I am starting to collect spare pallets etc whenever I see them for my wood burner , I know they are not so good for the flue and actually probably against pollution rules but going to mix with kiln dried wood and coal , fire up during the day to warm up the house and turn the boiler well down.

JohnDearyMe wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 8:42 pm

I'm intensely relaxed given that it's likely Liz Truss will soon be our next Prime Minister.

I'm sure she'll see us all through the crisis with her Margaret Thatcher tribute act...

Can one be intensely relaxed?

claret2018 wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 6:24 pm

The latest projections are £550 per month average from January.

Something will give before that, either Poll Tax style riots or the government will fall.

If the government don’t sort something out pretty soon I can see society breaking down.

I'd like to say none of the forecasters have put it as high as you've suggested. But, all the forecasters, media and Martin Lewis talk of annual totals, while ignoring (I'm sure they do realise this) that we use a lot for gas and power in winter when the weather is cold and the days are short. So, if your £550 per month is related to actual gas and power "burn" in Jan/Feb/March maybe it is a good estimate - even though it will be lower all the other months of the year (we hope).

groove wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 8:46 pm

Apart from the obvious worries, like being able to pay bills, and being cold in the winter. My main concern is, how on earth has this been allowed to happen? The energy companies are making massive profits when people could be literally freezing to death in the winter. I always presumed there was some type of safeguarding ombudsman who would step in and say "No, this is morally wrong ". It feels like a mass transfer of wealth. A robbery. Its obscene.

Its called OFGEM. Its useless.

DCWat wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 7:17 pm

I think now is exactly the time to be worrying and trying to see what savings can be made ahead of further rises.

It depends on your budget & perspective it can be a sensible policy preparing now but preemptively worrying about what might not happen I think is counter productive & can cause unnecessary stress, apart from adding thicker layers & piking wood & looking to insulate wherever possible nothing else can be done, all the energy companies & tariffs will be roughly the same. It boils down to common sense at the end of the day.

Paul Waine wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:14 pm

I'd like to say none of the forecasters have put it as high as you've suggested. But, all the forecasters, media and Martin Lewis talk of annual totals, while ignoring (I'm sure they do realise this) that we use a lot for gas and power in winter when the weather is cold and the days are short. So, if your £550 per month is related to actual gas and power "burn" in Jan/Feb/March maybe it is a good estimate - even though it will be lower all the other months of the year (we hope).

Unfortunately those costs are the predicted costs. My estimate if I fix now. It’s not taking into account I now have solar as it’s not in my history yet.

groove wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 8:46 pm

Apart from the obvious worries, like being able to pay bills, and being cold in the winter. My main concern is, how on earth has this been allowed to happen? The energy companies are making massive profits when people could be literally freezing to death in the winter. I always presumed there was some type of safeguarding ombudsman who would step in and say "No, this is morally wrong ". It feels like a mass transfer of wealth. A robbery. Its obscene.

Two things have caused the issues we all have: (1) covid-19 pandemic and the associated lockdowns - this stopped us all buying energy, so the producers stopped producing. Then, when the world started to open up as we learn to live with covid-19, we all started wanting energy again, but it takes a lot longer for producers to get up to speed; (2) Russia invaded Ukraine - see the relevant thread for all the other details.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:24 pm

It depends on your budget & perspective it can be a sensible policy preparing now but preemptively worrying about what might not happen I think is counter productive & can cause unnecessary stress, apart from adding thicker layers & piking wood & looking to insulate wherever possible nothing else can be done, all the energy companies & tariffs will be roughly the same. It boils down to common sense at the end of the day.

Are you suggesting that all those, who are already struggling, just need to do is show a bit of common sense. I’d wager that the vast majority have plenty of common sense - it’s already past a point of struggle for too many people and it’s going to get far worse.

I can see this leading to riots in the streets - it’s playing very much like the rising fuel prices and inflation from the eighties.

I hope I’m wrong but people will be getting desperate unless the government intervene, and quickly. Quite which pot help will be paid from, I haven’t a clue, but it’s needed.

Passing it off as needing to show a bit of common sense is crass at best. I feel for all of the people who are struggling now and the greater number who will be struggling in the near future.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:24 pm

It boils down to common sense at the end of the day.

That's you screwed then.

PLEASE READ THE FIRST POST ON THIS THREAD BEFORE CONTRIBUTING - ALREADY A GOOD NUMBER OF POSTS HAVE BEEN REMOVED

Paul Waine wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:37 pm

Two things have caused the issues we all have: (1) covid-19 pandemic and the associated lockdowns - this stopped us all buying energy, so the producers stopped producing. Then, when the world started to open up as we learn to live with covid-19, we all started wanting energy again, but it takes a lot longer for producers to get up to speed; (2) Russia invaded Ukraine - see the relevant thread for all the other details.

You've done nothing there but apply a mechanical description of economic forces to a question a poster was asking about the politics and morality of that system.

Spiral wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:45 pm

You've done nothing there but apply a mechanical description of economic forces to a question a poster was asking about the politics and morality of that system.

