Russia Invades

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Aclaret
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Aclaret » Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:39 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:24 pm
Laancaster, please don’t encourage nonsense posters on this thread by engaging with them.
I Love reading Lancasters views on this thread, and no I'm not that dumb that I believe it's all Western propaganda, 2 sides to every coin they say ! With all the evidence put before me, Putin and his cronies from the Kremlin are to blame for all of this WAR against the Ukraine population....

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:41 pm

Aclaret wrote:
Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:39 pm
I Love reading Lancasters views on this thread, and no I'm not that dumb that I believe it's all Western propaganda, 2 sides to every coin they say ! With all the evidence put before me, Putin and his cronies from the Kremlin are to blame for all of this WAR against the Ukraine population....
Never thought that years of reading about the Eastern Front would come in so useful

Its still a huge surprise just how the issues of 1941-44 are still incredibly relevant in 2022

I still struggle to tell the difference between a T-62, a T-72 and a T-80 though!
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elwaclaret
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:52 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:
Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:33 pm
Unfair that Elwa

Its best to explain why you think like you do when you disagree with someone who clearly isn't just spamming the thread

I could go on for hours about how a lot of the Western media/commentators ideas on Russia having an internal revolution and becoming a valuable member of the democratic society are for the birds (sadly)

They have just never had it, and their experience with a flawed democracy has just made them even less likely to embrace it
Dis-information
The Moderator posted this…

I believe it is a little more complex than you have described. It can be argued that the majority of the people in Eastern Ukraine want to be governed by Russia. NO IT CAN’T.

I struggle to take Zelensky seriously as it feels like Ricky Gervais being PM of the UK. you’d prefer a KGB commander trained in East Germany… ok.

Let me be clear that I am in no way defending Putin . REALLY? He is a very dangerous individual who seems to have little respect for human life and the sooner he is no longer in power the better AND HOW IS THAT GOING TO HAPPEN BY APPEASING HIM? . But let's not portray Zelensky as some kind of super hero HE IS STANDING UP TO A THUG, RUNNING A SUPERPOWER: PRETTY HEROIC FOR A HEAD OF STATE WHOSE MAIN LIFE EXPERIENCE IS BEING A COMEDIAN . He openly denied bombing Poland which could have had major consequences throughout Europe and the World. Even though he is Jewish WOULD UKRAINIAN WEAPONS BE LANDING IN POLAND IF RUSSIA WASN”T SENDING MISSILES INTO UKRAINE?

I am not disputing that Putin is probably guilty of all the above allegations. ME EITHER

If you only source your information from Western based media sources such as the BBC, Reueters THE INDEPENDENT INTERNATIONAL NEWS AENCY SO or CNN WHO HAS QUOTED CNN? etc.

When you only BELIEVE ANTI-WEST RETORIC YOU ONLY GET 1 side of the story that is not news it is propaganda.

Moderator

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:14 pm

KYIV INDEPENDENT:

Russian state-controlled media outlets have reportedly been prohibited from publishing any information about the mobilization in the country, even if the statements originate from Russia’s parliament, the Moscow Times reported, citing unnamed officials.

https://twitter.com/kyivindependent/sta ... VZdZOLUUPw

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:55 pm

ROB LEE: An interesting video. Two Russian Lamcet-3M loitering munitions were apparently defeated by the camouflage net over a Ukrainian T-72 tank. Of course, they could have been shot down or jammed by EW before crashing.

https://twitter.com/ralee85/status/1606 ... VZdZOLUUPw

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:58 pm

NEXTA: The maintenance of the "Wagner" PMC costs $100 million a month

This was said by the representative of the US National Security Council, John Kirby.

According to him, the PMC has already sent 10,000 contract soldiers, and 40,000 recruited prisoners

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/160 ... VZdZOLUUPw

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Fri Dec 23, 2022 11:00 pm

KYIV INDEPENDENT: In an op-ed for the Financial Times, NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg accused the Kremlin of using “invitations to negotiations” as a mere pretext to buy time for Russia to ready itself for a new offensive against Ukraine.

https://twitter.com/kyivindependent/sta ... VZdZOLUUPw

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Fri Dec 23, 2022 11:04 pm

Here we go the Dis-information agenda… remind you of anything mentioned tonight?

