ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

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Elizabeth
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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Elizabeth » Thu Jun 23, 2022 11:04 pm

RickyBobby wrote:
Thu Jun 23, 2022 9:24 pm
£12 million. Wow. People can try and defend Pace all they won’t but he clearly doesn’t have a clue.
The person responsible though is Garlick, he sold the club to someone with no money who has no clue about football or business, and who has put the club in a debt we will probably never get out of. Garlick was supposed to be a Burnley fan, but what fan would destroy their club just to line his own pockets. A truly awful man who should never ever be allowed near any football club. I know the usually suspects like CT will try and defend Garlick and anyone else's who is mates with him, but the fact is he has destroyed this club and if we don’t go into administration in the next 2 years I will be shocked. Selling 40 million pound players for 12 million and being over 100 million in debt is only going to end one way. I am sure Pace will run as soon as he can and this stinks of a fire sale to sell players for quick cash before he runs off.
Really sad day for this club. Who wants to buy a championship club with that debt and barley any players?
Shocking.
Bet Rovers fans are wetting themselves!
I think that is a bit strong Ricky but once or twice in recent weeks I've thought this is like watching a car crash in slow motion

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretLoup » Thu Jun 23, 2022 11:14 pm

Surely if anyone is to blame for the relatively low fee obtained for Pope then it is Alan Pace who allowed Pope’s contract to run down within one year of expiry.

However we don’t know if Nick was offered a deal at any point, he may well have been, who knows?

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Middle-agedClaret » Thu Jun 23, 2022 11:51 pm

Whatever the fee, he’s gone, boys.
Time to move on,

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by dsr » Fri Jun 24, 2022 12:16 am

Pickford is 2 years younger and has 2 years left on his contract. I suppose that means he must be worth as much as £15m?

Being a Championship club that needs the money is only a serious issue if there is only one buyer out there. I can't believe there weren't more clubs interested, but it doesn't look like any great effort was made to get Newcastle to up their bid.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Wokingclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 12:33 am

Think we were unlucky that Johnstone & Forster were free's

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Wokingclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 12:36 am

Still a sad day

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Rowls » Fri Jun 24, 2022 12:39 am

It's been a pleasure to watch such a talented player perform in a Burnley shirt.

Few people on the planet could explain how few England caps he has, despite being the best goalkeeper in the league for 2 - 3 seasons.

All the best, Nick Pope, and hopefully your evident talent will be more full recognized elsewhere - it is certainly deserved!

Burnley Legend!
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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by claretandy » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:01 am

Tell me that it's no coincidence that Howe, Tripps, Wood and Pope share the same agent ? Insider trading springs to mind, it stinks.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Dingo » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:43 am

An excellent keeper who was immense for us and can only wish him well in his career. He’ll need to improve his distribution (though if he was being directed to launch it, what can he do, we’ll see how it plays out at Newc) and his influence on the pitch (it was rare that he could lift the team in the way Heaton did, and that was a big factor in our early PL years).

As for the price, if it’s £12m then that seems about right under the conditions (wants to leave, relegation, club needs funds) and in this market (few top clubs in need of a keeper). Pope is an excellent keeper, but he’s not at the level of De Gea, Alisson, Ederson, and it’s rare keepers are sold for much more that. Perhaps we could expect a premium due to being English (as we saw with Pickford) but generally, outside of a few exceptions, keepers don’t go for crazy money.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretMov » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:45 am

Use the money to bring in 3 or 4 player's he's been our best ever keeper but he's gone now so NEXT

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by quoonbeatz » Fri Jun 24, 2022 8:21 am

The best English goalkeeper there is and has been for the last few years at least. Unlikely we'll see a better one playing for us. A top guy as well. Real shame he's gone to Newcastle but a privilege to have had him represent us.
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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretTony » Fri Jun 24, 2022 8:54 am

superdimitri wrote:
Thu Jun 23, 2022 10:43 pm
This is what I thought too, but I think it's an out-of-date concept, at least in top leagues.
On average, keepers are on the decline by the time they are 30.

