Academy coaches

[spt_claret]

Maybe I should move into politics, there at least my strawmanning would be fully appreciated!

It is in your opinion and it is your choice to get riled up. Okay boomer is a humorous meme response. I can’t help if you don’t get the reference or if you choose to become riled by it.

I get the reference. I'm a millennial. But "ok boomer" with no actual further response isn't exactly rapier wit. It's a way to deflect and deride without having to actually engage back. As for "your choice", I find it interesting that it's other peoples choice to object if you're rude, pithy and insulting to them, but if people behave similarly poorly to you then suddenly that sort of dialogue is out of order. Yes. Which is exactly what you've done previously so it's extremely rich for you to pretend to be a good faith commentator. And I don't engage in the clique bullying of them either. I judge people by each contribution they make- I've even agreed with you sometimes. But you very much have an attitude whereby anyone critical of issues is somehow crossing a line or ought to be silent, or just wait and see and take everything on faith. If you don't want tribalism it'd help if you had a bit of give and take yourself instead of always unconditionally backing the most corporate line you can. Theres a number of avenues of communication- for example they could bullet point the issues raised, some idea of the extent of them while maintaining necessary protections, and expectations on when these will be resolved. Again you're acting like it's either turn every fan into an auditor or complete silence beyond soundbites. I fully agree that it's an ongoing situation but that in itself means that you'd hope some communication regarding progress made would be possible.

[spt_claret]

Apologies, formatting went completely wrong on that post, trying to split the quote up didn't work as expected.

[Blakesboots]

I think the sarcasm has been missed.

[paulatky]

I have been certain from his very 1st post that Blakesboots is in fact Alan Pace or if not is directly posting on his behalf.

Not in one sentence in any of his ramblings and waffle has he once in anyway criticised Alan Pace or ALK

He has turned down many invites for a coffee ( as he doesn’t drink alcohol, see the co-incidence) before a match to discuss the issues he talks about on here.

If ever the term King Dick was approximate then it applies to BlakesBoots

[Bosscat]

Academy Coaches.jpg (46.1 KiB) Viewed 2058 times

[Wokingclaret]

Nice

[Blakesboots]

I have been certain from his very 1st post that Blakesboots is in fact Alan Pace or if not is directly posting on his behalf.

Not in one sentence in any of his ramblings and waffle has he once in anyway criticised Alan Pace or ALK

He has turned down many invites for a coffee ( as he doesn’t drink alcohol, see the co-incidence) before a match to discuss the issues he talks about on here.

If ever the term King Dick was approximate then it applies to BlakesBoots

In fairness I am usually very busy before games.

I still don’t agree with that derogatory term being used.

[claretonthecoast1882]

I have been certain from his very 1st post that Blakesboots is in fact Alan Pace or if not is directly posting on his behalf.

Not in one sentence in any of his ramblings and waffle has he once in anyway criticised Alan Pace or ALK

He has turned down many invites for a coffee ( as he doesn’t drink alcohol, see the co-incidence) before a match to discuss the issues he talks about on here.

If ever the term King Dick was approximate then it applies to BlakesBoots

Did you invite him for a coffee posting as you or your wife ?

[spt_claret]

In fairness I am usually very busy before games.

I still don’t agree with that derogatory term being used.

Got to agree tbh. Even if you're frustrated enough to feel name calling is warranted or not it lowers the tone of the debate and also makes it easy for points to be disregarded and the discussion derailed into tit for tat insults.
There's plenty of substantial ways to critique and challenge his posts without insults- they just give excuses to stop engaging.
By sticking to standards it's easier to hold others to them- and expose their lack of sincerity when they continue to not engage.
We might never get a straight answer from this poster but can at least make it clear that it's not for want of genuine trying on everyone else's part.

