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Newcastleclaret93
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by Newcastleclaret93 » Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:06 pm
RVclaret wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:03 pm
Firstly I take your point - however, every player has a price. This topic has been gone over several times. We have to get back to being a ‘selling club’ where we buy low and sell high, that’s the way to grow the club naturally, as VK said yesterday in his interview. If you sell Collins for 30m+ and bring in Jack Hendry for 5m (just for example), you’re getting a top centre half as a replacement who has actually has more experience.
The only difference is Hendry is knowhere near the same quality of Collins.
Collins would be the best CB and McNeil the best midfielder in the championship. Sell them and it dramatically reduces our chances of promotion.
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Smile
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by Smile » Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:09 pm
FCBurnley wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:00 pm
Yes it is but so is promotion back to PL. plus no doubt Stoke have a significant cut of any profit. Both Collins and McNeil could be superstars in Championship which would bump up their transfer fees. It’s all a matter of cash for owners or ambition
I think it also depends on how good they think these players coming in are. Could one of these Man City defenders become as good as Collins? If Pace, Kompany and co think they are, and a silly offer came in then they could bank some against the debt and bring in 2-3 players in his place.
What's important is that the process/system/conveyor belt is in sound working order. If it is, then any player could be sold for big fees.
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tiger76
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by tiger76 » Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:10 pm
FCBurnley wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 2:47 pm
If we sell Collins or McNeil we are crazy or out of money. Best Young players we have had for a long time. Should be building a team around them.
Depends whether we receive big offers, and if selling one of those allowed us to fund 4/5 incomings we'd have to least give it consideration.
This is an area we've neglected recently cashing in on players who might provide big money to fund any new arrivals, and we can't afford anymore potential assets walking for nothing when their contracts expire.
Also do we know if Kompany rates either to fit into his system, or will he prefer to bring his own players in.
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AwayClaret
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by AwayClaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:12 pm
louieollie wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 2:38 pm
To be fair to Smile that quote is in the Daily Record also , at the end of the piece about Hendry.
I wasn't having a pop at him I was just messing about.
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ervi34
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by ervi34 » Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:15 pm
I think Cornet's definitely leaving, no chance a PL or even a foreign team doesn't activate his clause. I would say Collins will go as well, but hopefully we sell him for at least 25+. Those sales, plus Weghorst's loan should free enough cash to keep McNeil, Brownhill and Roberts.
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arise_sir_charge
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by arise_sir_charge » Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:16 pm
FCBurnley wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 1:49 pm
When did we sign Twine and Ballard. I must have missed something
Or you’re being purposely obtuse?
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DCWat
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by DCWat » Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:25 pm
ervi34 wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:15 pm
I think Cornet's definitely leaving, no chance a PL or even a foreign team doesn't activate his clause. I would say Collins will go as well, but hopefully we sell him for at least 25+. Those sales, plus Weghorst's loan should free enough cash to keep McNeil, Brownhill and Roberts.
Can we reverse that and keep Collins whilst selling Roberts and Brownhill (not a dig at either, but it’d be my preference to selling Collins).
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AwayClaret
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by AwayClaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:45 pm
Not sure if the reported on here but we beat WBA to the signing of Egan-Riley apparently.
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fidelcastro
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by fidelcastro » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:08 pm
Has Weghorst going to Besiktas on loan been mentioned yet?
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ervi34
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by ervi34 » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:09 pm
DCWat wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 3:25 pm
Can we reverse that and keep Collins whilst selling Roberts and Brownhill (not a dig at either, but it’d be my preference to selling Collins).
Doubt they'd have much interest from PL clubs, if any. Collins on the other hand would fit perfectly at almost every club, either as a starter or as a backup at one of the top sides. Besides that, Roberts and Brownhill have been excellent at this level and I'm certain they'll do well for us, provided they stay.
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BabylonClaret
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by BabylonClaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:10 pm
gandhisflipflop wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 11:08 am
Makes you wonder in previous transfer windows what the real issue was when we weren’t signing anyone and we were kept being told that players only signed for us towards the end of a window because they want to see other offers they may get
We now we are a league below we are one of the City/Arsenal/Chelsea of the league aren't we? Doh
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Steddyman
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by Steddyman » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:17 pm
FCBurnley wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 2:47 pm
If we sell Collins or McNeil we are crazy or out of money. Best Young players we have had for a long time. Should be building a team around them.
The new business model is buy low, develop, sell high. If we can sell Collins for a large profit, then we will.