And yet the following were regular Premier League goalkeepers last seasom

Hugo Lloris 35
Lukasz Fabianski 37
David de Gea 31
Edoard Mendy 30
Kasper Schmeichel 35
Martin Dubravka 33
Tim Krul 34
Ben Foster 39
Fraser Forster 34

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretTony » Fri Jun 24, 2022 8:55 am

quoonbeatz wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 8:21 am
The best English goalkeeper there is and has been for the last few years at least. Unlikely we'll see a better one playing for us. A top guy as well. Real shame he's gone to Newcastle but a privilege to have had him represent us.
Couldn't agree more. I think he's getting even better as a keeper and a really good guy around the place.
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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretPete001 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:34 am

I must say I'd rather have Pope than De Gea can barely think of a mistake he has made during his tenure at the club.

Kicking not the best but the best shot stopper and most consistent keeper I've seen and that's saying something given we've had some great keepers.

One churlish point the fee being bandied about is way below what some were expecting on here.

Another churlish point: can't understand why some seem to be looking forward to mid table Championship football and losing top notch players like Mee, Tarko and Pope.

I know who I'd rather be watching.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by AlargeClaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:51 am

He’ll do well there as they’re gonna be shipping goals and under pressure ,however much they attack . Pope’s really matured as a keeper and is a little unfortunate to be one of a very talented “surplus” generation of English keepers like Foster,Forster,Hart,Heaton,Butland et al . Seems a cracking bloke too .

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by RVclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:54 am

ClaretPete001 wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:34 am
Another churlish point: can't understand why some seem to be looking forward to mid table Championship football and losing top notch players like Mee, Tarko and Pope.
People are looking forward to watching a better brand of football with some young exciting players. We’ve all loved watching the holy trinity you mentioned over the years but it’s come to an end with relegation. It’s that simple.

As for mid table Championship football, I don’t know why you need to be so negative all the time about our chances but we need to see what transfer business gets done first. Our squad looks more than capable of making the top 6 at a minimum, with a few rumoured additions (Twine and Ballard) already looking promising.
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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by KlyBfc » Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:05 am

I thought originally we’d get 20/25m for Pope but the market has dictated that we have to settle for a figure below his abilities. Perhaps the board could have waited it out for more and risked nobody coming in for him / having an unhappy player. Perhaps more might have meant the fee spread over the length of the contract as opposed to maybe we’ve got 10 upfront, which in terms of a rebuild is not what we need. So if it’s 10m upfront and that allows us to bring in 2 or 3 new players immediately then I am happy with that and happy that Pope has got the move he wanted.
Good luck Nick

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretPete001 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:25 am

RVclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:54 am
People are looking forward to watching a better brand of football with some young exciting players. We’ve all loved watching the holy trinity you mentioned over the years but it’s come to an end with relegation. It’s that simple.

As for mid table Championship football, I don’t know why you need to be so negative all the time about our chances but we need to see what transfer business gets done first. Our squad looks more than capable of making the top 6 at a minimum, with a few rumoured additions (Twine and Ballard) already looking promising.
I didn't comment on our chances; rather, other people expressing an expectation and a preference for watching mid-table football than what we have seen recently in the PL.

At this point, I haven't made any comments on next season because we haven't seen the final squad yet.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretPete001 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:30 am

KlyBfc wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:05 am
I thought originally we’d get 20/25m for Pope but the market has dictated that we have to settle for a figure below his abilities. Perhaps the board could have waited it out for more and risked nobody coming in for him / having an unhappy player. Perhaps more might have meant the fee spread over the length of the contract as opposed to maybe we’ve got 10 upfront, which in terms of a rebuild is not what we need. So if it’s 10m upfront and that allows us to bring in 2 or 3 new players immediately then I am happy with that and happy that Pope has got the move he wanted.
Good luck Nick
A lot of people thought 20 - 25 million so you weren't alone. I think the media have commented that we seem to be the one club not trying to cash in on the Saudi effect but "hey ho" that is the media for you.

I wouldn't speculate on the deal other than to say one way or another we an get our hands on most, if not all, of the money.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by tiger76 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:44 am

Nick's in impressive company here.