[Blakesboots]

Got to agree tbh. Even if you're frustrated enough to feel name calling is warranted or not it lowers the tone of the debate and also makes it easy for points to be disregarded and the discussion derailed into tit for tat insults.
There's plenty of substantial ways to critique and challenge his posts without insults- they just give excuses to stop engaging.
By sticking to standards it's easier to hold others to them- and expose their lack of sincerity when they continue to not engage.
We might never get a straight answer from this poster but can at least make it clear that it's not for want of genuine trying on everyone else's part.

Morning Spt,

I don’t think I could be any clearer. That’s my point, there’s nothing concrete at the moment to be clear on re: academy.

I believe it’s not a clear path at the moment and it is changing weekly. If there are areas that have fallen short then I am sure that there will be learning and subsequent actions to undertake for the club as there would be in any business. I think there will be positive appointments to be made after upcoming recruitment activities for roles within the academy setup.

I guess the wider issues are still ongoing and I’m sure discussions will be taking place across the club (as they always do) about how the club moves forward positively.

[Lancasterclaret]

Morning Spt,

I don’t think I could be any clearer. That’s my point, there’s nothing concrete at the moment to be clear on re: academy.

I believe it’s not a clear path at the moment and it is changing weekly. If there are areas that have fallen short then I am sure that there will be learning and subsequent actions to undertake for the club as there would be in any business. I think there will be positive appointments to be made after upcoming recruitment activities for roles within the academy setup.

I guess the wider issues are still ongoing and I’m sure discussions will be taking place across the club (as they always do) about how the club moves forward positively.

By moving forward positively, I take it you mean maintaining or getting back our Category 1 status?

[Blakesboots]

By moving forward positively, I take it you mean maintaining or getting back our Category 1 status?

We would all like to think that it is achievable that BFC should have a Cat 1 academy.

[beddie]

We would all like to think that it is achievable that BFC should have a Cat 1 academy.

Having achieved it you do wonder how it could go so badly wrong. It’s not going to happen (go down hill) overnight is it? Surely people at the top must not have had their fingers on the pulse. Even if someone leaves that was involved in running it why is it or why wasn’t it being checked and reported on accordingly and action taken immediately.

[Herts Clarets]

We would all like to think that it is achievable that BFC should have a Cat 1 academy.

We had. Then Alan Pace took over the club.....

[KRBFC]

Morning Spt,

I don’t think I could be any clearer. That’s my point, there’s nothing concrete at the moment to be clear on re: academy.

I believe it’s not a clear path at the moment and it is changing weekly. If there are areas that have fallen short then I am sure that there will be learning and subsequent actions to undertake for the club as there would be in any business. I think there will be positive appointments to be made after upcoming recruitment activities for roles within the academy setup.

I guess the wider issues are still ongoing and I’m sure discussions will be taking place across the club (as they always do) about how the club moves forward positively.

Why are you acting like a spokesman for the club?

What's the deal? Are you a club employee? fan with ''info''? a normal fan? a huge ALK fan? part of ALK? or Alan himself?

[Blakesboots]

We had. Then Alan Pace took over the club.....

And comments like this is why people sometimes chose to close up shop. I can understand that fans are emotionally invested in their club and that’s a positive thing. Yet, they then take every opportunity, without cause or reason to swing away at the club without knowing the details of the situation.

[Blakesboots]

Why are you acting like a spokesman for the club?

What's the deal? Are you a club employee? fan with ''info''? a normal fan? a huge ALK fan? part of ALK? or Alan himself?

Like everyone here I am a fan of the club, no more, no less.

[ClaretTony]

Oh dear - herts is in trouble now.

You still claiming to be a fan of the club. Why don’t you tell people who you are.

[Blakesboots]

Oh dear - herts is in trouble now.

You still claiming to be a fan of the club. Why don’t you tell people who you are.

Herts isn’t in trouble, those are your words.

I have read many, many comments from you on this message board when you have called out people for using anything they can to hit out at the club or favoured staff. You’ve been very vocal about that and it’s appropriateness.

Why is it okay for you to call that behaviour out, and not someone else?

I am as much a fan of the club, as you are.