Garry KASPEROV: Carlson's attacks on Ukraine and Zelensky personally are designed to dehumanize and to justify Russian atrocities, which are already ongoing, documented, and publicly known. It's like still backing the Nazis after Auschwitz was uncovered. 3/10

https://twitter.com/kasparov63/status/1 ... VZdZOLUUPw

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by JarrowClaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:03 am

elwaclaret wrote:
Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:24 pm
Laancaster, please don’t encourage nonsense posters on this thread by engaging with them.
I’m sorry Elwa but that is plain wrong nothing that Anonymous wrote is nonsense a lot of it I don’t necessarily agree with but they are viewpoints that are out there and valid. The problem with both sides of this issue is that there is so much misinformation it is hard to know what is the truth and what is propaganda. Now the majority of the pro Russian view is clearly either propaganda or heavily influenced by the Russian government’s position but so is the pro Ukrainian.

A high proportion of Ukrainians in the East want to be Russian for a reason and it isn’t because everything Ukraine is sweetness and light. There has to be space on this thread for both sides of this with an open discussion as long as it is sensibly written and argued sensibly what is the problem. We are all very accepting of obvious Ukrainian propaganda I think we should also be more accepting of pro Russian comments.
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Anonymous Claret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:39 am

elwaclaret wrote:
Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:52 pm
Dis-information
The Moderator posted this…

I believe it is a little more complex than you have described. It can be argued that the majority of the people in Eastern Ukraine want to be governed by Russia. NO IT CAN’T.

I struggle to take Zelensky seriously as it feels like Ricky Gervais being PM of the UK. you’d prefer a KGB commander trained in East Germany… ok.

Let me be clear that I am in no way defending Putin . REALLY? He is a very dangerous individual who seems to have little respect for human life and the sooner he is no longer in power the better AND HOW IS THAT GOING TO HAPPEN BY APPEASING HIM? . But let's not portray Zelensky as some kind of super hero HE IS STANDING UP TO A THUG, RUNNING A SUPERPOWER: PRETTY HEROIC FOR A HEAD OF STATE WHOSE MAIN LIFE EXPERIENCE IS BEING A COMEDIAN . He openly denied bombing Poland which could have had major consequences throughout Europe and the World. Even though he is Jewish WOULD UKRAINIAN WEAPONS BE LANDING IN POLAND IF RUSSIA WASN”T SENDING MISSILES INTO UKRAINE?

I am not disputing that Putin is probably guilty of all the above allegations. ME EITHER

If you only source your information from Western based media sources such as the BBC, Reueters THE INDEPENDENT INTERNATIONAL NEWS AENCY SO or CNN WHO HAS QUOTED CNN? etc.

When you only BELIEVE ANTI-WEST RETORIC YOU ONLY GET 1 side of the story that is not news it is propaganda.

Moderator
Look I am not into falling out with my fellow clarets. As I said earlier on, we can disagree without being disagreeable.
You are running to the moderators trying to get me banned because my view is not the same as yours. That is not democratic. In fact it reeks of everything you claim to be against, right think, totalitarianism, communism etc.
Show me where I am defending Putin?

Because I don't trust Zelensky who I see as some self seeking ego driven narcissist that must mean I am a Putin sympathiser. I hold them both in contempt. To me Zelensky seems more interested with his own personal PR image hosting celebrities such as Sean Penn and Ben Stiller whilst also jetting across to the US with his begging bowl for more arms to cause more death and misery. What I have just said about Zelensky can also be applied to Putin. Do you understand that? The same view can be applied to my opinion on other world leaders. I do not trust Sunak but I am equally suspicious of Starmer. I couldn't stand the bigoted Trump but I have similar feelings towards child sniffing Biden. To me politics is not binary and it is never a case of 1 side is right and the other is wrong. That may not be the view of most people but it is the view that I hold.

