Safe standing allowed from 2022

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Devils_Advocate
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by Devils_Advocate » Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:16 pm

chekhov wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:07 pm
I would imagine he’ll post something on here if he gets a response from Mr Pace, so I wouldn’t be concerned about not being kept in the loop.
I can't always read every post on this messageboard so Id appreciate if he made some effort to let me know if he gets a response. I dont think thats too much to ask, do you?

chekhov
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by chekhov » Thu Sep 23, 2021 9:15 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 7:16 pm
I can't always read every post on this messageboard
As someone who reads a lot of posts on this message board, I’d estimate you do a pretty good job of keeping tabs on what people post.
;)
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Dyched
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by Dyched » Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:10 pm

TsarBomba wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:52 pm
It absolutely isn’t.

You have thousands of fans up and down the country standing in all seater stadiums, which is far more dangerous.

There have been lots of serious injuries with fans falling forward/backwards, causing a domino effect.

Edit- you have the elderly and young kids being forced to stand and missing the action because those in front are blocking their view.

I don’t know why some fans automatically think safe standing equals a return to hooliganism, we get that anyway.
I agree with all that.

But. There needs to be a firm “no standing” in seated areas. There needs to be routine checks if tickets during games. Groups of “lads” will stand together regardless of where their ticket states they should be.
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chekhov
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by chekhov » Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:25 am

Ostensibly, all seater stadiums were not introduced to combat hooliganism. It was to prevent incidents like that at Hillsborough occurring again, which was caused… not by the fact of people standing, but by bad policing of a football match, poor terrace design, and consequent overcrowding. The whole Taylor report recommendations were misguided and completely wrong in my opinion. We should have kept the terracing, or at the very least retained standing in some form, and concentrated on better policing and stadium design.
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Claretforever
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by Claretforever » Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:02 am

I can’t see how anybody would think rail seating is a bad idea, unless they totally miss the point and think it’s a return to open terracing?

Even for the less able amongst us, mainly those of us who are ageing and can’t face standing in seated areas all game the bar at the front will enable people to lean against it, taking strain off the joints. And it’s only for some areas of the ground which should ensure people aren’t standing in normal seating areas.
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by ClaretTony » Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:06 am

Claretforever wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:02 am
I can’t see how anybody would think rail seating is a bad idea, unless they totally miss the point and think it’s a return to open terracing?

Even for the less able amongst us, mainly those of us who are ageing and can’t face standing in seated areas all game the bar at the front will enable people to lean against it, taking strain off the joints. And it’s only for some areas of the ground which should ensure people aren’t standing in normal seating areas.
Couldn't agree more with that. It is beyond me why anyone should consider it a bad idea and regarding being able to lean against it, I know from experience (Spurs in 2019/20, and Everton recently with a wall to lean on) how much difference it makes to my knees, I'll probably have to stand with no support at Leicester tomorrow and I'll pay for that on Sunday and Monday.

On another note, the club have been contacted by Burnley FC Supporters Groups asking their views on this and whether they will be making an application to trial it,
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beddie
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by beddie » Fri Sep 24, 2021 11:50 am

I’m obviously not getting this. Okay I prefer to sit so I wouldn’t go in a rail/ seated area. How is it decided whether you sit or stand at the game or is it up to the individual. If you sit and the people in front stand then you’ve no view. What’s the point of a seat apart from sitting before and at half time you might as well just have rails.

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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by Claretforever » Fri Sep 24, 2021 11:58 am

beddie wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 11:50 am
I’m obviously not getting this. Okay I prefer to sit so I wouldn’t go in a rail/ seated area. How is it decided whether you sit or stand at the game or is it up to the individual. If you sit and the people in front stand then you’ve no view. What’s the point of a seat apart from sitting before and at half time you might as well just have rails.
You’re absolutely right to question the point of the seat, as the area will almost always mean people stand. I think the point of the seat for now is that it’s being sold as a safer environment to watch football, for the odd moment when people stand during games rather than permanent areas.

Also, in European competitions it has to be all seater currently, so Dortmund’s yellow wall, for example, is converted from a 24,000 open terrace to a 14,000 seater stand for Champions League games. The flip down seats mean that conversion isn’t needed.

They are pretty pointless for most people though.

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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by ClaretTony » Fri Sep 24, 2021 11:59 am

beddie wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 11:50 am
I’m obviously not getting this. Okay I prefer to sit so I wouldn’t go in a rail/ seated area. How is it decided whether you sit or stand at the game or is it up to the individual. If you sit and the people in front stand then you’ve no view. What’s the point of a seat apart from sitting before and at half time you might as well just have rails.
There would be standing areas and seating areas. The German model for safe standing is seats with rails for European games with the seats fastened up to become a standing area for Bundesliga games. You won't have someone sat on a seat in one row with someone standing in front.

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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by Claret » Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:16 pm

chekhov wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:25 am
Ostensibly, all seater stadiums were not introduced to combat hooliganism. It was to prevent incidents like that at Hillsborough occurring again, which was caused… not by the fact of people standing, but by bad policing of a football match, poor terrace design, and consequent overcrowding. The whole Taylor report recommendations were misguided and completely wrong in my opinion. We should have kept the terracing, or at the very least retained standing in some form, and concentrated on better policing and stadium design.
This is spot on, Chekhov.
They used a sledgehammer to crack an egg when all that was probably needed were proper signs, controls over numbers and reducing the size of the big terraces.
My god, how ridiculous a design was that Leppngs Lane End? Supporters funnelled into a tunnel - the only way in or out - to then end up in a section that not only had fencing along the front but also fencing on either side creating a deadly trap. It still could have been safe if a couple of officers had been positioned at the tunnel entrance to point people to the half empty side enclosures.

Quickenthetempo
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by Quickenthetempo » Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:33 pm

Claret wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:16 pm
This is spot on, Chekhov.
They used a sledgehammer to crack an egg when all that was probably needed were proper signs, controls over numbers and reducing the size of the big terraces.
My god, how ridiculous a design was that Leppngs Lane End? Supporters funnelled into a tunnel - the only way in or out - to then end up in a section that not only had fencing along the front but also fencing on either side creating a deadly trap. It still could have been safe if a couple of officers had been positioned at the tunnel entrance to point people to the half empty side enclosures.
Amazingly our owners have inadequate signage outside the longside, that causes massive queues for entry. Luckily it's outside but it doesn't give you confidence in them.

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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by ClaretTony » Fri Sep 24, 2021 1:34 pm

Quickenthetempo wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 12:33 pm
Amazingly our owners have inadequate signage outside the longside, that causes massive queues for entry. Luckily it's outside but it doesn't give you confidence in them.
Was there yesterday for a meeting and the signage on the Jimmy Mac is every bit as confusing.

Gordaleman
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by Gordaleman » Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:39 am

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 5:24 pm
Can you let me know as well please?
As Chekhov says, I'll let everyone know if I get a response.

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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by Roosterbooster » Thu Oct 07, 2021 1:25 pm

Apparently applications for the trial have now closed. Only 6 PL/ Championship clubs apllied

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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by jrgbfc » Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:28 pm

Roosterbooster wrote:
Thu Oct 07, 2021 1:25 pm
Apparently applications for the trial have now closed. Only 6 PL/ Championship clubs apllied
I'm guessing the clubs would need the rail seating already in place though? Was always going to be a limited number.

claretburns
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Re: Safe standing allowed from 2022

Post by claretburns » Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:30 pm

The big change will likely come next summer.

I can imagine the 6 will include Chelsea, United, Tottenham, Wolves, West Brom and one other. The clubs mentioned already have rail seating installed.

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