[Herts Clarets]

And comments like this is why people sometimes chose to close up shop. I can understand that fans are emotionally invested in their club and that’s a positive thing. Yet, they then take every opportunity, without cause or reason to swing away at the club without knowing the details of the situation.

Without cause? The club has been on a downward spiral since the take over. We have no manager. We have been relegated. We are in debt. Tens of millions of pounds of debt. Our academy is at risk of losing Cat 1 status. Communication is virtually non existent. The website and online shop are an amateurish shambles.

What have we got to show for the good? A lick of paint around the ground (offset by the removal of the heroes pictures from outside) and lots and lots of flashing signs.

You still think there is no cause for my comment? Which is nothing more than stating facts.

[Devils_Advocate]

Come on CT, you have had lots of contacts in the club and have shared information and in no uncertain terms have told people what you believe is right and what is wrong with regards to what is actually happening when others have speculative opinions and viewpoints.

You have also had a habit of being very pro certain people and things and anti other people and things and you have not shied away from using your knowledge and contacts to promote your views and sometimes bias.

I've no idea who this blakesboots person is but there is very little difference I see in the way he posts about this kind of stuff compared to the way you have posted over the years on here

[Newcastleclaret93]

I think this thread highlights the massive problem ALK have. To be successful you need everyone pushing in the same direction from the owners down to the Fans.
Right now it definitely feels like there are two sides.

Pro and Anti ALK

[Blakesboots]

Without cause? The club has been on a downward spiral since the take over. We have no manager. We have been relegated. We are in debt. Tens of millions of pounds of debt. Our academy is at risk of losing Cat 1 status. Communication is virtually non existent. The website and online shop are an amateurish shambles.

What have we got to show for the good? A lick of paint around the ground (offset by the removal of the heroes pictures from outside) and lots and lots of flashing signs.

You still think there is no cause for my comment? Which is nothing more than stating facts.

This was a discussion about the academy, and you directly attributing the current issues with the current ownership, in my opinion not everything can be laid at the same door.

The wider issues you raise were always going to be a concern, the club was always at risk of relegation and unfortunately that is now a reality. Can you really say that the clubs transfer business hasn’t moved forward under the new ownership? That it was potentially time to refresh the management structure?

Has the club shop gone backwards since the new owners took over, it was it always in need of development?

Was communication better under the previous owners?

[Blakesboots]

I think this thread highlights the massive problem ALK have. To be successful you need everyone pushing in the same direction from the owners down to the Fans.
Right now it definitely feels like there are two sides.

Pro and Anti ALK

I agree with the pull together sentiment and that’s the direction I feel the club is headed. Right now the club is reeling from the situation it finds itself in and it is taking the time to rightly in my opinion evaluate and chart a path forward in all aspects of the business.

If the right manager comes and he turns out to be successful would anyone bemoan the extra week or two and lack of communication?

[Lancasterclaret]

Herts isn’t in trouble, those are your words.

I have read many, many comments from you on this message board when you have called out people for using anything they can to hit out at the club or favoured staff. You’ve been very vocal about that and it’s appropriateness.

Why is it okay for you to call that behaviour out, and not someone else?

I am as much a fan of the club, as you are.

He has a point to be fair

[Newcastleclaret93]

I agree with the pull together sentiment and that’s the direction I feel the club is headed. Right now the club is reeling from the situation it finds itself in and it is taking the time to rightly in my opinion evaluate and chart a path forward in all aspects of the business.

If the right manager comes and he turns out to be successful would anyone bemoan the extra week or two and lack of communication?

If I’m honest I don’t think the split in fan base stems from lack of communication. I think it stems from the debt and the subsequent issues arising afterwords.

ALK have somehow got to get the fan base as a whole to get back supporting the vision.

Not sure how they manage that tbh.

[Blakesboots]

If I’m honest I don’t think the split in fan base stems from lack of communication. I think it stems from the debt and the subsequent issues arising afterwords.

