Sorry if posted elsewhere, but does this mean MSD Capital have lost their investment?

Owners have little influence in the top leagues with the amount of power ceded to Agents and Players over the past 30 years.

Mel Morris should have got out years ago. Unless the Club is a smokescreen of course...

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:52 pm

Sorry if posted elsewhere, but does this mean MSD Capital have lost their investment?

Dunno tbh, I suspect they'll have something legal written up that means they get preferential treatment, like football clubs and players do when a club goes into administration.

Morris bought 22% of the club in May 2014 after their play-off defeat against QPR. He bought the entire club during the following season.

ClaretTony wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:29 pm

Morris bought 22% of the club in May 2014 after their play-off defeat against QPR. He bought the entire club during the following season.

Read a report today that he’s ploughed £200m in. Not sure how accurate that is, but imagine having that kind of money in the first place, never mind to lose.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 22, 2021 5:27 pm

Dunno tbh, I suspect they'll have something legal written up that means they get preferential treatment, like football clubs and players do when a club goes into administration.

I assume their loan is asset backed (like ours) and that any default means they take control of said assets? So the administrators are selling MSD’s asset to get them some cash back whilst all the other creditors can swivel?

I originally assumed this was all just going to be some form of pre-pack admin as part of the ongoing takeover discussions but what I read this morning sounded like they were calling on new parties to show an interest, had 15 expressions of interest over the weekend, of which 3 were serious. Also said that the administrators immediate priority was ensuring this seasons fixtures could be fulfilled so that sounds very much like they are up a creek desperately trying to find a paddle… sure there’s more to it though.

Timeline of how Derby got to this pointhttps://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58641014

What a mess this whole thing is, and why it was ever allowed to get so bad beats me.

What's happened to Chester Perry? it would be nice to get his take on this, his posts are always interesting and informative

Bizarrely Boro owner Gibson is taking Derby to court for financial irregularities etc.

Considering this is the bloke who wrote off £100 million of debt Boro owed him so they wouldn't breach the then incoming FFP rules, this is hilarious...

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:52 pm

Sorry if posted elsewhere, but does this mean MSD Capital have lost their investment?

It was MSD who actually applied to put Derby into administration so it seems very unlikely they would have done that if it would result in them losing their investment.

I’ve personally come across MSD in a previous period of my life. They had a board seat on the startup I was part of, but no skin in the game. I did. An investor defaulted on a payment (Russian oligarch, via Deutsche Bank - sound familiar to Trump followers?). MSD said they’d cover it, but then they didn’t. I lost more than my coat.

I’m happy for MSD to feel a very small sting on the ass

And here starts the job losses, despite Steve McClaren stepping down from his role as technical director.https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-d ... -58747216

Hope he owned his umbrella, outright!

McClaren: he's earned a wagon-load of money out of football without tremendous results. So great to see his altruism. Give him a knighthood.

Some positive news for Derby thanks to a great gesture by Arsenal to defer a due payment from Derby for the transfer of Krystian Bielik. Fair play to Arsenal who show some good will and class and fingers crossed Mr Rooney can pull off the miracle and keep Derby up this season

Empty gesture from Arsenal really, they know they'll get their money regardless due to the football creditors rule.

NewClaret wrote: ↑

Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:52 pm

Sorry if posted elsewhere, but does this mean MSD Capital have lost their investment?

Reported that their loan is asset backed by the stadium and training ground.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Oct 07, 2021 11:01 am

Empty gesture from Arsenal really, they know they'll get their money regardless due to the football creditors rule.

An interesting point that. I suspect that MSD would get preference over football creditors. Obviously it's likely that whoever buys the club would have the funds to pay off both (or if the club was dissolved then there would be enough to cover it) but it does show a risk with these loans.

aggi wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 08, 2021 11:18 am

An interesting point that. I suspect that MSD would get preference over football creditors. Obviously it's likely that whoever buys the club would have the funds to pay off both (or if the club was dissolved then there would be enough to cover it) but it does show a risk with these loans.

All loans come with such risk. The only people that get loans without risk are those that don’t need loans.

Suspect this is another ploy by Morris to wipe out the debt and buy the club back debt free using a third party.

elwaclaret wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 08, 2021 12:38 pm

All loans come with such risk. The only people that get loans without risk are those that don’t need loans.

Well the risk is higher for football clubs as, if you can't repay the football creditors, you can't be re-admitted to the league.

aggi wrote: ↑

Fri Oct 08, 2021 2:59 pm

Well the risk is higher for football clubs as, if you can't repay the football creditors, you can't be re-admitted to the league.

That's also why the law was changed recently to make sure that HMRC was also higher up in the payment order. I could never imagine why someone (football authorities or politicians) thought it was right that the tax due from well paid footballers could go unpaid in the event that their club overspent and became insolvent.

Always worth remembering- it's the Derby way.

https://twitter.com/SkySportsPL/status/ ... 1DlfA&s=19

Wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for Derby

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 10, 2021 10:22 am

https://twitter.com/SkySportsPL/status/ ... 1DlfA&s=19

Wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for Derby

Agree, but I doubt some of them would treat him any differently to Newcastle fans. Derby had their days in the sun with Clough and around that period… but now anything less is viewed as falling short; they’d be bouncing if they got up…. But like some Burnley fans, give them a couple of years success and they become Billy big balls.

