Well done Alan Pace.

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ClaretPete001
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by ClaretPete001 » Fri Jun 17, 2022 3:16 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 12:19 pm
That’s fine, they either sell up at a loss to themselves or they keep running the show with the aim to be stable but be in with a shout of promotion.
Rover's turnover is £16 million in the Championship - their wage bill is funded by the Venky's.

The MSD interest only debt repayment is getting on for £5 million..

There is no stable with a shout of promotion option...!
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RVclaret
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by RVclaret » Fri Jun 17, 2022 3:20 pm

ClaretPete001 wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 3:16 pm
Rover's turnover is £16 million in the Championship - their wage bill is funded by the Venky's.

The MSD interest only debt repayment is getting on for £5 million..

There is no stable with a shout of promotion option...!
Loan could be reduced by then or paid off. We are talking years from now. Not long ago the doom picture painted was we were having to pay back 40m+ on relegation, meaning player sales just to pay off debt - a few weeks later, how did that turn out?

You literally have zero clue what could or could not happen in 2 or 3 years time. I don’t know why you bother worrying so much about it right now.

If our cat 1 academy starts producing Champ level players, which it might well do, great - combine that with a data and analysis driven approach to recruitment and who knows?

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by clive40golf » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:16 pm

cblantfanclub wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 11:17 am
"You believe he’s working hard for the club, I believe he’s working hard for the investors."

Er - Investors want return on money = successful club. Fans want successful club. No difference except investors get a bob or two out of it, fans enjoyment. Don't get your argument. There's nothing in it for the investors if we go bust.
If you don’t believe that if Burnley aren’t successful this season or in the coming seasons he wouldn’t start stripping the club of its assets ie players, training ground, other holdings owned by BFC, to pay the investors, then good on you.
I hope VK is successful, I hope Burnley get promoted, I hope we play attractive free flowing football, which Claret supporters wouldn’t ? I even hope that I’m proved wrong about Pace and that he goes onto become the best Chairman ever. But upto now he hasn’t done anything to merit praise, like he’s some messiah
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KRBFC
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by KRBFC » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:20 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 3:20 pm
Loan could be reduced by then or paid off. We are talking years from now. Not long ago the doom picture painted was we were having to pay back 40m+ on relegation, meaning player sales just to pay off debt - a few weeks later, how did that turn out?
the picture hasn't changed really though, has it? I don't see how kicking the can of £100m debt further down the road can be seen as a positive? it's considerably more dangerous, **** or bust is an incredibly high risk strategy.
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RVclaret
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by RVclaret » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:21 pm

KRBFC wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:20 pm
the picture hasn't changed really though, has it? I don't see how kicking the can of £100m debt further down the road can be seen as a positive? it's considerably more dangerous, **** or bust is an incredibly high risk strategy.
Well it’s all been completely agreed upon by the lender which suggests it’s not ‘considerably more dangerous’ or they wouldn’t allow it. And there’s no s*** or bust, what are you talking about. Deary me.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by KRBFC » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:23 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:21 pm
Well it’s all been completely agreed upon by the lender which suggests it’s not ‘considerably more dangerous’ or they wouldn’t allow it. And there’s no s*** or bust, what are you talking about. Deary me.
Do you think the lender gives a **** about the football club? they'll get their money back regardless and a hefty profit.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by Newcastleclaret93 » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:25 pm

KRBFC wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:20 pm
the picture hasn't changed really though, has it? I don't see how kicking the can of £100m debt further down the road can be seen as a positive? it's considerably more dangerous, **** or bust is an incredibly high risk strategy.
Your correct.

It’s great news for this summer. But in reality all it has done has put more pressure on promotion. It will be considerably worse if we are still in the championship and have the debt to pay off.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by KRBFC » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:27 pm

You are suggesting we can now reinvest money from player sales into improving the squad because we've kept the bailiffs out for now and acting like it's great news :lol:

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by taio » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:28 pm

I just can't fathom why some people can't see it's a high risk strategy.

RVclaret
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by RVclaret » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:29 pm

KRBFC wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:23 pm
Do you think the lender gives a **** about the football club? they'll get their money back regardless and a hefty profit.
Of course a lender cares who they lend their money to. Can’t even believe I’m having to say that. I’m done here.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by KRBFC » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:30 pm

Chester said the figure owed to Garlick is approx £48m and £50m to MSD.

If we reinvest money from player sales now, where does money to pay debts come from next year if we aren't promoted? What's the parachute payment for year 2? will that even cover club running costs?

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by RVclaret » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:31 pm

taio wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:28 pm
I just can't fathom why some people can't see it's a high risk strategy.
Whats the risk? We have to sell our best players? That’s the reality of being in the Championship and without a big financial backer. Look at Swansea now, they are having to significantly reduce their wage bill and will likely sell Piroe this summer for north of 10-15m, having bought him for 1m last summer. They will then look to replace with another 1m signing. It is what it is.