ALK have somehow got to get the fan base as a whole to get back supporting the vision.

Not sure how they manage that tbh.

I can see your point, but I don’t personally know or even if it’s appropriate to discuss/involve fans in the financial runnings of a business/football club.

We all like to read the analysis of those on this board who have financial industry backgrounds and it’s always good to know that there are trusted people who can offer sound and rationale interpretation of the accounts. Yet they will also know that a balance sheet doesn’t tell a full story and that it is an ever changing picture that is lagged.

Every owner are custodians of the club they own. They have to be entrusted to do the their best for the club as they see fit at the time. There will be mistakes, no business is always on the rise.

[RVclaret]

I personally think it’s fantastic to have Blakesboots on this board and offer an alternative view to the constant negativity and bias against the owners. Keep it up!

[Herts Clarets]

This was a discussion about the academy, and you directly attributing the current issues with the current ownership, in my opinion not everything can be laid at the same door.

The wider issues you raise were always going to be a concern, the club was always at risk of relegation and unfortunately that is now a reality. Can you really say that the clubs transfer business hasn’t moved forward under the new ownership? That it was potentially time to refresh the management structure?

Has the club shop gone backwards since the new owners took over, it was it always in need of development?

Was communication better under the previous owners?

What I do know is that under the previous ownership and with Jon Pepper, BFC had a Cat 1 academy. The ownership changed, Pepper departed shortly afterwards and it appears those who took over are not of the same calibre, hence the impending downgrade. I am not a believer in coincidence.

The club was at risk of relegation, however for the past 6 years have managed to avoid it. Has the transfer business moved forwards? The jury is out. Cornet has been a positive. The Wood sale was forced. I am not sure what Weghorst is supposed to bring. He is huge but not good in the air. He has zero pace. Was it time to refresh the management structure? I believe it was, but not 6 months after you have given the Manager a 4 year contract. Smacks of desperation and lack of a cohesive plan to progress the playing side of things.

Website, shop and ticketing have long been in need of attention. An area that has not improved at all. Was communication better under the previous owner? No it wasn't but this smacks of when a new government comes in and lays the blame on the previous administration. It will only wash for so long and then people expect to see progress. I am seeing the opposite at present and am rightly voicing concerns.

[randomclaret2]

I personally think it’s fantastic to have Blakesboots on this board and offer an alternative view to the constant negativity and bias against the owners. Keep it up!

Aye, but who is he ?

[aggi]

If I’m honest I don’t think the split in fan base stems from lack of communication. I think it stems from the debt and the subsequent issues arising afterwords.

ALK have somehow got to get the fan base as a whole to get back supporting the vision.

Not sure how they manage that tbh.

I don't think it's anything new. There was always a split with the save money for a rainy day/splash the cash factions previously under Garlick. What has really prompted it has been relegation, if we'd stayed up by the skin of our teeth there would (unsurprisingly) been a lot less negativity.

[Blakesboots]

Aye, but who is he ?

A fan of the club, no more, no less!

[Newcastleclaret93]

I don't think it's anything new. There was always a split with the save money for a rainy day/splash the cash factions previously under Garlick. What has really prompted it has been relegation, if we'd stayed up by the skin of our teeth there would (unsurprisingly) been a lot less negativity.

Quite possibly true. It just feels more apparent right now.

[spt_claret]

I personally think it’s fantastic to have Blakesboots on this board and offer an alternative view to the constant negativity and bias against the owners. Keep it up!

I'm all for dissenting opinions breaking echo chambers and cliques up but Im not sure that hyper partisan uncritical commentary one way is a solution to hyper partisan uncritical commentary the other way.

[Blakesboots]

What I do know is that under the previous ownership and with Jon Pepper, BFC had a Cat 1 academy. The ownership changed, Pepper departed shortly afterwards and it appears those who took over are not of the same calibre, hence the impending downgrade. I am not a believer in coincidence.