At least he won't be able to asset strip it - there aren't any.

Billy Balfour wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 10, 2021 4:17 pm

At least he won't be able to asset strip it - there aren't any.

He didn't asset strip Newcastle

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/ ... 112331.amp

Wycombe have handed Derby's administrators a bill for £6 million, the difference between championship and League 1 TV money.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:09 pm

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/ ... 112331.amp

Wycombe have handed Derby's administrators a bill for £6 million, the difference between championship and League 1 TV money.

That's enough to make your hair fall out.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:09 pm

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/ ... 112331.amp

Wycombe have handed Derby's administrators a bill for £6 million, the difference between championship and League 1 TV money.

Sounds like a stunt. Can't imagine they'll get any of that. Particularly not with MSD trying to get their cash.

https://twitter.com/reluctantnicko/stat ... 1aJHQ&s=19

Getting closer to a decision on the final points deduction and then the takeover which is waiting the result of that.

https://mol.im/a/10263765

The prospective owners are claiming the outstanding tax bill of £29 million is making a deal unlikely and they want HMRC to waive 3/4's of it or risk the club disappearing..

Not sure HMRC will agree to this one.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 02, 2021 11:19 am

https://mol.im/a/10263765

The prospective owners are claiming the outstanding tax bill of £29 million is making a deal unlikely and they want HMRC to waive 3/4's of it or risk the club disappearing..

Not sure HMRC will agree to this one.

Can't see any of that debt being waived at all....the potential new owners are clutching at straws there me thinks!

Best they can hope for is a very long repayment plan.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 10, 2021 6:04 pm

He didn't asset strip Newcastle

No, although you wouldn't have thought so if you'd listened to the whingeing Geordies.

He bankrolled them and pumped in millions of pounds to keep them afloat.

Could be tears...probably not.

ClaretDiver wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 02, 2021 12:17 pm

Can't see any of that debt being waived at all....the potential new owners are clutching at straws there me thinks!

Absolutely. HMRC will want every penny owed to.them.and will charge 10% more and more as the debt goes on.

Liquidate them. About time a football club got what they deserved for their gross mismanagement.

The saying is the two things you cannot avoid in.life are taxes and death, will they get away with it though ?

https://twitter.com/SkySportsNews/statu ... x6r-A&s=19

It's not looking good for derby

https://twitter.com/reluctantnicko/stat ... 2dynA&s=19

EFL have blocked Derby from offering contract extensions or signing more players.
Jagielka was due to extend his contract...

jedi_master wrote: ↑

Fri Sep 17, 2021 9:07 pm

A year ago they must have known their position if they didn’t get promoted.

It didn’t stop them hiring Philip Cocu, signing that Polish lad for millions along with Jordon Ibe on significant money and, oh, Wayne Rooney!!!

They have reaped what they have sown with this, it’s been coming years. Overspending since 2013 and nothing to show for it.

Leicester got away with it some years ago - look at them now!

Mike Ashley will be ready in the wings.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 14, 2022 12:32 pm

https://twitter.com/reluctantnicko/stat ... 2dynA&s=19

EFL have blocked Derby from offering contract extensions or signing more players.
Jagielka was due to extend his contract...

Get on the phone Sean ...

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Fri Sep 17, 2021 9:22 pm

They behaved like Bolton fans for years, loving having their owner continue to poor money into the club to inflate their league position, constantly finding ways to dodge FFP and stick 2 fingers up to the EFL etc.

Now they're weeping and wailing on social media, but they're ignoring their past attitudes and behaviour, just like Bolton fans.

Comments like this make me laugh. It’s as if Burnley fans are somehow superior.
Well I’m sorry folks, we’re not, we’re just like the rest of ‘em.

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 14, 2022 12:32 pm

https://twitter.com/reluctantnicko/stat ... 2dynA&s=19

EFL have blocked Derby from offering contract extensions or signing more players.
Jagielka was due to extend his contract...

Surely the perfect time to nab a couple of bargains, is Knight still with them, or has he moved on yet?

Just checked and he's still with them for now, 18 months on his contract, and they need the money ASAP, I'd go in with a bid of 5-7m, and see what response we get, plus his Irish colleague Nathan Collins could hopefully put in a good word or two for us.

chekhov wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 14, 2022 1:40 pm

Comments like this make me laugh. It’s as if Burnley fans are somehow superior.
Well I’m sorry folks, we’re not, we’re just like the rest of ‘em.

To be fair the club has been run, like a business without gambling on big bets - investment and also the club have improved infrastructure. Prior to ALK completely debt free, so id say were not completely like the rest of them

Goalposts wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 14, 2022 4:14 pm

To be fair the club has been run, like a business without gambling on big bets - investment and also the club have improved infrastructure. Prior to ALK completely debt free, so id say were not completely like the rest of them

Arguably that has been at the expense of investment in the squad to raise the liquidity to facilitate ALKs leveraged buy out.

Goalposts wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 14, 2022 4:14 pm

To be fair the club has been run, like a business without gambling on big bets - investment and also the club have improved infrastructure. Prior to ALK completely debt free, so id say were not completely like the rest of them

I’m talking about the fans. The fans of one club are the same as any other.