RVclaret
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by RVclaret » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:32 pm

KRBFC wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:30 pm
Chester said the figure owed to Garlick is approx £48m and £50m to MSD.

If we reinvest money from player sales now, where does money to pay debts come from next year if we aren't promoted? What's the parachute payment for year 2? will that even cover club running costs?
Chester does not know if that figure stays the same upon relegation. Most business transactions it would be reduce. No one knows.

This conversation is actually boring me. It’s been done over and over.
Last edited by RVclaret on Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by KRBFC » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:32 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:29 pm
Of course a lender cares who they lend their money to. Can’t even believe I’m having to say that. I’m done here.
they lent to Derby, they know they'll get their money back out of football clubs when it's secured against club assets.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by KRBFC » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:32 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:32 pm
Chester does not know if that figure stays the same upon relegation. Most business transactions it would be reduce. No one knows.
There is zero evidence that figure is reduced.

It's been done to death and you still don't get it, somehow.

RVclaret
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by RVclaret » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:33 pm

KRBFC wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:32 pm
There is zero evidence that figure is reduced.
There’s zero evidence it’s not reduced.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by AwayClaret » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:34 pm

Is it hot on that roundabout you lads keep going around 🤣😃
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taio
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by taio » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:35 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:31 pm
Whats the risk? We have to sell our best players? That’s the reality of being in the Championship and without a big financial backer. Look at Swansea now, they are having to significantly reduce their wage bill and will likely sell Piroe this summer for north of 10-15m, having bought him for 1m last summer. They will then look to replace with another 1m signing. It is what it is.
That the owner can't afford to service the club's debt - a risk that increases for every year we are out of the PL.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by dsr » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:35 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:21 pm
Well it’s all been completely agreed upon by the lender which suggests it’s not ‘considerably more dangerous’ or they wouldn’t allow it. And there’s no s*** or bust, what are you talking about. Deary me.
Burnley FC owe £50m to MSD. Burnley FC are guaranteed £50m in parachute money from the PL in the summers of 2023 and 2024. That parachute money is promised to MSD to repay the loan, so as long as Sky Sports and/or the Premier League don't go bust, that money is safe as far as MSD is concerned.

"Considerably more dangerous" means the risk to Burnley FC. Just because MSD are happy with the parachute money does not mean that Burnley FC are safe. That parachute money might have been useful for paying the bills.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by RVclaret » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:36 pm

taio wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:35 pm
That the owner can't afford to service the club's debt - a risk that increases for every year we are out of the PL.
Again, servicing debts is something I’m 100% sure has been modelled, forecasted and anticipated by smarter people than you and I.
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by KRBFC » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:39 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:33 pm
There’s zero evidence it’s not reduced.
But it was never mentioned that it would be reduced, there is no mention of that anywhere. So I've no idea why people on here are certain it will reduce, it would've been mentioned already if that was the case.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by taio » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:39 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:36 pm
Again, servicing debts is something I’m 100% sure has been modelled, forecasted and anticipated by smarter people than you and I.
I've seen very smart people describe the risks expertly. I've also seen other owners who were apparently smart people ruin their club.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by dsr » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:41 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:36 pm
Again, servicing debts is something I’m 100% sure has been modelled, forecasted and anticipated by smarter people than you and I.
I don't have a mortgage. If I took out the maximum mortgage my house would bear, and gave all the money away to someone else and got nothing in return, I could afford to service the debt. But I'm not going to do it - can you see why?

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by jedi_master » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:41 pm

Like I posted some weeks ago, the club will make a choice this summer.

1 - Sell everything worth anything and use that money to get back in black (at least as far as MSD are concerned - I am personally not concerned by the money owed to Garlick and the other shareholders, that will - I think - take care of itself by means of club ownership being transferred etc).

2 - Sell a modest amount to pay off the money owed this summer/interest and spend the parachute payments (and even, potentially, further loans) on investing in the squad to attempt an immediate return.

One is a sensible, sustainable, long term strategy that will likely mean we are nothing but also-rans at this level for quite a few seasons, albeit with a progressive manager who may be fine with a slow build project with young players being signed cheap and use of our youth players.

One is a high risk, high reward strategy that could get us up straight away and back on the gravy train OR leave us up **** creek without a paddle in 12 months.

I think it was Lancaster who replied when I last put this that there is no way Kompany signs on for Option 1 with his profile - and I am inclined to agree. I think we will spend a lot of money this summer, comparatively, chasing Pace's losses. The gamble is entirely on Burnley FC as opposed to him, so why wouldn't he?
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by Duffer_ » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:43 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:36 pm
Again, servicing debts is something I’m 100% sure has been modelled, forecasted and anticipated by smarter people than you and I.
And yet still subprime lending resulted in a financial crisis. If you believe in blind faith then perhaps a messageboard isn't for you.

