Russia Invades

JarrowClaret · Post by **JarrowClaret** » Tue Sep 05, 2023 10:45 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote: ↑
Tue Sep 05, 2023 7:46 pm
From what I’ve read, the consensus is the crew have destroyed the tank after it became damaged beyond repair
The turret is still attached etc

I read it had some sort of mechanical failure and was abandoned I also read it had been recovered and was being repaired clearly no idea on the truth behind it. I would imagine if the Russians had done it the video would have been all over the internet rather than 1 of it just smoking.

GodIsADeeJay81 · Post by **GodIsADeeJay81** » Tue Sep 05, 2023 11:16 pm

https://x.com/bealejonathan/status/1699 ... 75518?s=46

Update on the tank, it hit a mine and then a fire started by the fuel tank

AlargeClaret · Post by **AlargeClaret** » Wed Sep 06, 2023 5:12 pm

UKR making small daily progress on nearly all fronts , though battles have been fierce with heavy losses both sides .Now they have endless drones and artillery shells it’s allowing very heavy bombardments of RUS extensive trench network .

There’s a VERY pivotal point coming if UKR gain the main Rd through Verbove . They could wreck the RUS supply line while coming around the rear of their defences which would surely lead to an all out push south. Meanwhile RUS are begging/bribing N Korea for weapons .

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:05 am

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66736869

I don't like this development as the question of the after effects of depleted uranium have not been answered. How could Zelensky allow this on his soil?

Newty · Post by **Newty** » Sat Sep 09, 2023 9:41 am

Hipper wrote: ↑
Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:05 am
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66736869

I don't like this development as the question of the after effects of depleted uranium have not been answered. How could Zelensky allow this on his soil?

Standard shell used in tanks around the world for decades. A few depleted uranium shells embedded in some Russian tanks is probably far preferable to a foreign invader blanket mining his soil, killing, raping, pillaging tbh. Absolute least of his worries.

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Sat Sep 09, 2023 11:25 am

Hipper wrote: ↑
Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:05 am
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66736869

I don't like this development as the question of the after effects of depleted uranium have not been answered. How could Zelensky allow this on his soil?

I've never understood the rules for a war.
Avoid them whenever possible, but if it comes to a fight the other guy chooses the rules.
The Geneva convention might as well wipe your arse if one side ignores it. In that case the rule book goes out the window. How can you win a war with one hand tied behind your back.

AlargeClaret · Post by **AlargeClaret** » Sat Sep 09, 2023 1:47 pm

Newty wrote: ↑
Sat Sep 09, 2023 9:41 am
Standard shell used in tanks around the world for decades. A few depleted uranium shells embedded in some Russian tanks is probably far preferable to a foreign invader blanket mining his soil, killing, raping, pillaging tbh. Absolute least of his worries.

“ killing raping and pillaging “?? While the Russians were absolute grand masters at this in WWII there really is little to pillage or rape in all fairness . Though yes indeed, the irony of DU is that is was made specifically for heavy Russian armour all those yrs ago , now it can be put to its intended use .

Colburn_Claret · Post by **Colburn_Claret** » Sat Sep 09, 2023 3:30 pm

AlargeClaret wrote: ↑
Sat Sep 09, 2023 1:47 pm
“ killing raping and pillaging “?? While the Russians were absolute grand masters at this in WWII there really is little to pillage or rape in all fairness . Though yes indeed, the irony of DU is that is was made specifically for heavy Russian armour all those yrs ago , now it can be put to its intended use .

I think the last 2 years shows you don't need anything special to knock out Russian armour, but yes ironic.

box_of_frogs · Post by **box_of_frogs** » Sat Sep 09, 2023 3:35 pm

Newty wrote: ↑
Sat Sep 09, 2023 9:41 am
Standard shell used in tanks around the world for decades. A few depleted uranium shells embedded in some Russian tanks is probably far preferable to a foreign invader blanket mining his soil, killing, raping, pillaging tbh. Absolute least of his worries.

Absolutely spot on!

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Sat Sep 09, 2023 4:51 pm

Newty wrote: ↑
Sat Sep 09, 2023 9:41 am
Standard shell used in tanks around the world for decades. A few depleted uranium shells embedded in some Russian tanks is probably far preferable to a foreign invader blanket mining his soil, killing, raping, pillaging tbh. Absolute least of his worries.

You may have noticed that 'a foreign invader' has already been 'blanket mining his soil, killing, raping, pillaging' in Ukraine. What Ukraine is trying to do is push them back out. Any DU activity will be on Ukraine land. agricultural field, villages etc..

I thought the Russian tanks that they were designed to be used against have shown themselves vulnerable to non DU weapons so what is the need? Why take the risk of poisoning your land and people?