It wasn't the fact that a missile ended in Poland killing 2 people it was the fact that he denied it came from his country that is the problem here. Everyone understands that 'friendly fire' incidents happen in conflict but by Zelensky refusing to admit responsibility for what appeared to be a genuine mistake his denial could have caused WW3. Fortunately despite Zelensky's denial NATO recognised where the missile came from but it could have ended so differently.

Zelensky denial of missile attack

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/17/ukraine ... trike.html

Reuters is not independent. Please have a look at all the funder partners. Look who funded Reuters with over £1,000,000 in 20-21 and come back and tell me Reuters is independent.

https://reutersinstitute.politics.ox.ac.uk/our-funders

I apologise for not thinking how you want me to think but I feel that free speech, discussion and differences of opinion should always be encouraged unless someone is being abusive.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:56 am

JarrowClaret wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:03 am
I’m sorry Elwa but that is plain wrong nothing that Anonymous wrote is nonsense a lot of it I don’t necessarily agree with but they are viewpoints that are out there and valid. The problem with both sides of this issue is that there is so much misinformation it is hard to know what is the truth and what is propaganda. Now the majority of the pro Russian view is clearly either propaganda or heavily influenced by the Russian government’s position but so is the pro Ukrainian.

A high proportion of Ukrainians in the East want to be Russian for a reason and it isn’t because everything Ukraine is sweetness and light. There has to be space on this thread for both sides of this with an open discussion as long as it is sensibly written and argued sensibly what is the problem. We are all very accepting of obvious Ukrainian propaganda I think we should also be more accepting of pro Russian comments.
Sorry Jarroow, Not being a smart ass, but my training is close reading he’s either DA type wind up merchant or it is a deliberate attempt to push CURRENT SOVIET PRACTICE for spreading disinformation. It’s a check-list… the personal Zelenski attack? What relevance is being Jewish, but to remind you he’s Jewish… and in the West we dare not question a Jewish motives? BUT… ??? Please see my follow up posts (posts from twitter following that conversation) as in the Garry Kasparov tweet.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:11 am

Anonymous Claret wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:39 am
Look I am not into falling out with my fellow clarets. As I said earlier on, we can disagree without being disagreeable.
You are running to the moderators trying to get me banned because my view is not the same as yours. That is not democratic. In fact it reeks of everything you claim to be against, right think, totalitarianism, communism etc.
Show me where I am defending Putin?

Because I don't trust Zelensky who I see as some self seeking ego driven narcissist that must mean I am a Putin sympathiser. I hold them both in contempt. To me Zelensky seems more interested with his own personal PR image hosting celebrities such as Sean Penn and Ben Stiller whilst also jetting across to the US with his begging bowl for more arms to cause more death and misery. What I have just said about Zelensky can also be applied to Putin. Do you understand that? The same view can be applied to my opinion on other world leaders. I do not trust Sunak but I am equally suspicious of Starmer. I couldn't stand the bigoted Trump but I have similar feelings towards child sniffing Biden. To me politics is not binary and it is never a case of 1 side is right and the other is wrong. That may not be the view of most people but it is the view that I hold.

It wasn't the fact that a missile ended in Poland killing 2 people it was the fact that he denied it came from his country that is the problem here. Everyone understands that 'friendly fire' incidents happen in conflict but by Zelensky refusing to admit responsibility for what appeared to be a genuine mistake his denial could have caused WW3. Fortunately despite Zelensky's denial NATO recognised where the missile came from but it could have ended so differently.

Zelensky denial of missile attack

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/17/ukraine ... trike.html

Reuters is not independent. Please have a look at all the funder partners. Look who funded Reuters with over £1,000,000 in 20-21 and come back and tell me Reuters is independent.

https://reutersinstitute.politics.ox.ac.uk/our-funders

I apologise for not thinking how you want me to think but I feel that free speech, discussion and differences of opinion should always be encouraged unless someone is being abusive.
So your sudden interest in this topic is due to a sudden flash of inspiration?