Nick Pope kept 46 clean sheets in the four Premier League seasons he played for Burnley.

Only Ederson (71), Hugo Lloris (49) and David De Gea (48) had a higher total in the same seasons.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretTony » Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:46 am

tiger76 wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:44 am
Nick's in impressive company here.

Nick Pope kept 46 clean sheets in the four Premier League seasons he played for Burnley.

Only Ederson (71), Hugo Lloris (49) and David De Gea (48) had a higher total in the same seasons.
Remarkable record - and to even be compared with those three says so much about him. Brilliant for us.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by MT03ALG » Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:00 am

Ironic that both Colin McDonald and Nick Pope made just 8 appearances for England whilst playing for Burnley F.C. although these two great keepers ended their careers at Burnley in completely different circumstances.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by TheFish » Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:01 am

Got to say I'm really happy with the deal. £10-12m for an England international 'keeper, who's better with the ball at his feet than our current number 1, and who has a good reputation as a character too? Really good bit of business. To be honest, the only bit of business that hasn't appeared really good is Wood, but then there are mitigating factors there too (we needed a striker quickly because Wilson was injured, we knew Wood had a release clause so there'd be no protracted transfer saga, it weakened a relegation rival).

He'll surely be our new No.1, but it's nice to have a little competition for places, wherever they are on the pitch. Can't remember us having this strength in depth between the sticks since Given/Harper over a decade ago.
AlargeClaret wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 9:51 am
He’ll do well there as they’re gonna be shipping goals and under pressure ,however much they attack . Pope’s really matured as a keeper and is a little unfortunate to be one of a very talented “surplus” generation of English keepers like Foster,Forster,Hart,Heaton,Butland et al . Seems a cracking bloke too .
Dunno where this idea comes from that we're shipping goals or under pressure. After the January window only 5 clubs conceded fewer goals per game. Howe has, against all expectations, really tightened up our defence.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by boatshed bill » Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:05 am

ClaretTony wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 10:46 am
Remarkable record - and to even be compared with those three says so much about him. Brilliant for us.
When we defended with the correct shape we were incredibly hard to break down, getting even the top sides (Man City excluded) to shoot from distance on many occasions.
I used to enjoy our quality defending.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretTony » Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:08 am

boatshed bill wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:05 am
When we defended with the correct shape we were incredibly hard to break down, getting even the top sides (Man City excluded) to shoot from distance on many occasions.
I used to enjoy our quality defending.
Me too - always worried of course every time a team got forward against us but the way we defended was brilliant to watch.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Goddy » Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:16 am

Glad it's not just ne then....I used to love watching how we defended. Whilst I'm all for attacking football I really used to appreciate (and enjoy, oddly enough) how well we defended.

As for NP, my thanks to him. I don't know, but he always seemed a down to earth, unassuming guy who loved to play for us. Good luck to him...
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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by MrTopTier » Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:22 am

All the best Nick Pope.

Tremendous keeper and worth at least ten points a season. Absolutely top notch, will miss him, but can only wish him the best.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Middle-agedClaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:23 am


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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretPete001 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:25 am

ClaretTony wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:08 am
Me too - always worried of course every time a team got forward against us but the way we defended was brilliant to watch.
The 2-0 win against Liverpool was the best Burnley performance I've seen.

For those with a mathematical bent it was like watching geometry in motion. Two banks of four with Defour breaking through the midfield and the pace of Grey.

20 per cent possession and not for a minute did it feel like we were going to lose.

It minded me of Real Madrid's performance against Liverpool. A ruthlessly effective team exposing every weakness in the Liverpool team to the point where an England full back was so mesmerised he could have been playing on Stanley Park and still been closer to the Madrid players.
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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Stayingup » Fri Jun 24, 2022 2:08 pm

claretandy wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:01 am
Tell me that it's no coincidence that Howe, Tripps, Wood and Pope share the same agent ? Insider trading springs to mind, it stinks.
Tell you what Howe has landed in his feet at Newcastle. He's been lucky. Doubt that Sean Dyche will have such good luck.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by the_fat_shearer » Fri Jun 24, 2022 2:41 pm

A great keeper for us. I'm not sure who was better, him or Heaton. They had different attributes.
For sure Nick Pope is the best keeper at coming from crosses that I have ever seen (including all teams). You don't see the stats of how many goals he would have saved us by coming and catching/clearing those crosses that other keepers wouldn't.