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Smile
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by Smile » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:17 pm
BabylonClaret wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:10 pm
We now we are a league below we are one of the City/Arsenal/Chelsea of the league aren't we? Doh
Easy for you to say.
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Oldparkwood
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by Oldparkwood » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:19 pm
I personally think Collins is no where near as good as everyone is making out
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warksclaret
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by warksclaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:19 pm
I hope we hang on to Collins until at least January-subject of course to no big bids coming in. However when Kelvin Phillips of Leeds goes for £45m, for me it has a bearing on what we can expect from a centre half who has played just half a season in the PL. I doubt if he would be talked about as much but for his wonder goal for his country. Based on the Phillips fee, who was one of Englands stars in the Euros, I sense we will not get many prepared to offer £25m for Collins
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Smile
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by Smile » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:21 pm
Regarding Collins, we have one thing going for us - it doesn't look like he has a relegation release fee.
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Hipper
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by Hipper » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:23 pm
Steddyman wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:17 pm
The new business model is buy low, develop, sell high. If we can sell Collins for a large profit, then we will.
Wouldn't it be better to 'buy low, develop, get promoted'?
We developed Pope, Tarkowski and Mee. I don't think in the days of Bosman it's so easy to do the 'sell high' bit.
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gandhisflipflop
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by gandhisflipflop » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:24 pm
tom210 wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:19 pm
I personally think Collins is no where near as good as everyone is making out
I hope that wink is a fishing rod, if not then you need to watch more football
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mybloodisclaret
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by mybloodisclaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:25 pm
warksclaret wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:19 pm
I hope we hang on to Collins until at least January-subject of course to no big bids coming in. However when Kelvin Phillips of Leeds goes for £45m, for me it has a bearing on what we can expect from a centre half who has played just half a season in the PL. I doubt if he would be talked about as much but for his wonder goal for his country. Based on the Phillips fee, who was one of Englands stars in the Euros, I sense we will not get many prepared to offer £25m for Collins
Really not trying to be difficult mate, but I honestly rate Collins as better and having more potential than Phillips. I know he was injured a lot last season, but Collins is the real deal. Absolute quality.
I hope we hold on to him, as Newcastle says, with him in the side, our promotion chances are far far higher. I wouldn't mind keeping him for a season and selling him if we are promoted. Take the 40 mill then on top of the promotion he would have massively contributed to.
Let's face it, he has been learning off 2 outstanding CBs whilst he has been at Burnley.
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KRBFC
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by KRBFC » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:37 pm
I think Collins is considerably a better prospect than Keane and Tarkowski were, Collins wont be going to a relegation fighting team like Everton as his big dream move. I could see Collins going to Leeds this summer as a stepping stone, then joining a UCL team 2-3 years down the line.
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Woodleyclaret
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by Woodleyclaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:45 pm
A big teams like Leeds '
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Smile
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by Smile » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:46 pm
KRBFC wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:37 pm
I think Collins is considerably a better prospect than Keane and Tarkowski were, Collins wont be going to a relegation fighting team like Everton as his big dream move. I could see Collins going to Leeds this summer as a stepping stone, then joining a UCL team 2-3 years down the line.
Leeds much more likely to be involved in the relegation fight than Everton. Everton are also a bigger club.
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KRBFC
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by KRBFC » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:47 pm
Smile wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:46 pm
Leeds much more likely to be involved in the relegation fight than Everton. Everton are also a bigger club.
Don't disagree, the difference being Leeds will be simply a stepping stone for Collins not his big dream move.
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KRBFC
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by KRBFC » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:48 pm
Woodleyclaret wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:45 pm
A big teams like Leeds '
You read the post completely wrong, I said Everton were the big dream move for Keane and Tarkowski. Collins will use Leeds as a stepping stone and join a UCL club in 2-3 years. I never said ''a big team like Leeds''.
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dsr
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by dsr » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:54 pm
ŽižkovClaret wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 1:43 pm
I'll skirt around the politics, as well, my thoughts are well represented on other platforms, but i wonder if some quality US based players might be seeking an exit from the states with recent events. I wouldn't want to risk putting my spouse or partner in danger should the worst happen
If that's a reference to Roe v Wade, forget it. The number of footballers for whom fatherhood (or their wives' motherhood) is the worst that could happen, AND who would emigrate because of the danger of their contraception not working AND who could not face the difficulties of getting to a different state of the USA, is few.
If that's not what you meant, then perhaps you could be a bit less obscure!
