Grim

[Boss Hogg]

When do the exciting times arrive?

When Dale Stephens signs a new contract.

[claretandbluesky]

Interesting well thought out response Jedi, only thing I’d disagree with is about the use of resources when we had our time in the sun. For me it had to be attracting young talent and that probably required the annual sale of one of our players. I’m afraid that has been one of SD’s failings, he really prefers dealing with older pros and young players need exposure to progress. With his successful but rather rigid regime it probably doesn’t appear the best place for a young player to head. An amalgam of Howe and Dyche would be about perfect as a manager.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Good news, Jim White etc are going to obsess over us again today
Must be a slow news month because we're becoming a regular discussion point these last few weeks.

[GodIsADeeJay81]

Interesting well thought out response Jedi, only thing I’d disagree with is about the use of resources when we had our time in the sun. For me it had to be attracting young talent and that probably required the annual sale of one of our players. I’m afraid that has been one of SD’s failings, he really prefers dealing with older pros and young players need exposure to progress. With his successful but rather rigid regime it probably doesn’t appear the best place for a young player to head. An amalgam of Howe and Dyche would be about perfect as a manager.

It takes time for the academy to start producing players of the required standard.
There's the real possibility that Dyche isn't turning to the current crop because they're just not good enough.

[daveisaclaret]

I think the challenge should be, is it possible to find anybody who isn't a Burnley fan but knows about the ownership at Burnley FC and thinks it's anything but a disaster waiting to happen?

It's not a bad thing to go through life in claret-tinted specs, but it isn't kidding anyone else.

[claretandbluesky]

That might be the case although we saw enough of Mancini to think he might feature.
What I was suggesting was the purchase of young talent ready to fight for a place in the side. SD has often it would appear preferred to pad the squad out with older players.

[Boss Hogg]

Not sure this article tells us much we didn’t already know. I don’t mind watching Championship football but the financial side concerns me if we are relegated. I just don’t see how the numbers stack up if we stay down for a while. Once the parachute money stops it’s hard to see how we get back with debt that needs servicing and less income. Strangely I think the Pace model is fine in the PL but we need change on the pitch to retain our PL status from a financial perspective. It’s whether the current management team are the right team to change our woeful displays and form. Despite the previous board lining their own pockets IMO we would be better off in the Championship under this regime with no debt and Dyche in charge ( as we were).

[GodIsADeeJay81]

That might be the case although we saw enough of Mancini to think he might feature.
What I was suggesting was the purchase of young talent ready to fight for a place in the side. SD has often it would appear preferred to pad the squad out with older players.

Pope, Taylor, Brownhill, Collins, Keane are some I can name as younger players who came in and had to fight for a place in the side.

[Spijed]

I think the challenge should be, is it possible to find anybody who isn't a Burnley fan but knows about the ownership at Burnley FC and thinks it's anything but a disaster waiting to happen?

It's not a bad thing to go through life in claret-tinted specs, but it isn't kidding anyone else.

I think there are quite a few Burnley fans/accountants on here who have been honest in their appraisal about the current situation.

[dushanbe]

The thing that has always slightly puzzled me is if its purely about money, there must be thousands of businesses (that Pace doesn't fully understand), that he could have used a leveraged buy out to gain control of, but which don't have the massive downsides that owning a football club has.

[Jakubclaret]

I think there are quite a few Burnley fans/accountants on here who have been honest in their appraisal about the current situation.

Far more concerns have been raised than reassurances, the reassurances are founded on - they know what they doing & AP is an experienced businessman who can make this work blah blah kind of thing & praising the model in unlike comparisons with bigger heavyweight clubs.

[Quickenthetempo]

It takes time for the academy to start producing players of the required standard.
There's the real possibility that Dyche isn't turning to the current crop because they're just not good enough.

I would say good coaching is what's needed.

Sadly we don't seem to see much evidence of our players improving in the academy.

From what little I see, it seems the teams are set up to copy the first teams dull style of football and not concentrate on improving individuals.

[dsr]

Interesting well thought out response Jedi, only thing I’d disagree with is about the use of resources when we had our time in the sun. For me it had to be attracting young talent and that probably required the annual sale of one of our players. I’m afraid that has been one of SD’s failings, he really prefers dealing with older pros and young players need exposure to progress. With his successful but rather rigid regime it probably doesn’t appear the best place for a young player to head. An amalgam of Howe and Dyche would be about perfect as a manager.