This isn't about 'rules of war' etc.. this seems to me about common sense.

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Sat Sep 09, 2023 9:24 pm

Common sense at the moment is to just get the Russians out of Ukraine as quickly as possible.

The Russians have planted millions of mines covering 174,000 sq km of Ukraine.

The total area of the UK is 244,00 sq km.

That’s the equivalent of over 2/3rds of the UK covered in minefields. Or an area the size of Florida. It’s incomprehensible. It’s just insane.

It’s going to take ten years to clear those fields. How many innocent people are going to perish in that time.

I get your argument re the deployment DU, but I think with what we’ve seen and continue to see in this war, we’re way past that now.

Newty · Post by **Newty** » Sun Sep 10, 2023 12:10 am

Some people are definitely being drawn in by the Russian propaganda and the fuss they have kicked up about DU shells being "Nuclear weapons". The fact that we're even discussing it, and some people are condemning it shows that the troll farms have worked.

Depleted Uranium is much less radioactive than naturally occurring uranium.
The remaining radiation cannot pass through skin. It is only harmful if ingested (not recommended).
Depleted uranium shells are Armor Piercing shells, meaning they are only fired at other tanks and heavy armor. These are fired with ridiculous precision on a modern main battle tank. They are not suited to any other purpose other than anti tank. You wouldn't fire these at troops or buildings like a high explosive shell.

I reckon more Brits will be harmed from radiation from the sun this year than Ukrainians will ever be harmed from radiation poisoning from an anti tank shell for the rest of time.

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Sun Sep 10, 2023 1:37 pm

Almost poetic justice.
https://uk.yahoo.com/news/ukraine-appea ... 35726.html

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Mon Sep 11, 2023 12:32 pm

https://x.com/warmonitors/status/170119 ... Gkg4Pp-4vg

Behind the scenes at a Ukrainian command post.

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Mon Sep 11, 2023 1:14 pm

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/ukrainian-spe ... 55788.html
Russia are so overstretched it would appear that Ukraine can make such gains.

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Mon Sep 11, 2023 7:51 pm

https://x.com/defenceu/status/170130066 ... Gkg4Pp-4vg

Video of the operation to retake the oil platforms.

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Mon Sep 11, 2023 8:50 pm

https://x.com/ukrinform/status/17013184 ... Gkg4Pp-4vg

Collection of images from the frontline which could easily have been taken over 100 years ago during WW1.

Taffy on the wing · Post by **Taffy on the wing** » Tue Sep 12, 2023 4:22 am

NIGHTMARE..........for those taking part.

I feel extremely lucky that i've never had to do this...so many glorify this stuff, but it must be Hell.

Cirrus_Minor · Post by **Cirrus_Minor** » Tue Sep 12, 2023 11:36 am

Newty wrote: ↑
Sun Sep 10, 2023 12:10 am
Some people are definitely being drawn in by the Russian propaganda and the fuss they have kicked up about DU shells being "Nuclear weapons". The fact that we're even discussing it, and some people are condemning it shows that the troll farms have worked.

Depleted Uranium is much less radioactive than naturally occurring uranium.
The remaining radiation cannot pass through skin. It is only harmful if ingested (not recommended).
Depleted uranium shells are Armor Piercing shells, meaning they are only fired at other tanks and heavy armor. These are fired with ridiculous precision on a modern main battle tank. They are not suited to any other purpose other than anti tank. You wouldn't fire these at troops or buildings like a high explosive shell.

I reckon more Brits will be harmed from radiation from the sun this year than Ukrainians will ever be harmed from radiation poisoning from an anti tank shell for the rest of time.

Without taking any sides in this let's not kid ourselves about the potential dangers for using DU in the battle field. The material disintegrates into small particles on collision with a tank and the explosion scatters it far and wide. DU is very toxic and the relatively small amount of radiation is potentially harmful if ingested.

Just another example to me of how this conflict is being escalated by NATO risking further escalation by Russia in this war that probably unwinnable by either side.

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Tue Sep 12, 2023 1:08 pm

Excellent video showing a Russian tank being destroyed by drones

https://twitter.com/i/status/1701139095030759926

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Wed Sep 13, 2023 8:40 am

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/putin-main-bl ... 13984.html
Russia getting a taste of their own medicine.

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Wed Sep 13, 2023 10:18 am

https://x.com/covertshores/status/17018 ... Gkg4Pp-4vg

Russians getting squeezed in the Black Sea.

Thread on the damage caused overnight at the Sevastopol dry dock. A landing ship and possibly a sub put out of action, although to what degree is still unknown.