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The Enclosure
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by The Enclosure » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:55 pm
Arsenal accept £2m bid for Ballard.
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ŽižkovClaret
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by ŽižkovClaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:11 pm
dsr wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:54 pm
If that's a reference to Roe v Wade, forget it. The number of footballers for whom fatherhood (or their wives' motherhood) is the worst that could happen, AND who would emigrate because of the danger of their contraception not working AND who could not face the difficulties of getting to a different state of the USA, is few.
If that's not what you meant, then perhaps you could be a bit less obscure!
If you think the issues are confined to unwanted pregnancies, then i think you might need to read into it a little more, sadly.
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Braindead
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by Braindead » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:13 pm
ŽižkovClaret wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:11 pm
If you think the issues are confined to unwanted pregnancies, then i think you might need to read into it a little more, sadly.
For the love of Coyle, not on this thread I beg of you.
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tiger76
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by tiger76 » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:16 pm
The Enclosure wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:55 pm
Arsenal accept £2m bid for Ballard.
From us hopefully.
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claretandy
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by claretandy » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:16 pm
The Enclosure wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:55 pm
Arsenal accept £2m bid for Ballard.
That was about 3 days ago.
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ŽižkovClaret
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by ŽižkovClaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:17 pm
Braindead wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:13 pm
For the love of Coyle, not on this thread I beg of you.
Agreed, hence the wording of my original post
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Guller Bull
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by Guller Bull » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:24 pm
tom210 wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:19 pm
I personally think Collins is no where near as good as everyone is making out
Totally agree with you. So much hype about a one dimensional hoof ball defender. Cant see any club in the top 2 leagues being remotely interested.
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bumba
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by bumba » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:27 pm
jrgbfc wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 10:45 am
Hopefully he gets a good pre season in and impresses in the friendly matches. No reason why he can't feature next season with Vydra injured, and only Jay Rod and Barnes ahead of him at present.
Has anything been said about Vydra? Has he signed or left? We've announced Cork and presume both got offered at same time
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bumba
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by bumba » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:28 pm
Tricky Trevor wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 11:36 am
Dyche was unproven. Correct
Tarky was unproven. After 140 efl games he was signed, as cover, by a championship side.
Ings was unproven. Signed by a championship side, as cover, by his former manager.
Mee was unproven. Correct.
Trippier was unproven. Signed by a championship side after getting young player of the year at Barnsley.
Pope was unproven. Signed as cover for Tom Heaton, third choice behind Paul Robinson. The perfect situation to develop him.
I just hope these new guys can give us half of what they did.
If they end up half as good they'll be very good players
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fidelcastro
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by fidelcastro » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:31 pm
bumba wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:27 pm
Has anything been said about Vydra? Has he signed or left? We've announced Cork and presume both got offered at same time
Probably biding his time in the hope that another club comes in for him. You would hope there would be a deadline though.
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boatshed bill
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by boatshed bill » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:34 pm
bumba wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:27 pm
Has anything been said about Vydra? Has he signed or left? We've announced Cork and presume both got offered at same time
Haven't we offered him a deal, and time to recover from his injury with us?
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fidelcastro
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by fidelcastro » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:36 pm
boatshed bill wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:34 pm
Haven't we offered him a deal, and time to recover from his injury with us?
If we haven't then surely he'd have been released when the other six were announced.
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ŽižkovClaret
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by ŽižkovClaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:43 pm
bumba wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:27 pm
Has anything been said about Vydra? Has he signed or left? We've announced Cork and presume both got offered at same time
Been offered a new 2 yr deal, and last i heard he was here doing his rehab. I guess 1st July or after would be when we'd expect to hear more
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warksclaret
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by warksclaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:45 pm
I hope that the club gave Vydra a deadline for deciding if he wants to stay. I thought it was honourable of the club to offer him a deal-being in a long term injury right now will minimise the clubs interested in him, not that they were queuing up before his injury
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Hipper
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by Hipper » Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:56 pm
KRBFC wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:37 pm
I think Collins is considerably a better prospect than Keane and Tarkowski were, Collins wont be going to a relegation fighting team like Everton as his big dream move. I could see Collins going to Leeds this summer as a stepping stone, then joining a UCL team 2-3 years down the line.
Do Collins wages get reduced on relegation? If so it's perfectly understandable that he would want a move to a Premier League club.
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KRBFC
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by KRBFC » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:10 pm
Hipper wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 5:56 pm
Do Collins wages get reduced on relegation? If so it's perfectly understandable that he would want a move to a Premier League club.