Very few clubs make a success out of selling their best players, either. Look at last season, for example. If we had in previous years sold Tarkowski, Pope and McNeil, would we have stayed up last year with the replacements? Who can tell? But the chances of having replacements as good as they were, has to be considered as possible rather than probable.

[Winstonswhite]

The thing that has always slightly puzzled me is if its purely about money, there must be thousands of businesses (that Pace doesn't fully understand), that he could have used a leveraged buy out to gain control of, but which don't have the massive downsides that owning a football club has.

I may well be wrong but I’ve always been of the opinion that Pace is just a massive football fan who through his connections was able to buy a “soccer club in the best league in the world” ridiculously cheap with very little of his own money.

Like you say there are infinite less risky ways to make money- especially for an American who has worked on Wall Street for how many years.

[jojomk1]

Can I just say- Everyone knew this back when Pace & Co signed and bought the club. It’s a structured takeover. Nothing has changed since when they took over besides they are waiting for TV money.We knew then that they didn’t have all the money. First of all, this proves that Pace & Co aren’t pocketing player sale money. (I.E. Wood). Second, they knew ahead of time that they had to be active in the market in January. Now, after Woods sale more than ever. We knew they needed TV money to fund the deal. Stay up or go down they have a contingency. They initially sought out championship clubs to work with because the finance wasn’t great. Garlick has an emergency pull cord at any point. “All parties were aligned and in agreement.” So in reality, nothings changed. They haven’t missed their payment so, not to be worried yet.

Also- if I was say, a Saudi backed team with infinite money, and I knew my opponent has a decent chance of staying up over than me but has a glaring spot that doesn’t look good I’d exploit that. Id encourage tabloids to pop up etc. this casting doubt to any prospective signings. I’d also buy their lead goal scorer even if I don’t necessarily want him because I know it will make it difficult.

I swear, I’ll be the first to admit that I’m proven wrong if it be the case but I believe we are on the cusp of player purchases and, nothing changes until the folks owed money raise red flags. So far not one has been made by anyone who has been owes money including MSD holdings or whatever.

They are probably saying to Garlick that we need this fodder to stay up because they (our new owners) aren’t loaded.

Also- Pace is a very devout Mormon. He’s be shunned by his church if he stripped a club of its assets or faulted his loans and deprived people of wages. The man can’t even have caffeine it’s that strict.

Just my two cents and I’m biased because I’m American but there is no need to panic until the window closes and the only person we’ve brought in is Andy Carroll.

Thank you Mrs Pace

I'm sure Alan is trying his best

He may be back home sooner than you think

[Quickenthetempo]

The good news is, last time I was told uninspiring things about ALK and Alan Pace, they went and signed Cornet.

Here's to a repeat. UTC

[bodge]

February 1st will be a day when the state of the club should become clear, or at least it will be a barometer of what the current owners intentions are.

Personally i live in hope of Matt Moulding getting involved at some point, now that is where there is some serious money.

[Winstonswhite]

February 1st will be a day when the state of the club should become clear, or at least it will be a barometer of what the current owners intentions are.

Personally i live in hope of Matt Moulding getting involved at some point, now that is where there is some serious money.

I take it you’re joking?

His company has dropped in value by an astronomical 75% in the last year. I think he’s got bigger things to worry about

[claret2018]

I wouldn’t want MM anywhere near our club.

[bodge]

"Involved at some point".

[Papabendi]

For those going into meltdown regarding a Daily Mail article - I will ask a simple question. Do you think ALK had a 1 year plan or a long term plan to grow the club i.e. over say, a ten year horizon? And do you think a 1 year view that hasn't quite panned out as they planned when the club was acquired during COVID has them in a tailspin?

The last leg of this transfer window will tell us where they are at regarding this current season, my sense is they are sanguine regarding a relegation.

[Devils_Advocate]

Separated at birth

We get told many times on this messageboard that the daily mail cannot be trusted....

The anti daily mail brigade must be having a lie in this morning.