So you just happen to attack Zelensky the day after Garry Kasparov warned that is exactly what to expect to be coming as Russia look to even the scales for potential war crimes?

Nice try playing the victim, some I wouldn’t expect seem to be going with it.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:13 am

Oh… and I did not “go running to a moderator” you know a lot for a newbie.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:21 am

I suspect this is the Navy Bloke who was trying to push his ‘alternative news’ channel the other day. He makes his living now peddling his anti press rhetoric, and conspiracy theories. Watch the advert reappear…

(By the way if I’m right you might want to help him out think he has some court appearances coming up, so new converts are more than welcome.)
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Anonymous Claret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 8:12 am

elwaclaret wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:21 am
I suspect this is the Navy Bloke who was trying to push his ‘alternative news’ channel the other day. He makes his living now peddling his anti press rhetoric, and conspiracy theories. Watch the advert reappear…

(By the way if I’m right you might want to help him out think he has some court appearances coming up, so new converts are more than welcome.)
That is some imaginative mind that you have Elwa. I have been a long time viewer of this board and the previous board for many years. I have a little more time on my hands and thought I would contribute to some of the topics. I didn't expect to be called out as a Russian BOT or disinformation agent for having an alternative opinion:lol: .

As I have already said I am a Clarets fan of nearly 50 years. I have been in the BLS for over 20 years. I may not be able to make the Brum game and that will be the first home league game that I have missed all season. I will be at Stoke on Friday.

It may be a suggestion to try and listen to Jarrow Claret and Lancaster Claret in accepting that some people happen to have different opinions to yourself. It is ok for you not to agree with those opinions as we do live in a democracy, (at the moment anyway but that's another story).

I will finish on this to clarify once again that I have no time whatsoever for Putin. I see him as an egotistical, arrogant psychopath who has little or no regard for human life. That doesn't mean that I have to think Zelensky is wonderful.

I really want to stay off this thread now but if I feel that if I am unjustifiably attacked or accused of being a Russian agent, I may feel the need to defend myself again.

That aside I hope that you have an enjoyable festive period with family and loved ones.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Anonymous Claret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 8:15 am

elwaclaret wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:21 am
I suspect this is the Navy Bloke who was trying to push his ‘alternative news’ channel the other day. He makes his living now peddling his anti press rhetoric, and conspiracy theories. Watch the advert reappear…

(By the way if I’m right you might want to help him out think he has some court appearances coming up, so new converts are more than welcome.)
I don't like this quote by the way. I was trying to remove the like and ended up liking it again.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Hipper » Sat Dec 24, 2022 11:49 am

Anonymous Claret wrote:
Fri Dec 23, 2022 4:15 pm
I believe it is a little more complex than you have described. It can be argued that the majority of the people in Eastern Ukraine want to be governed by Russia. NO IT CAN’T.

I struggle to take Zelensky seriously as it feels like Ricky Gervais being PM of the UK. you’d prefer a KGB commander trained in East Germany… ok.

Let me be clear that I am in no way defending Putin . REALLY? He is a very dangerous individual who seems to have little respect for human life and the sooner he is no longer in power the better AND HOW IS THAT GOING TO HAPPEN BY APPEASING HIM? . But let's not portray Zelensky as some kind of super hero HE IS STANDING UP TO A THUG, RUNNING A SUPERPOWER: PRETTY HEROIC FOR A HEAD OF STATE WHOSE MAIN LIFE EXPERIENCE IS BEING A COMEDIAN . He openly denied bombing Poland which could have had major consequences throughout Europe and the World. Even though he is Jewish WOULD UKRAINIAN WEAPONS BE LANDING IN POLAND IF RUSSIA WASN”T SENDING MISSILES INTO UKRAINE?

I am not disputing that Putin is probably guilty of all the above allegations. ME EITHER

If you only source your information from Western based media sources such as the BBC, Reueters THE INDEPENDENT INTERNATIONAL NEWS AGENCY SO or CNN WHO HAS QUOTED CNN? etc.

When you only BELIEVE ANTI-WEST RETORIC YOU ONLY GET 1 side of the story that is not news it is propaganda.