I have no idea if Pace inserted wage reductions. He's a PL level defender though with a huge future, his biggest move wont be next up, he'll use a team like Leeds as a stepping stone for further experience followed by a move to Spurs 2-3 years down the line.
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Hipper
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by Hipper » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:17 pm
KRBFC wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:10 pm
I have no idea if Pace inserted wage reductions. He's a PL level defender though with a huge future, his biggest move wont be next up, he'll use a team like Leeds as a stepping stone for further experience followed by a move to Spurs 2-3 years down the line.
He must be pleased to know it's all been mapped out for him.
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DCWat
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by DCWat » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:17 pm
KRBFC wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:10 pm
I have no idea if Pace inserted wage reductions. He's a PL level defender though with a huge future, his biggest move wont be next up, he'll use a team like Leeds as a stepping stone for further experience followed by a move to Spurs 2-3 years down the line.
Why Spurs?
I can see him at a top team, not a perennial also ran. I believe he can be that good.
In his shoes, I can certainly see the merit of a quick return to the Premier League at a ‘stepping stone’ club. I can though also see the merits of a season under the guidance of Vincent Kompany which could (fingers crossed) see him return to the Premier League in 12 months.
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boatshed bill
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by boatshed bill » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:19 pm
KRBFC wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:10 pm
I have no idea if Pace inserted wage reductions. He's a PL level defender though with a huge future, his biggest move wont be next up, he'll use a team like Leeds as a stepping stone for further experience followed by a move to Spurs 2-3 years down the line.
Not many PL defender give away 2 pens in 20 games.
Good player with bags of potential, but plenty of room for improvement.
A season with VK would do him no harm at all.
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KRBFC
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by KRBFC » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:28 pm
DCWat wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:17 pm
Why Spurs?
I can see him at a top team, not a perennial also ran. I believe he can be that good.
In his shoes, I can certainly see the merit of a quick return to the Premier League at a ‘stepping stone’ club. I can though also see the merits of a season under the guidance of Vincent Kompany which could (fingers crossed) see him return to the Premier League in 12 months.
I think Spurs are going places under Conte, change Spurs to Chelsea/Arsenal if you want. He's too good for the Championship and we need cash, if a decent offer comes in, he'll be off. There's no reason for him to hope for promotion into the PL and waste 12 months of his career when he can cut out the ''hope for promotion'' part and jump back up into the PL immediately.
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ervi34
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by ervi34 » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:31 pm
KRBFC wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:37 pm
I think Collins is considerably a better prospect than Keane and Tarkowski were, Collins wont be going to a relegation fighting team like Everton as his big dream move. I could see Collins going to Leeds this summer as a stepping stone, then joining a UCL team 2-3 years down the line.
Keane joined Everton when they finished 7th. They played in Europa League in his first season and spent a lot that summer but ultimately failed to rebuild the squad. They were certainly not in a relegation fight.
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KRBFC
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by KRBFC » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:31 pm
boatshed bill wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:19 pm
Not many PL defender give away 2 pens in 20 games.
Good player with bags of potential, but plenty of room for improvement.
A season with VK would do him no harm at all.
It's a good job he's well liked and is a very good player giving away that penalty against Newcastle. If that was Stephen Jordan, he'd have been hung up by the ******** and never forgiven. Deliberately handled the ball, I don't know what the hell he was doing and it's a good job i'm not a conspiracy guy.
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KRBFC
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by KRBFC » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:32 pm
ervi34 wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:31 pm
Keane joined Everton when they finished 7th. They played in Europa League in his first season and spent a lot that summer but ultimately failed to rebuild the squad. They were certainly not in a relegation fight.
Did you intentionally miss Tarkowski's name from my sentence?
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ervi34
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by ervi34 » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:33 pm
KRBFC wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:32 pm
Did you intentionally miss Tarkowski's name from my sentence?
Accidentaly.
And I apologise.
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DCWat
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by DCWat » Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:53 pm
KRBFC wrote: ↑Sat Jun 25, 2022 6:28 pm
I think Spurs are going places under Conte, change Spurs to Chelsea/Arsenal if you want. He's too good for the Championship and we need cash, if a decent offer comes in, he'll be off. There's no reason for him to hope for promotion into the PL and waste 12 months of his career when he can cut out the ''hope for promotion'' part and jump back up into the PL immediately.
Not a Liverpool or one of the Manchester clubs? Not that I see United being above either of those two any time soon.