The club was at risk of relegation, however for the past 6 years have managed to avoid it. Has the transfer business moved forwards? The jury is out. Cornet has been a positive. The Wood sale was forced. I am not sure what Weghorst is supposed to bring. He is huge but not good in the air. He has zero pace. Was it time to refresh the management structure? I believe it was, but not 6 months after you have given the Manager a 4 year contract. Smacks of desperation and lack of a cohesive plan to progress the playing side of things.

Website, shop and ticketing have long been in need of attention. An area that has not improved at all. Was communication better under the previous owner? No it wasn't but this smacks of when a new government comes in and lays the blame on the previous administration. It will only wash for so long and then people expect to see progress. I am seeing the opposite at present and am rightly voicing concerns.

So we can agree that the club shop/ticketing situation requires improvement, but that it hasn’t gone backwards under the current ownership.

We can agree that communication has remained the same if not slightly improved and that the current ownership haven’t pushed this backwards.

We can agree that the club had Cat 1 status and now that might not be the case. We cannot agree that that falls at the feet of the previous owner or the current because we are not aware of the details of the matter. To say the current academy incumbents are not up the job is again speculation and that can’t be supported with facts.

We are dealing in speculation, which is what I disagree with and offer caution about. Especially as it is an academy that offers a service to under 18s and so there is even more emphasis of the protection of those individuals/groups.

We can agree that some signings have been positive, and some are yet to find their feet, or a coach who can play to their strengths in a supportive system. In my opinion, and we will look at the next few weeks for supporting evidence, we have and are moving forward.

We did manage to avoid relegation, and Sean Dyche did a fantastic job for BFC and all our thanks and respect will forever remain with him for those adventures. We can agree that the management needed change and that that change happened.

The contract is another issue, and in hindsight everything appears 20/20. We all make mistakes.

[Blakesboots]

I'm all for dissenting opinions breaking echo chambers and cliques up but Im not sure that hyper partisan uncritical commentary one way is a solution to hyper partisan uncritical commentary the other way.

I take your point. I don’t feel I’ve been ‘hyper partisan uncritical’. I offered caution about a live situation. I also said that if there’s a failure that we should be righting it and learning from it rather than burying it.

It’s just that those failures in systems might not be appropriate to discuss publicly.

[Herts Clarets]

Alastair Campbell puts less spin on things than I have just read there.

We do all make mistakes. But not one where the consequences cost our club many many millions of pounds.

[Blakesboots]

Alastair Campbell puts less spin on things than I have just read there.

We do all make mistakes. But not one where the consequences cost our club many many millions of pounds.

There’s no spin. It’s a literal discussion about your points and how they align with my own.

Your right, the scales are different to a mistake you or I may make. It still doesn’t change the fact that we all make mistakes.

I shouldn’t have invested in crypto, it was a mistake. It might come good in time and I won’t worry about the outlay this time next year.

[randomclaret2]

A fan of the club, no more, no less!

[Herts Clarets]

So we can agree that the club shop/ticketing situation requires improvement, but that it hasn’t gone backwards under the current ownership.

We can agree that the club had Cat 1 status and now that might not be the case. We cannot agree that that falls at the feet of the previous owner or the current because we are not aware of the details of the matter. To say the current academy incumbents are not up the job is again speculation and that can’t be supported with facts.

Let me focus just on this point. Under the previous owner we attained Cat 1 status for the academy. The club has new owners, decided they wanted their own leadership team and to take the academy in a different direction. It is now likely we will lose that Cat 1 status. The variables here are the ownership of BFC and the leadership of the academy.

If I in my professional life took over a successful business or department and turned it into one less successful, I would expect the blame for that to be laid at my door and my suitability for the role to be questioned. Many would say rightly so. Similar applies to the downgraded academy status in my book.

[RVclaret]

Let me focus just on this point. Under the previous owner we attained Cat 1 status for the academy. The club has new owners, decided they wanted their own leadership team and to take the academy in a different direction. It is now likely we will lose that Cat 1 status. The variables here are the ownership of BFC and the leadership of the academy.