Moderator
I looked at the other posts of Anonymous Claret and it seems to me he is a genuine Claret and not a 'Russian Bot' as some have suggested.

In addition I think the response to his post at by the 'Moderator' is completely out of order and over stepping the job of a proper moderator, which is surely to remove harmful posts, not to comment on them in the way he did. All he needed to do to do that is post his views in the way the rest of us do.

I made my comments on Anonymous Clarets original post and will not comment further as this is an excellent thread and I want it to continue. Everyone - me, others, and the Moderators, need to behave.
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by bfcjg » Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:32 pm

Hipper is a Bot as well 😁😁

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lancasterclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:46 pm

https://www.reuters.com/investigates/sp ... d-ukraine/

Reuters choices of pics of the year from Ukraine (warning, shows injuries and death)

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Dark Cloud » Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:50 pm

At the end of the day there's only one piece of "information" that really matters and I'm pretty certain that absolutely nobody will argue with it. Russia, totally unprovoked, invaded Ukraine. That's all! After that the entire miasma of information, dis information, propaganda, truth hiding, moral arguments, bluffing, media blocking etc, etc don't really matter one jot, as they are simply part of any war and always have been.
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by elwaclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:55 pm

I shall make no further comment on this thread… lets see how long the thread lasts with the conspiracy theories.

All the best for Christmas all of you

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Paul Waine » Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:07 pm

Earlier this week I listened to Dr Fiona Hill deliver (one of) this year's Reith lectures on BBC R4. Dr Hill spoke about the situation in Ukraine and Russia. The longer version of her lecture, plus some Q&A, is available on BBC Sounds.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Paul Waine » Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:13 pm

Anonymous Claret wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 12:39 am

Reuters is not independent. Please have a look at all the funder partners. Look who funded Reuters with over £1,000,000 in 20-21 and come back and tell me Reuters is independent.

https://reutersinstitute.politics.ox.ac.uk/our-funders
The Reuters Institute for the Study of Journalism is not the same as Reuters News Agency.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Clovius Boofus » Sat Dec 24, 2022 1:19 pm

Whatever your views, let's hope the new year brings about a negotiated peace that Ukraine can freely sign up to. Too many lives, on both sides, have already been lost.
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lowbankclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 6:36 pm

Anonymous Claret wrote:
Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:05 pm
I am a long standing Clarets fan for nearly 50 years. My first game was Brighton in the 1972-73 promotion season but you feel free to call me a Russian BOT because I question the official narrative churned out by Western media sources.
One thing that the last couple of years has taught me is to not believe anything from the MSM without checking other sources first.
You obviously missed the points where I said I think that Putin is a narcissistic psychopath and the sooner he is out of power the better. I will add to that his invasion of Ukraine is despicable and the loss of lives to Russians and Ukrainians is heartbreaking.
However the reporting of the war is very 1 sided whereas Western sources mainly originating in 1 form or another through Reuters is very pro Ukrainian and anti Russian.
I can guarantee that if you were to visit similar message boards to this in Russia they would have similar people to the posters on here believing everything that TASS says to be gospel and anything that is pro Ukrainian to be Western propaganda. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle. From the little of what I have seen from there have been atrocities committed by both Russian and Ukrainian soldiers.

I am going to respond to a couple more messages and then I am not going to engage with this thread anymore.

My only hope is that we can disagree without being disagreeable.
A claret of 50 years who joined this site less than a month ago. Happy to settle the bot issue. If your going to the Birmingham game , I ll buy you a pint in the fan zone.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by welsbyswife » Sat Dec 24, 2022 6:46 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 6:36 pm
A claret of 50 years who joined this site less than a month ago. Happy to settle the bot issue. If your going to the Birmingham game , I ll buy you a pint in the fan zone.
Are you saying you are surprised that a Claret of 50 years only joined this site last month? It's not that hard to believe. There are far more fans not on this site than there are on it.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lowbankclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 6:50 pm

welsbyswife wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 6:46 pm
Are you saying you are surprised that a Claret of 50 years only joined this site last month? It's not that hard to believe. There are far more fans not on this site than there are on it.
Just saying I find it unusual. So happy to be proved wrong and buy him/her a pint.