You've obviously missed all the posters who usually dismiss anything reported in the mail, and are normally extremely vocal about it, but haven't yet appeared this morning

[Jamesy]

Mormons are some of the most ruthless businessmen in the entirety of America - Salt Lake Games anyone?

Also - I guess that means don’t bring your wives on the turf gents - Pace will be after them

I think Wiscoclaret might actually be Donny Osmond

[I Don't Eat Worms]

I'd be very surprised if relegation was an issue for us - ALK had to secure significant investment from other parties who are well versed in investing, and I can't believe they would readily hand out their money if the relegation of the team that came 17th last year bankrupted the club. They would need to see a robust business model that proves that wasn't the case, which I assume Alan Pace has

This seems like a standard cashflow issue that lots of large business have and although delaying payments is not a good sign, it's only an issue if it becomes a regular occurrence

[Paul Waine]

I've read the DM article. This is an odd statement: "the revised schedule will take the payments into the next financial year, potentially enabling the owners to defer millions in tax." I'm an accountant, I've been involved in a few corporate m&a deals. Tax becomes due based on the date of the transaction - delaying any payments due has no impact on the tax payable. I'm not sure what type of tax the DM is referring to. It's not corporation tax, that is charged on the profit made by the trading entity. It's not capital gains tax, whatever gains the previous shareholders have achieved on the sale would become due based on the date of purchase. And, of course, ALK are the buyers, so no capital gains tax for them.

Anyone know any different?

If the DM can make this silly (and obvious) error in their article, it's more likely that there are lots of errors in the article. Why does the article say "fees" are due to former owners? Purchase price paid in instalments, fine, but a buyer doesn't pay "fees" to the sellers.

Best bit of the article: ALK statement "all parties are aligned and abiding by the terms of the sale."

Exciting times.

UTC

[spt_claret]

So what? So did the owner of the worlds largest and most successful private equity firm (Blackstone). You do realise he then spent 11 years at Citi, being the Global Head of several different departments. Stupid comment.

You don't know much about Citi or BlackRock.
First, BlackRock (Not Blackstone) are a very predatory corporate asset manager, Larry Fink is not someone I would personally praise or emulate.
Second, Pace's tenure at Citi was from 2008 to 2019.
From May 2008 to January 2013 Pace was Head of Americas Prime Finance at Citi, overlapping briefly as Global Head of Client Experience from September 2012 to January 2014.
From January 2014 to September 2017 he was Global Head of Investor Services Sales.
From September 2017 to October 2019 he was Global Head of Prime Futures Securities Services Sales.
All from his LinkedIn.

From 2008 to 2018 Citi have had a number of scandals:

August 2008, Citi had to repay $14m plus 4m penalties for removing balances from customer accounts, this began long before Pace joined Citi.
https://www.sfgate.com/business/article ... 197565.php

October 2011, Citi had to pay a $285 million civil fraud penalty to the SEC for betting against high risk mortgages they sold to their clients- ie. betting to fail, disaster capitalism, profiting from financial fraud/bankruptcy. Pace was Head of Americas Prime Finance at the time.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424 ... 3051858568
https://www.propublica.org/article/did- ... ears-it-on

In 2015, they had to pay $770 million to borrowers for illegal credit card practices where they misrepresented services, costs and charged customers for services they didn't use. Pace was Head of Investor Services Sales at the time.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... PJ20150721

In March 2017, Citi were named in an investigation as having laundered $37 million in Russian money between 2010 and 2014 as part of a wider money laundering scheme which also implicated Bank of America, HSBC and the KGB/FSB. Pace was Global Head of Investor Services Sales when Citi was named, he was Head of Americas Prime Finance and Global Head of Client Experience at the time the laundering is said to have occurred. However, nothing ever came of this investigation apart from Veacheslav Platon, a Moldovan alleged to have concocted the scheme, being sentence to 18 years in jail.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... sian-money

In June 2018 Citi paid $100 million fine for their involvement in the LIBOR scandal from 2008-2012 where they and other banks illegally manipulated interest rates to profit.Pace was Head of Americas Prime Finance at the time.
https://fortune.com/2018/06/16/citibank ... ettlement/
https://money.cnn.com/2018/06/15/news/c ... index.html

I am in no way alleging, accusing, or implying Mr Pace of personal involvement, knowledge or wrongdoing in any of these scandals, but it is just my own personal opinion that I do not feel completely comfortable with Burnley FC being owned by a person with his CV at a bank which had multiple fines & scandals, and I am deeply worried by the long-term survival of a tight-cashflow institution like Burnley Football Club. This is amplified by the terms of the takeover, this news article, and by the lack of communication regarding ALK Capital's investment plans or capabilities. I am extremely hopeful to be proved wrong and put at ease should further news emerge regarding Burnley's financial position or Mr Pace's CV & financial experience.