If I in my professional life took over a successful business or department and turned it into one less successful, I would expect the blame for that to be laid at my door and my suitability for the role to be questioned. Many would say rightly so. Similar applies to the downgraded academy status in my book.

According to reports, the Cat 1 license was granted during early Covid days when there were no in person audits. That was under the previous ownership. Now there has been in person audits and several, not just Burnley, Cat 1 academies that were awarded status at a similar time, have been found to be lacking somewhere and ‘downgraded’. Now perhaps it’s right to apportion some blame on the current owners, but it’s pure speculation right now as to what’s gone on, that’s what Blakesboots is saying.

[Nori1958]

According to reports, the Cat 1 license was granted during early Covid days when there were no in person audits. That was under the previous ownership. Now there has been in person audits and several, not just Burnley, Cat 1 academies that were awarded status at a similar time, have been found to be lacking somewhere and ‘downgraded’. Now perhaps it’s right to apportion some blame on the current owners, but it’s pure speculation right now as to what’s gone on, that’s what Blakesboots is saying.

I do wonder if Covid hadn't happened, and we'd had a physical inspection back then, we might well have failed at that point.

[ClaretTony]

According to reports, the Cat 1 license was granted during early Covid days when there were no in person audits. That was under the previous ownership. Now there has been in person audits and several, not just Burnley, Cat 1 academies that were awarded status at a similar time, have been found to be lacking somewhere and ‘downgraded’. Now perhaps it’s right to apportion some blame on the current owners, but it’s pure speculation right now as to what’s gone on, that’s what Blakesboots is saying.

Several so far appears to be Birmingham who have become the first club to have had their Cat 1 status removed. They had some horrendous issues.

I believe we were fine for Cat 1 at the time and would have passed the audit. I’d have expected nothing less with Pepper’s background.

[paulatky]

Herts isn’t in trouble, those are your words.

I have read many, many comments from you on this message board when you have called out people for using anything they can to hit out at the club or favoured staff. You’ve been very vocal about that and it’s appropriateness.

Why is it okay for you to call that behaviour out, and not someone else?

I am as much a fan of the club, as you are.

The difference is that the majority of fans that go to away matches know who Claret Tony is can have a chat with him.

You are very reluctant to say who you are or to make yourself known to other fans.

What have you got to hide ?

[Falcon]

All getting a bit 1984 in here.

Why do we need to 'out' another poster's real identity. I'd be weirded right out if it were me.

[Blakesboots]

The difference is that the majority of fans that go to away matches know who Claret Tony is can have a chat with him.

You are very reluctant to say who you are or to make yourself known to other fans.

What have you got to hide ?

No that isn’t a difference. That’s changing the discussion points.

I have nothing to hide, but would knowing my identity change your thoughts about me or the views I have?

[Blakesboots]

All getting a bit 1984 in here.

Why do we need to 'out' another poster's real identity. I'd be weirded right out if it were me.

Totally agree.

[Blakesboots]

Several so far appears to be Birmingham who have become the first club to have had their Cat 1 status removed. They had some horrendous issues.

I believe we were fine for Cat 1 at the time and would have passed the audit. I’d have expected nothing less with Pepper’s background.

We can all believe that we would have passed an in person audit. No one purposefully goes out to fail an audit. We are working off half truths, or a lack of the full coherent picture. Therefore surely we all must have caution and wait until the due process is completed.

The fact that the club have appealed it must show to you that there is cause for hope with that appeal?

[SalouClaret]

Some weirdos on this board. What does it matter who blakesboots is? I think a few posters are jealous that they are no longer 'in the know'.

We're going up next season. UTC!

[Tall Paul]

No that isn’t a difference. That’s changing the discussion points.

I have nothing to hide, but would knowing my identity change your thoughts about me or the views I have?

Unfortunately, that's the way debate and discussion has gone these days. The identity of the person making the point is often treated as more important than the point they're making and argued against as such.