Joins a month ago and suddenly a prolific poster on the Russian war thread.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by welsbyswife » Sat Dec 24, 2022 6:53 pm

Stranger things happen. I only joined Twitter to read about the Ukraine situation because mainstream news was so far behind. Never posted on it though!

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lowbankclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 7:04 pm

welsbyswife wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 6:53 pm
Stranger things happen. I only joined Twitter to read about the Ukraine situation because mainstream news was so far behind. Never posted on it though!
Me too, I was on Twitter but never read or posted, but it’s the only place to get info on Ukraine. Now I look on it every day.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by LeadBelly » Sat Dec 24, 2022 7:25 pm

welsbyswife wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 6:53 pm
Stranger things happen. I only joined Twitter to read about the Ukraine situation because mainstream news was so far behind. Never posted on it though!
And another. Never posted on there but I read, each couple of days, stuff from c 10 posters who concern themselves with Ukraine situation.

MODERATOR - With Elwa having withdrawn from the thread, there is no reason ‘Anonymous’ cannot continue his fascination with the subject, other than his link will be approached with caution… which Elwa believed was kind of the point of the charade.
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lowbankclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 8:38 pm

The offer of a pint and friendly welcome will stand beyond the Brum game. If Anonymous wants to take it up.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by box_of_frogs » Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:13 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:
Fri Dec 23, 2022 9:41 pm


I still struggle to tell the difference between a T-62, a T-72 and a T-80 though!
Now I’m no AFV recognition specialist, but:

A T62 looks like an upgraded T55. Big domed turret with 5 road wheels.

A T72 has a much smaller profiled turret and 6 road wheels.

A T80 will be broken down at the side of the road.

Simples!

Lowbankclaret
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lowbankclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:18 pm

box_of_frogs wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:13 pm
Now I’m no AFV recognition specialist, but:

A T62 looks like an upgraded T55. Big domed turret with 5 road wheels.

A T72 has a much smaller profiled turret and 6 road wheels.

A T80 will be broken down at the side of the road.

Simples!
He’s not wrong. Well apart from the T80 if nor broken down, it’s run out of fuel.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by box_of_frogs » Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:29 pm

To be honest, 72s and 80s always look the same to me…

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lowbankclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:34 pm

box_of_frogs wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:29 pm
To be honest, 72s and 80s always look the same to me…
The t80 has a turbine engine, tha burns fuel on tick over the same as full on assault.
Plus it’s turbine engine is brittle and needs major maintenance

Hence it’s been dumped

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by box_of_frogs » Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:39 pm

Yeah had heard that was one of the issues. But visually they look very similar.


Especially when the turrets doing a Jack in the box….

Lancasterclaret
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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lancasterclaret » Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:39 pm

box_of_frogs wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:13 pm
Now I’m no AFV recognition specialist, but:

A T62 looks like an upgraded T55. Big domed turret with 5 road wheels.

A T72 has a much smaller profiled turret and 6 road wheels.

A T80 will be broken down at the side of the road.

Simples!
Only problem is that I don't know what a T-55 looks like.......

Now a T-34 I'd be fine with!

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by box_of_frogs » Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:41 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:39 pm
Only problem is that I don't know what a T-55 looks like.......

Now a T-34 I'd be fine with!
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


Not too far off a T34 to be honest, but with a domed turret rather than the boxy T34 one!

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Anonymous Claret » Sun Dec 25, 2022 12:45 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 8:38 pm
The offer of a pint and friendly welcome will stand beyond the Brum game. If Anonymous wants to take it up.
Happy to meet up for a civil chat Lowbank but I won't be able to make it to the Fan Zone on Tuesday night. I live on the Fylde Coast and I cannot leave home until about 7.00pm so I will have to go straight on the game.

I will be going to Stoke on Friday and we will probably be stopping off for some tea around Knutsford on the way down there.

Maybe the Coventry game?