[Paul Waine]

I'd be very surprised if relegation was an issue for us - ALK had to secure significant investment from other parties who are well versed in investing, and I can't believe they would readily hand out their money if the relegation of the team that came 17th last year bankrupted the club. They would need to see a robust business model that proves that wasn't the case, which I assume Alan Pace has

This seems like a standard cashflow issue that lots of large business have and although delaying payments is not a good sign, it's only an issue if it becomes a regular occurrence

To be fair and accurate, ALK bought the club at the end of Dec 2020. The loan from MSD was made at that time. Burnley finished the season in May''21 in 17th - and the loan was already been in place for 5 months by then.

However, MSD are professionals and would be familiar with football clubs risking relegation - as will Alan Pace/ALK. All the appropriate due diligence would have been conducted before advancing the loan - which, as we know, is a multi-year medium term loan - and, I think I'm right in saying, that interest is "rolled up" each year, a PIK - "pay-in-kind" loan, so doesn't drain the club's cashflow.

I'm sure all the efforts are going into bringing in new players this transfer window - so, no time for Alan Pace to spend time with the media whether it is DM or TalkSport.

Exciting times.

UTC

[Paul Waine]

You don't know much about Citi or BlackRock.
First, BlackRock (Not Blackstone) are a very predatory corporate asset manager, Larry Fink is not someone I would personally praise or emulate.
Second, Pace's tenure at Citi was from 2008 to 2019.
From May 2008 to January 2013 Pace was Head of Americas Prime Finance at Citi, overlapping briefly as Global Head of Client Experience from September 2012 to January 2014.
From January 2014 to September 2017 he was Global Head of Investor Services Sales.
From September 2017 to October 2019 he was Global Head of Prime Futures Securities Services Sales.
All from his LinkedIn.

From 2008 to 2018 Citi have had a number of scandals:

August 2008, Citi had to repay $14m plus 4m penalties for removing balances from customer accounts, this began long before Pace joined Citi.
https://www.sfgate.com/business/article ... 197565.php

October 2011, Citi had to pay a $285 million civil fraud penalty to the SEC for betting against high risk mortgages they sold to their clients- ie. betting to fail, disaster capitalism, profiting from financial fraud/bankruptcy. Pace was Head of Americas Prime Finance at the time.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424 ... 3051858568
https://www.propublica.org/article/did- ... ears-it-on

In 2015, they had to pay $770 million to borrowers for illegal credit card practices where they misrepresented services, costs and charged customers for services they didn't use. Pace was Head of Investor Services Sales at the time.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... PJ20150721

In March 2017, Citi were named in an investigation as having laundered $37 million in Russian money between 2010 and 2014 as part of a wider money laundering scheme which also implicated Bank of America, HSBC and the KGB/FSB. Pace was Global Head of Investor Services Sales when Citi was named, he was Head of Americas Prime Finance and Global Head of Client Experience at the time the laundering is said to have occurred. However, nothing ever came of this investigation apart from Veacheslav Platon, a Moldovan alleged to have concocted the scheme, being sentence to 18 years in jail.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... sian-money

In June 2018 Citi paid $100 million fine for their involvement in the LIBOR scandal from 2008-2012 where they and other banks illegally manipulated interest rates to profit.Pace was Head of Americas Prime Finance at the time.
https://fortune.com/2018/06/16/citibank ... ettlement/
https://money.cnn.com/2018/06/15/news/c ... index.html

I am in no way alleging, accusing, or implying Mr Pace of personal involvement, knowledge or wrongdoing in any of these scandals, but it is just my own personal opinion that I do not feel completely comfortable with Burnley FC being owned by a person with his CV at a bank which had multiple fines & scandals, and I am deeply worried by the long-term survival of a tight-cashflow institution like Burnley Football Club. This is amplified by the terms of the takeover, this news article, and by the lack of communication regarding ALK Capital's investment plans or capabilities. I am extremely hopeful to be proved wrong and put at ease should further news emerge regarding Burnley's financial position or Mr Pace's CV & financial experience.