I wish him all the best as he deserves it.

I always knew he was a good one... In our Championship-winning season I went to see Charlton v Middlesbrough, sitting in the Charlton end with a friend who supported Boro. This was in the stage when things were unclear if Karanka was staying or not and it affected their play. Despite being down near the bottom (and obviously relegated that season), Charlton won 2:0. I commented to my Boro-supporting friend that I liked the look of two Charlton players. I looked up their names and it was Nick Pope and Jóhann Berg Guðmundsson! Almost felt like a Burnley scout when we signed them that summer!

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Belgianclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 3:06 pm

12 million for Pope is an absolute steal...

Sorry to see him go, one of the best goalkeepers in the land and should be England nr. 1 if you ask me.

Thanks for the years of terrific service and good luck to the lad anyway

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by superdimitri » Fri Jun 24, 2022 5:00 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 8:54 am
And yet the following were regular Premier League goalkeepers last seasom

Hugo Lloris 35
Lukasz Fabianski 37
David de Gea 31
Edoard Mendy 30
Kasper Schmeichel 35
Martin Dubravka 33
Tim Krul 34
Ben Foster 39
Fraser Forster 34
Indeed, but that's not to say they aren't in their decline. My point is, a player who is going to improve and increase in value is going to cost more than a player that's not. Pope is not going to improve at 30.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ClaretTony » Fri Jun 24, 2022 5:02 pm

superdimitri wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 5:00 pm
Indeed, but that's not to say they aren't in their decline. My point is, a player who is going to improve and increase in value is going to cost more than a player that's not. Pope is not going to improve at 30.
I would snatch your hands off to get Pope on a four year deal
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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by boatshed bill » Fri Jun 24, 2022 5:32 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:08 am
Me too - always worried of course every time a team got forward against us but the way we defended was brilliant to watch.
Agreed, it was edge of your seat stuff...
but we really were good at shutting teams out.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by dandeclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:19 pm

Looks a rotten deal for Burnley. Hope it’s because of a contract clause rather than a desire for quick funds.

If the assets are sold, and replaced with cheaper replacements that is asset stripping. It’s what happened with American owners at Sunderland…..

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Bordeauxclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:36 pm

If you are expecting our contracted players who want to leave to be replaced with more expensive replacements you are going to be disappointed.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by tiger76 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:44 pm

dandeclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:19 pm
Looks a rotten deal for Burnley. Hope it’s because of a contract clause rather than a desire for quick funds.

If the assets are sold, and replaced with cheaper replacements that is asset stripping. It’s what happened with American owners at Sunderland…..
What did you expect upon relegation, naturally our more in demand players are likely to be interesting PL clubs, and if we can source cheaper replacements then all the better, look at some of our best ever signings of recent years, many of them have been frees or a nominal fee, whereas some of our big money signings have proven to be expensive flops.

The intention seems to be buying young players who we might well improve and then sell on for a profit, an excellent policy in my view, certainly far better than wasting funds on ageing journeymen, who have no resale value, and who are often on the decline in their careers.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by The Enclosure » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:47 pm

We have certainly become a feeder club for NUFC.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by dandeclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:51 pm

tiger76 wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:44 pm
What did you expect upon relegation, naturally our more in demand players are likely to be interesting PL clubs, and if we can source cheaper replacements then all the better, look at some of our best ever signings of recent years, many of them have been frees or a nominal fee, whereas some of our big money signings have proven to be expensive flops.

The intention seems to be buying young players who we might well improve and then sell on for a profit, an excellent policy in my view, certainly far better than wasting funds on ageing journeymen, who have no resale value, and who are often on the decline in their careers.
I expected players to leave. I expected players under conTract to leave for a fair value. I don’t believe that Pope has moved for a fair value, unless there is a contract release clause.