Hope that you have a peaceful and enjoyable festive period.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lowbankclaret » Sun Dec 25, 2022 1:42 pm

Anonymous Claret wrote:
Sun Dec 25, 2022 12:45 pm
Happy to meet up for a civil chat Lowbank but I won't be able to make it to the Fan Zone on Tuesday night. I live on the Fylde Coast and I cannot leave home until about 7.00pm so I will have to go straight on the game.

I will be going to Stoke on Friday and we will probably be stopping off for some tea around Knutsford on the way down there.

Maybe the Coventry game?

Hope that you have a peaceful and enjoyable festive period.
Merry Christmas, have a great day.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sun Dec 25, 2022 3:51 pm

https://twitter.com/officejjsmart/statu ... qIBbg&s=19

Looks like Russian banks are having problems

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Volvoclaret » Sun Dec 25, 2022 7:36 pm

Lancasterclaret wrote:
Sat Dec 24, 2022 9:39 pm
Only problem is that I don't know what a T-55 looks like.......

Now a T-34 I'd be fine with!
A T55 looks like a T4 2 and a 2 4T
This user liked this post: levraiclaret

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by NewClaret » Mon Dec 26, 2022 10:19 am

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Sun Dec 25, 2022 3:51 pm
https://twitter.com/officejjsmart/statu ... qIBbg&s=19

Looks like Russian banks are having problems
Not sure this is true GIADJ, rather social media scaremongering, but some reports Putin is going to convert bank deposits to war bonds that can’t be withdrawn until the war is over next week. As I say, think it’s rubbish but if it’s not, a big development.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by NewClaret » Mon Dec 26, 2022 10:29 am

Engels airbase hit in Russia overnight, home to their nuclear capable bombers.

Russia saying the drones were shot down but 3 dead and 2 injured servicemen from the falling debris. Other reports suggesting there were two drones, one was shot down and the other hit the target.

https://mobile.twitter.com/bayraktar_1l ... 2458263552

Lots of speculation over what was hit. Some saying the runway others saying the control centre. I’m guessing the best way to take out an aircraft base is to put a crater in the runway?! Or the pilots.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Clovius Boofus » Mon Dec 26, 2022 3:16 pm

NewClaret wrote:
Mon Dec 26, 2022 10:29 am
Engels airbase hit in Russia overnight, home to their nuclear capable bombers.
It was down to good aiming that hit the marx.
This user liked this post: levraiclaret

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by box_of_frogs » Mon Dec 26, 2022 4:14 pm

NewClaret wrote:
Mon Dec 26, 2022 10:29 am
Lots of speculation over what was hit. Some saying the runway others saying the control centre. I’m guessing the best way to take out an aircraft base is to put a crater in the runway?! Or the pilots.
Runways will be both hard to damage, and easy to repair.

Planes and technical personnel (inc pilots) are both far far softer, and harder to replace.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by NewClaret » Mon Dec 26, 2022 4:36 pm

box_of_frogs wrote:
Mon Dec 26, 2022 4:14 pm
Runways will be both hard to damage, and easy to repair.

Planes and technical personnel (inc pilots) are both far far softer, and harder to replace.
Fair point.

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Mon Dec 26, 2022 6:39 pm

NewClaret wrote:
Mon Dec 26, 2022 10:19 am
Not sure this is true GIADJ, rather social media scaremongering, but some reports Putin is going to convert bank deposits to war bonds that can’t be withdrawn until the war is over next week. As I say, think it’s rubbish but if it’s not, a big development.
I wasn't sure but I did try to make sure the account tweeting had more than a few followers :D

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Nori1958 » Mon Dec 26, 2022 6:42 pm

Peace talks by the end of February

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Re: Russia Invades

Post by Lancasterclaret » Mon Dec 26, 2022 10:07 pm

https://twitter.com/christogrozev/statu ... 1551064064

Interesting

Clearly there are internal tensions between regular Russian army units and Wagner Mercenary ones

Anyone who thinks this is a good way to run an army is living in cloud cuckoo land

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