on the structure of the digital security.
**************************
There's a lot more on INX website for anyone who is interested.
I'm not familiar with any cryptocurrency exchanges/trading platforms. Having taken a look at key sections of INX website there's nothing that raises any "red flags" with regard to the apparent positioning of INX with respect to digital platforms. Their board, independent directors and advisory board are people you'd expect to be aiming to make a success of INX - and operating and complying with all the regulations that will govern their business.
What do I mean? INX do not appear to be on the "dodgier side" of anything, so far as I can tell. There are no "reputational concerns" that I can see if ALK and Burnley FC are associated with INX.
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Re: ALK Capital or Farnell/Elkashashy takeover
I think it's fairly obvious that Alan unfortunately couldn't utilise his '30 years experience' to attract the finance. He was lucky to get an amazing interest rate for the mortgage on HIS HOUSE from the Dell geezer, i think a bit less than the payday loans co's, so as fans who have seen there well run club become indebted, we should be massively grateful for that.
The fact that INX are only regulated by the US financial authorities means that every penny you invest is wholly unregulated , rings bell number 1.
The issue of payment 2 being due soon rings bell number 2. Bless him, he talks the talk, but hasn't hot a penny to his name.
Alan's last spin of the dice of the typical US snake oil salesman's hope of furnishing investors with a few quid to add value to the 'share value' of the product is never gonna pay off, as were nowhere near Champions League, which is what IXS are expecting and what Pace is praying for in order to pay off his 'mortgage'.
Also, possiblly breaching betting laws (FOOTBALL INDEX RINGS A BELL)
Don't get me wrong, he seems a nice bloke, but as i'Ve said since he start, he' not good enough to interest anyone with any money, and he certainly doesn't have any. Very likely the least valuable owner in Burnley's history /
The fact that INX are only regulated by the US financial authorities means that every penny you invest is wholly unregulated , rings bell number 1.
The issue of payment 2 being due soon rings bell number 2. Bless him, he talks the talk, but hasn't hot a penny to his name.
Alan's last spin of the dice of the typical US snake oil salesman's hope of furnishing investors with a few quid to add value to the 'share value' of the product is never gonna pay off, as were nowhere near Champions League, which is what IXS are expecting and what Pace is praying for in order to pay off his 'mortgage'.
Also, possiblly breaching betting laws (FOOTBALL INDEX RINGS A BELL)
Don't get me wrong, he seems a nice bloke, but as i'Ve said since he start, he' not good enough to interest anyone with any money, and he certainly doesn't have any. Very likely the least valuable owner in Burnley's history /
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