Hi spt_claret, I guess you know how big a bank Citi Group is? I guess you are also familiar with how long it takes regulators to take action and fine corporate entities that get something wrong? Do you know what "Prime Finance" is? It's got zero connection with the guys at Citi who were involved in the setting of Libor rates. As Libor stands for "London Inter-bank offer rate" it's quite possible that anyone involved as the Head of Americas in any business line, not just "Prime Finance" would even be in the wrong country. Similarly, high risk mortgages - that's not a Prime Finance business line. Similarly, "illegal credit card practices" is not connected with Investor Services Sales. Ditto, any failings in Citi's anti-money laundering procedures has no connection with Prime Finance or Client Experience.

BFC is in "good hands" so far as our owners are concerned - and so far as the many other football club owners are concerned.

[Milltown1882]

Can we all calm down now?

[RVclaret]

You don't know much about Citi or BlackRock.
First, BlackRock (Not Blackstone) are a very predatory corporate asset manager, Larry Fink is not someone I would personally praise or emulate.
Second, Pace's tenure at Citi was from 2008 to 2019.
From May 2008 to January 2013 Pace was Head of Americas Prime Finance at Citi, overlapping briefly as Global Head of Client Experience from September 2012 to January 2014.
From January 2014 to September 2017 he was Global Head of Investor Services Sales.
From September 2017 to October 2019 he was Global Head of Prime Futures Securities Services Sales.
All from his LinkedIn.

From 2008 to 2018 Citi have had a number of scandals:

August 2008, Citi had to repay $14m plus 4m penalties for removing balances from customer accounts, this began long before Pace joined Citi.
https://www.sfgate.com/business/article ... 197565.php

October 2011, Citi had to pay a $285 million civil fraud penalty to the SEC for betting against high risk mortgages they sold to their clients- ie. betting to fail, disaster capitalism, profiting from financial fraud/bankruptcy. Pace was Head of Americas Prime Finance at the time.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424 ... 3051858568
https://www.propublica.org/article/did- ... ears-it-on

In 2015, they had to pay $770 million to borrowers for illegal credit card practices where they misrepresented services, costs and charged customers for services they didn't use. Pace was Head of Investor Services Sales at the time.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... PJ20150721

In March 2017, Citi were named in an investigation as having laundered $37 million in Russian money between 2010 and 2014 as part of a wider money laundering scheme which also implicated Bank of America, HSBC and the KGB/FSB. Pace was Global Head of Investor Services Sales when Citi was named, he was Head of Americas Prime Finance and Global Head of Client Experience at the time the laundering is said to have occurred. However, nothing ever came of this investigation apart from Veacheslav Platon, a Moldovan alleged to have concocted the scheme, being sentence to 18 years in jail.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... sian-money

In June 2018 Citi paid $100 million fine for their involvement in the LIBOR scandal from 2008-2012 where they and other banks illegally manipulated interest rates to profit.Pace was Head of Americas Prime Finance at the time.
https://fortune.com/2018/06/16/citibank ... ettlement/
https://money.cnn.com/2018/06/15/news/c ... index.html

I am in no way alleging, accusing, or implying Mr Pace of personal involvement, knowledge or wrongdoing in any of these scandals, but it is just my own personal opinion that I do not feel completely comfortable with Burnley FC being owned by a person with his CV at a bank which had multiple fines & scandals, and I am deeply worried by the long-term survival of a tight-cashflow institution like Burnley Football Club. This is amplified by the terms of the takeover, this news article, and by the lack of communication regarding ALK Capital's investment plans or capabilities. I am extremely hopeful to be proved wrong and put at ease should further news emerge regarding Burnley's financial position or Mr Pace's CV & financial experience.

Thanks spt but I was in fact referring to Blackstone, who are in the private equity space like ALK. I have an MSc in Banking & Finance + CFA so I believe I am capable of commenting on this kind of stuff with decent knowledge.