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Wed Sep 13, 2023 6:57 pm

Satellite imagery of both ships hit in Sevastopol. Look like total losses, and reportedly British Storm Shadow used to carry out the attack.

https://x.com/war_monitor_ua/status/170 ... Gkg4Pp-4vg

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Thu Sep 14, 2023 5:48 pm

https://x.com/666_mancer/status/1702361 ... Gkg4Pp-4vg

Footage up close of the landing ship ‘Minsk’ in Sevastopol dry dock.

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Sun Sep 17, 2023 10:57 am

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-66829826

Seems to me that in the immediate/medium term the Ukrainians are trying to make Sevastopol untenable as a naval base. Sevastopol is the main reason the Russians are in Crimea as it gives them control of the Black Sea.

https://carnegieendowment.org/2021/05/2 ... -pub-84549

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Sun Sep 17, 2023 11:07 am

Ukraine are playing the long game. I just hope the West have the patience and longevity to stay with them.

Slowly, they are degrading the Russian ability to hold on to Crimea and resupply their forces in the south.

Another big step will be taking the town of Tokmak which is a key logistics hub for the Russians.

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 9:10 am

Article on the reasoning behind the Ukrainian effort around Bakhmut:

https://www.understandingwar.org/backgr ... away-south

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 7:01 pm

https://x.com/colbybadhwar/status/17037 ... Gkg4Pp-4vg

Thread on ATACMS, what it is and why it will be so valuable to Ukraine if/when delivered.

The takeaway point is ATACMS can hit time sensitive targets such as mobile air defence systems within minutes, whereas Storm Shadow can take hours.

LeadBelly · Post by **LeadBelly** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 7:41 pm

Whilst following that last link, I spotted there was now some detail of the damage to the sub from the Sevastopol attack the other day. Ive seen satellite pictures of both hits and some closer up footage of the Minsk damage but this is the sub and a brief explanation of how the Storm Shadow ideally works
https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/17 ... 9128498239

TsarBomba · Post by **TsarBomba** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 3:36 pm

Russian Black Sea Fleet HQ in Crimea hit by missile/drone strike. Russian defences have been seriously degraded over the summer if Ukraine can strike such targets with impunity.

https://x.com/kyivindependent/status/17 ... Gkg4Pp-4vg

S0S-1971 · Post by **S0S-1971** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 4:14 pm

TsarBomba wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 3:36 pm
Russian Black Sea Fleet HQ in Crimea hit by missile/drone strike. Russian defences have been seriously degraded over the summer if Ukraine can strike such targets with impunity.

https://x.com/kyivindependent/status/17 ... Gkg4Pp-4vg

You are clutching at straws , no way are Ukraine winning this one , sporadic attacks achieve very little in the grand scheme of things . I feel sorry for the Ukrainian population but Russia are winning this conflict .

SalouClaret · Post by **SalouClaret** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 5:46 pm

S0S-1971 wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 4:14 pm
You are clutching at straws , no way are Ukraine winning this one , sporadic attacks achieve very little in the grand scheme of things . I feel sorry for the Ukrainian population but Russia are winning this conflict .

Yes, it's going great for Russia isn't it?

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 6:05 pm

Slightly off topic but quite relevant as it shows more weakness in the Russian army and their sphere of influence declining. They couldn't even stop a pea shooter fight between Azerbaijani and Armenia.
https://www.reuters.com/world/questions ... 023-09-22/

AlargeClaret · Post by **AlargeClaret** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 6:18 pm

S0S-1971 wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 4:14 pm
You are clutching at straws , no way are Ukraine winning this one , sporadic attacks achieve very little in the grand scheme of things . I feel sorry for the Ukrainian population but Russia are winning this conflict .

While it’s good to read an alternative view , and let’s not forget the western propaganda is every bit as ludicrous as Russias ( and that’s some feat) it’s a big ask to say “ RUS are winning “ . It’s a terrible war of attrition , and the huge losses that UKR take are often totally ignored . But the sheer amount of ongoing help from US/UK and 20? + EU countries will ensure that RUS don’t “ win” this .

S0S-1971 · Post by **S0S-1971** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 6:23 pm

SalouClaret wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 5:46 pm
Yes, it's going great for Russia isn't it?

Salou

Do you think that Ukraine have the upper hand in this conflict and are close to achieving their goal ?

Hipper · Post by **Hipper** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 7:01 pm

Maybe not the upper hand but the initiative, for the time being anyway.

Taking little pot shots occasionally at Sevastopol could make the port untenable for the Russian Black Sea fleet.

The links I posted above, at 0957 sept 17th, adds some meat to that idea.

If Ukraine can make Sevastopol, let alone Crimea, impractical to operate in that will be a big blow to Russia.