Buying young players to improve and sell is one side of the coin. Buying young players who are cheaper, on lower wages, who prove to be not good enough is the other side of that coin…. And the one that most clubs with this admirable approach end up on.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by ksrclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:51 pm

dandeclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:19 pm
Looks a rotten deal for Burnley. Hope it’s because of a contract clause rather than a desire for quick funds.

If the assets are sold, and replaced with cheaper replacements that is asset stripping. It’s what happened with American owners at Sunderland…..
:lol: :lol: :lol:

It's a poor deal, but bloody hell, don't be such a big baby. We've been relegated and we ain't replacing our assets with better ones. Adjust your expectations or you'll ruin your summer being miserable.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by boatshed bill » Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:54 pm

It's evident that our biggest mistake in the last 5(ish) years has been failing to capitalise on players at the top of their value, and to have viable younger replacements lined up...
that and allowing contracts to run down.
Pope should probably have gone last season if there were offers.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by tiger76 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:03 pm

dandeclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:51 pm
I expected players to leave. I expected players under conTract to leave for a fair value. I don’t believe that Pope has moved for a fair value, unless there is a contract release clause.

Buying young players to improve and sell is one side of the coin. Buying young players who are cheaper, on lower wages, who prove to be not good enough is the other side of that coin…. And the one that most clubs with this admirable approach end up on.
It feels low to me also, but without knowing the details it's hard to gauge, however if that £10-12m we get for Pope allows us to fund 3/4 signings then great.

Regarding the wage bill this has needed reducing for quite awhile, so I've got no issue with us cutting our cloth accordingly.

Of course there's no guarantees this approach will pay dividends, but I'd rather that than the formula of buying over 30's.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Aclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:12 pm

ClaretPete001 wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 11:25 am
The 2-0 win against Liverpool was the best Burnley performance I've seen.

For those with a mathematical bent it was like watching geometry in motion. Two banks of four with Defour breaking through the midfield and the pace of Grey.

20 per cent possession and not for a minute did it feel like we were going to lose.

It minded me of Real Madrid's performance against Liverpool. A ruthlessly effective team exposing every weakness in the Liverpool team to the point where an England full back was so mesmerised he could have been playing on Stanley Park and still been closer to the Madrid players.
Well said Pete.....wish I could have put it down like that 👍
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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by dandeclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:25 pm

ksrclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 6:51 pm
:lol: :lol: :lol:

It's a poor deal, but bloody hell, don't be such a big baby. We've been relegated and we ain't replacing our assets with better ones. Adjust your expectations or you'll ruin your summer being miserable.
I’m long, long past football making me miserable. I am surprised that the club has hit the complete reset button though, dismissing many of the approaches that have brought great success for the last decade, to be like most other clubs. Hey ho.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by dandeclaret » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:26 pm

tiger76 wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:03 pm
It feels low to me also, but without knowing the details it's hard to gauge, however if that £10-12m we get for Pope allows us to fund 3/4 signings then great.

Regarding the wage bill this has needed reducing for quite awhile, so I've got no issue with us cutting our cloth accordingly.

Of course there's no guarantees this approach will pay dividends, but I'd rather that than the formula of buying over 30's.
3 or 4 signings? For 10m? Bloody hell, that’s incredibly high risk as an approach.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by Tall Paul » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:46 pm

How do you know it was £10m, the fee is undisclosed.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by claret2018 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:52 pm

If Newcastle keep signing Burnley players they’ll be favourites for relegation by the time the season starts

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by tiger76 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:53 pm

Tall Paul wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:46 pm
How do you know it was £10m, the fee is undisclosed.
Nobody knows what the exact fee was, but it's been widely reported as £10-12m, now there might be add-on's as well to bump it up.

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Re: ARTICLE: Pope departs the Turf

Post by tiger76 » Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:55 pm

dandeclaret wrote:
Fri Jun 24, 2022 7:25 pm
I’m long, long past football making me miserable. I am surprised that the club has hit the complete reset button though, dismissing many of the approaches that have brought great success for the last decade, to be like most other clubs. Hey ho.
We've long needed a complete reset, and now seems as good a time as any, newly relegated, new manager and loads of OOC players.

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