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by pushpinpussy » Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:57 pm

gandhisflipflop wrote:
Thu Jun 16, 2022 3:35 pm
He has really ruffled the click at BFC hasn’t he? Well done Pace. If I could be arsed I’d take that post apart, but I can’t really. All I will say is total bullshit.

since you have just responded with abusive language and not really answered the question without using obscenities i think its probably more like you cant take the post apart due to your small vocabulary. please remember children read this message board and people like you are not helping with your foul mouth language. grow up

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by Lancasterclaret » Fri Jun 17, 2022 5:07 pm

pushpinpussy wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:57 pm
since you have just responded with abusive language and not really answered the question without using obscenities i think its probably more like you cant take the post apart due to your small vocabulary. please remember children read this message board and people like you are not helping with your foul mouth language. grow up
The youngest person reading this messageboard is probably Gandhi mate!

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by clarethomer » Fri Jun 17, 2022 5:22 pm

Must be the warm weather this time.

Another thread full of bickering. Another thread arguing over accounts and financials that is best guess to everyone.

Is it me but it appears now the majority of points are just repeating over a number of different posts?

When will people just learn that if they disagree with someones point, by all means state your view but accept that 9.9 times out of 10 it won't change anything by spending time trying to tell someone with a different view that they are wrong.

Just move on. How you feel is how you feel and how someone else feels is how they feel. It's OK to feel differently about people and situations. Stop making it personal.

Genuinely can't wait for the season to start now and hopefully get some distraction from all of this nonsense through winning some games again. Either that or another technical issue for a couple of weeks ha ha.
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gandhisflipflop
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by gandhisflipflop » Sat Jun 18, 2022 9:38 am

pushpinpussy wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 4:57 pm
since you have just responded with abusive language and not really answered the question without using obscenities i think its probably more like you cant take the post apart due to your small vocabulary. please remember children read this message board and people like you are not helping with your foul mouth language. grow up
I can’t take the post? Not true. I haven’t been abusive towards you, I stated that your post was bullsh*t. I will play though, so here goes.

“Well done Alan Pace. Is this a wind up. He sacked the best manager our club ever had. Put an amateur in charge ( with little managerial experience) for the final 6-7 games of the season. Got us relegated from the Premier League in his first full season as owner. He has made more staff redundant and ripped the soul out of the club and the final nail in the coffin is he has put our amazing club in debt and gambled with a rookie manager with no experience of the championship. Yes well done Alan”

Chairmen don’t manage football teams, managers do. I would point you towards the direction we were heading under Dyche, and his record in the last two years. The ‘amateur’ he put in charge nearly pulled off the great escape. The club off the pitch was still stuck in the 90’s and behind the scenes it needed revamping. Ripping the soul out isn’t an accurate description at all. The finances have been done to death on here, he has said many times that there is a plan and he needs a chance to implement that plan. For me it starts with his own appointment which is VK. As for appointing a ‘rookie manager’, it isn’t his first management job, and has more experience as a manager at first team level than Dyche did when he was appointed. Having championship experience isn’t essential, the bloke spent 10 years winning trophies in this country in a tougher league than the championship and he knows how to win. Owen Coyle had no championship experience and came from an arguably poorer league than the Belgian league and won promotion with us.
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by gandhisflipflop » Sat Jun 18, 2022 9:39 am

Lancasterclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 17, 2022 5:07 pm
The youngest person reading this messageboard is probably Gandhi mate!
Wrong again, which isn’t a surprise coming from you.
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mybloodisclaret
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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by mybloodisclaret » Sat Jun 25, 2022 12:51 am

Thought i'd bump this thread. I know nothing is over the line with incomings, but my God i'm excited and looking forward to next season. We look to be signing some absolute top class young players. Our future.

We have a manager with virtually no one near with success as a player in the last 15 years, with a record for bringing youth through.

I was gutted when Dyche got sacked, I knew Tarks was off, Ben Mee leaves, i'm really gutted, and then Nick Pope, really sad times as a lifelong Claret of 30 years. Then the sun breaks through, new young top quality players look inbound, it appears to be data lead. It is clearly part of Alan's plan, and it looks at the moment very exciting. Ignore the doom mongers, I think this could be very special, and certainly very entertaining. Exciting football back at a full Turf Moor.

Change of direction no doubt but at the minute, thanks Alan, keep those banging players coming in.

As VK said, "it's a very difficult place to go (turf moor!"

Let's make the Turf rock again!

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Re: Well done Alan Pace.

Post by California Colner » Sat Jun 25, 2022 4:44 am

He is the one that had the sense to get rid of Dyche
He just did it a couple of months to late
😎

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