My point being Pace and his team, who's career backgrounds also include the likes of JP Morgan, are pretty switched on people. Working in investment banking you have to know a thing or two (well quite a lot more than a thing or two) about cash flows, debt financing and growing businesses. That's why I am keeping the faith in Pace who, from interviews I have seen and comments made from football finance experts like Kieran Maguire, seems a decent guy wanting to take Burnley FC to the next level.

Regarding your comments on scandals at Citi etc, is there any bank that hasn't been involved in scandals in one way or another? Probably not.

[spt_claret]

Hi spt_claret, I guess you know how big a bank Citi Group is? I guess you are also familiar with how long it takes regulators to take action and fine corporate entities that get something wrong? Do you know what "Prime Finance" is? It's got zero connection with the guys at Citi who were involved in the setting of Libor rates. As Libor stands for "London Inter-bank offer rate" it's quite possible that anyone involved as the Head of Americas in any business line, not just "Prime Finance" would even be in the wrong country. Similarly, high risk mortgages - that's not a Prime Finance business line. Similarly, "illegal credit card practices" is not connected with Investor Services Sales. Ditto, any failings in Citi's anti-money laundering procedures has no connection with Prime Finance or Client Experience.

BFC is in "good hands" so far as our owners are concerned - and so far as the many other football club owners are concerned.

It does take regulators time, yes. This is why I'm not concerned by the first item I listed, I mentioned it purely in advance in case someone else brought it up based on the timing of the fine.
I know Libor stands for London, but global banking doesn't require you to be in London to use Libor. Bank of America is an American bank and was implicated.
Prime Finance as I understand it largely concerns funds, securities and services offered to hedgefunds and clients for long & short market positions, which is connected to high risk mortgages. See the subprime mortgage crash. I'm happy to be corrected on this.
The credit practices were relate to misrepresentation and mischarging of credit services- I assume you are saying credit services and general investor services are different, which makes sense to me.
Could you elaborate on what Global Client experience means?

I remain unconvinced of your final point, but thank you for the information.

[fatboy47]

Gotta love Paul.

The guy could find a brand new Hartley Davidson in a ten ton stack of rotting horse sh1t.

[spt_claret]

Thanks spt but I was in fact referring to Blackstone, who are in the private equity space like ALK. I have an MSc in Banking & Finance + CFA so I believe I am capable of commenting on this kind of stuff with decent knowledge.

My point being Pace and his team, who's career backgrounds also include the likes of JP Morgan, are pretty switched on people. Working in investment banking you have to know a thing or two (well quite a lot more than a thing or two) about cash flows, debt financing and growing businesses. That's why I am keeping the faith in Pace who, from interviews I have seen and comments made from football finance experts like Kieran Maguire, seems a decent guy wanting to take Burnley FC to the next level.

Regarding your comments on scandals at Citi etc, is there any bank that hasn't been involved in scandals in one way or another? Probably not.

Apologies, I am much more familiar with Blackrock than Blackstone.
All banks being involvedin scandals isn't exactly reassuring. I hope you are right about Pace, however.

Can we all calm down now?

This is more reassuring. Thank you.

[Sleeping Cat]

Can we all calm down now?

If you request an extension to pay an instalment, which is then paid within that extended time frame, I guess you could say it was technically paid on time. Because ALK certainly did not pay the first instalment on the initial date agreed.

[RVclaret]

Can we all calm down now?

There we go - well what a load of nonsense this thread has seen.

[fatboy47]

There we go - well what a load of nonsense this thread has seen.

Yep.. Let's all sit back and enjoy welcoming Woods replacement and the other team strengthening over the next 11 days.

[ClaretTony]

If you request an extension to pay an instalment, which is then paid within that extended time frame, I guess you could say it was technically paid on time. Because ALK certainly did not pay the first instalment on the initial date agreed.

Which sort of fits in with what Pace has said today

[RVclaret]

Yep.. Let's all sit back and enjoy welcoming Woods replacement and the other team strengthening over the next 11 days.

Let's see what gets done. By all accounts reports suggest they are trying to bring players in (e.g. Nixon saying we were willing to pay the fee for Benteke which was 10m+). Bidding for them is one thing but can they be convinced to join a relegation threatened team, likely with a large relegation wage cut?