As for the question of Ukraine being close to achieving their goal, which is presumably to remove Russians from Ukraine territory and keep them out, the answer is clearly 'no'. They are however moving in the right direction but slowly. None of us know the state of Ukraine's forces and how much this effort has cost them and we only have some, probably quite intelligent guesses, on the state of the Russians. If the various Ukraine fronts come to a halt soon, because of the weather, it's likely the Russians will reinforce their defences with more mines, trenches etc.. having learnt lessons from this years activities, so making things more difficult again next year.

How long either side can sustain this, and all the other factors like US elections etc. make any predictions very difficult.

And then there are the political goings on in Russia which we know little about but there was of course that incredible incident with Wagner.

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 7:51 pm

If the war is judged by the army with the upper hand slaughtering more babies, children, civilians,destroying hospitals, schools, houses then yes Russia is winning.

NewClaret · Post by **NewClaret** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 9:20 pm

S0S-1971 wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 6:23 pm
Salou

Do you think that Ukraine have the upper hand in this conflict and are close to achieving their goal ?

Well, Russia certainly isn’t gaining ground. And are losing ground. So yes, Ukraine have the upper hand.

They’re not close to achieving their goal, but they will.

JarrowClaret · Post by **JarrowClaret** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 9:34 pm

S0S-1971 wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 6:23 pm
Salou

Do you think that Ukraine have the upper hand in this conflict and are close to achieving their goal ?

It isn’t a game of football! as it stands it is pretty much a stalemate although the Ukrainians are making marginal gains I guess all hard fought and costing many lives on both sides. There are more and more attacks deep inside Crimea if there are land gains in this direction before Winter then that could yip the tide the Ukrainians way I guess.

NewClaret · Post by **NewClaret** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 9:47 pm

JarrowClaret wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 9:34 pm
It isn’t a game of football! as it stands it is pretty much a stalemate although the Ukrainians are making marginal gains I guess all hard fought and costing many lives on both sides. There are more and more attacks deep inside Crimea if there are land gains in this direction before Winter then that could yip the tide the Ukrainians way I guess.

Given their objectives were to take Ukraine in 3 days and they’re losing ground, by no accounts do Russia have ‘the upper hand’ which only means Ukraine does.

Damo · Post by **Damo** » Fri Sep 22, 2023 11:59 pm

Hipper wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 7:01 pm
How long either side can sustain this, and all the other factors like US elections etc. make any predictions very difficult

Fingers crossed the US elections put an end to this pointless slaughter.

I know some of you will wish otherwise

Leisure · Post by **Leisure** » Sat Sep 23, 2023 12:14 am

Damo wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 11:59 pm
Fingers crossed the US elections put an end to this pointless slaughter.

I know some of you will wish otherwise

Please explain

CoolClaret · Post by **CoolClaret** » Sat Sep 23, 2023 12:57 am

Ah yes the “it’s all Zelensky and the west’s fault for not surrendering and allowing Russia to annex more land” argument again.

Their mental gymnastics really is something

SalouClaret · Post by **SalouClaret** » Sat Sep 23, 2023 1:12 am

Damo wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 11:59 pm
Fingers crossed the US elections put an end to this pointless slaughter.

I know some of you will wish otherwise

SalouClaret · Post by **SalouClaret** » Sat Sep 23, 2023 1:13 am

S0S-1971 wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 6:23 pm
Salou

Do you think that Ukraine have the upper hand in this conflict and are close to achieving their goal ?

Do you think Russia are achieving their goal in their 3 day war?

Tw@ · Post by **Tw@** » Sat Sep 23, 2023 1:34 am

Make love not war

Tw@ · Post by **Tw@** » Sat Sep 23, 2023 1:36 am

And get your tanks back axle greased now and again

Vegas Claret · Post by **Vegas Claret** » Sat Sep 23, 2023 5:42 am

Leisure wrote: ↑
Sat Sep 23, 2023 12:14 am
Please explain

he thinks Trump will stop the war when in fact he'll try his best to pull the US out of NATO again at the request of Vlad. He'll fail at that too.

bfcjg · Post by **bfcjg** » Sat Sep 23, 2023 10:21 am

Damo wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 11:59 pm
Fingers crossed the US elections put an end to this pointless slaughter.

I know some of you will wish otherwise

Are you mental ?

Spijed · Post by **Spijed** » Sat Sep 23, 2023 10:32 am

Damo wrote: ↑
Fri Sep 22, 2023 11:59 pm
Fingers crossed the US elections put an end to this pointless slaughter.

I know some of you will wish otherwise

Putin is solely to blame for the deliberate slaughter and genocide - no one else.

The worry is that many in America see him as a hero.