[Backofthenet]

Separated at birth

I've no idea what you are trying to show, but it's pretty sad you spend time and effort, probably trying to get someone, who you don't know, has never been rude to you, banned from a football messageboard
I mentioned a few weeks ago that I knew someone who had been banned from here, which seemed to spark a weird interest from you. That friend was banned several years ago, and sadly passed away 2 year ago, so poses you no threat.

[Sleeping Cat]

Which sort of fits in with what Pace has said today

It does. Give them their dues, ALK are decent at PR.

[Devils_Advocate]

I've no idea what you are trying to show, but it's pretty sad you spend time and effort, probably trying to get someone, who you don't know, has never been rude to you, banned from a football messageboard
I mentioned a few weeks ago that I knew someone who had been banned from here, which seemed to spark a weird interest from you. That friend was banned several years ago, and sadly passed away 2 year ago, so poses you no threat.

Old habits die hard Grumps and unfortunately for you and your new alter ego it shows in your posts.

[KateR]

usual storm in a tea cup, all perfectly normal business dealings but sensationalized for news.

as mentioned by a few let's wait and see the actual results on the 1st of Feb, then we can be very knowledgeable in our predictions.

[jedi_master]

It’s good he’s responded, it was very much needed.

[arise_sir_charge]

I think Alan Pace’s comments confirm what a lot of folk suspected.

The DM article was based on nothing more than the nonsense that has been written on here.

[RVclaret]

I think Alan Pace’s comments confirm what a lot of folk suspected.

The DM article was based on nothing more than the nonsense that has been written on here.

When KRBFC and NewcastleClaret are you’re main sources it’s time to hang up your boots

[NewClaret]

I think Alan Pace’s comments confirm what a lot of folk suspected.

The DM article was based on nothing more than the nonsense that has been written on here.

Yep.

Although this stuff predictably draws some bed wetting.

[joey13]

I think Alan Pace’s comments confirm what a lot of folk suspected.

The DM article was based on nothing more than the nonsense that has been written on here.

Why is the article nonsense, that’s what happened

[Sleeping Cat]

When KRBFC and NewcastleClaret are you’re main sources it’s time to hang up your boots

These rumours have been around for quite some time and resurface every now and then. They may have eventually made the payments, but there's a fire somewhere causing this smoke.

[claretandbluesky]

I think for most fans the problem is simple.
When we had 50 million in the bank it looked certain we could survive over a number of years. Most accepted we could be a yo-yo club or maybe settle down to being a Championship side, but we would exist.
What was and remains concerning is the fact that our survival now appears to depend on both growth of our revenues and maintenance of our ability to be at the top table, when everything points to the club having diminishing assets, lack of growth potential and what appears like instability ahead.
As a country we are heading into economically turbulent times and that is when the weakest go to the wall.
Financially to the lay person at least our house appears to be built on sand rather than rock.
That element of risk may well appeal to some but to most it possess a problem, particularly in a club which means so much to the town and its people.
The Board need to be much more transparent in their dealings with the fans and fully explain how they might deal with descent into Division 1 because given our position that is a possibility.

[jedi_master]

I think for most fans the problem is simple.
When we had 50 million in the bank it looked certain we could survive over a number of years. Most accepted we could be a yo-yo club or maybe settle down to being a Championship side, but we would exist.
What was and remains concerning is the fact that our survival now appears to depend on both growth of our revenues and maintenance of our ability to be at the top table, when everything points to the club having diminishing assets, lack of growth potential and what appears like instability ahead.
As a country we are heading into economically turbulent times and that is when the weakest go to the wall.
Financially to the lay person at least our house appears to be built on sand rather than rock.
That element of risk may well appeal to some but to most it possess a problem, particularly in a club which means so much to the town and its people.
The Board need to be much more transparent in their dealings with the fans and fully explain how they might deal with descent into Division 1 because given our position that is a possibility.

Agree with all of this.

The facts are we have a £60m loan to Dell to repay, loans to Garlick and Banasciewicz to pay, and the repayments as they stand are deemed serviceable on Premier League TV monies.

All fans want to know is if we go down this season, are the repayments going to have to be met by selling anything that’s not bolted down and our parachute payments? If they are, how do we expect to renew our squad who are mostly 30+ or out of contract (or both).