It's good to understand the economic forces and the international political situation that has resulted in what is happening to energy prices. It may assist understanding and therefore assist with understanding what may be the best responses. I doubt there's any "morality" in ignoring these facts.

I've read about savings associated with turning down the flow temperature on a boiler, which can result in a decent reduction in costs during Autumn and Winter. Here's an example of such an article:

https://www.theheatinghub.co.uk/article ... emperature

DCWat wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:38 pm

Are you suggesting that all those, who are already struggling, just need to do is show a bit of common sense. I’d wager that the vast majority have plenty of common sense - it’s already past a point of struggle for too many people and it’s going to get far worse.

I can see this leading to riots in the streets - it’s playing very much like the rising fuel prices and inflation from the eighties.

I hope I’m wrong but people will be getting desperate unless the government intervene, and quickly. Quite which pot help will be paid from, I haven’t a clue, but it’s needed.

Passing it off as needing to show a bit of common sense is crass at best. I feel for all of the people who are struggling now and the greater number who will be struggling in the near future.

Riots in the streets I think that’s a bit far fetched if some people put as much effort into finding employment as thinking about riots all would be well, I’m not pretending everything is fine but surely at some point we have to be responsible for ourselves & what we can do to affect change ourselves, vulnerable people & poor people need to be looked after but no sympathy for young mums pushing prams sometimes with dogs tethered chatting away on the latest handsets not looking where there are going often into the road making drivers swerve or brake.

Paul Waine wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:51 pm

It's good to understand the economic forces and the international political situation that has resulted in what is happening to energy prices. It may assist understanding and therefore assist with understanding what may be the best responses. I doubt there's any "morality" in ignoring these facts.

Isn't that just an attempt to intellectualise the fact that some people are chit scared that they won't be able to sustain increased costs of gas and electricity?

In my experience the energy ombudsman is useless and the energy companies do what they want. My tips are avoid Scottish Power at all costs. Look at the profile of the CEO and then read Trust Pilot reviews of how they treat their customers. Eon aren’t much better. Never fill the kettle to the top, don’t use a dishwasher, have less baths and turn lights off. The high costs won’t go on forever but I’d be worried if I was on a variable rate mortgage and stretched how much I could borrow.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:57 pm

Riots in the streets I think that’s a bit far fetched if some people put as much effort into finding employment as thinking about riots all would be well, I’m not pretending everything is fine but surely at some point we have to be responsible for ourselves & what we can do to affect change ourselves, vulnerable people & poor people need to be looked after but no sympathy for young mums pushing prams sometimes with dogs tethered chatting away on the latest handsets not looking where there are going often into the road making drivers swerve or brake.

What about those that have jobs and are struggling? They’re not necessarily poor people, they may have had some disposable income before everything began to go up in price.

You’ve selected the easy prey, the sort that are easy fodder in a Daily Mail article and that’s a whole different debate.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:57 pm

Riots in the streets I think that’s a bit far fetched if some people put as much effort into finding employment as thinking about riots all would be well, I’m not pretending everything is fine but surely at some point we have to be responsible for ourselves & what we can do to affect change ourselves, vulnerable people & poor people need to be looked after but no sympathy for young mums pushing prams sometimes with dogs tethered chatting away on the latest handsets not looking where there are going often into the road making drivers swerve or brake.

I genuinely struggle to believe you exist.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:57 pm

Riots in the streets I think that’s a bit far fetched if some people put as much effort into finding employment as thinking about riots all would be well, I’m not pretending everything is fine but surely at some point we have to be responsible for ourselves & what we can do to affect change ourselves, vulnerable people & poor people need to be looked after but no sympathy for young mums pushing prams sometimes with dogs tethered chatting away on the latest handsets not looking where there are going often into the road making drivers swerve or brake.

TW@T

DCWat wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 10:05 pm

What about those that have jobs and are struggling? They’re not necessarily poor people, they may have had some disposable income before everything began to go up in price.

You’ve selected the easy prey, the sort that are easy fodder in a Daily Mail article and that’s a whole different debate.

You must mean people on minimum wage? The people I’ve encountered on minimum wage are never in the house long enough to use too much gas or electricity they are too busy working, they come home to sleep & eat & back out again what’s spent is hardly anything, it will hit families on low incomes perhaps who don’t work & pick benefits up the most, everybody else will be fine mostly even OAPS get the heating allowance. Things won’t be as bad as some people are trying to make out.

Jakubclaret wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 10:12 pm

You must mean people on minimum wage? The people I’ve encountered on minimum wage are never in the house long enough to use too much gas or electricity they are too busy working, they come home to sleep & eat & back out again what’s spent is hardly anything, it will hit families on low incomes perhaps who don’t work & pick benefits up the most, everybody else will be fine mostly even OAPS get the heating allowance. Things won’t be as bad as some people are trying to make out.

Why can't you just leave this thread alone for the purpose it was intended rather trying to disrupt it with your warped view of life?

Ignoring the political angle because the OP specifically asked this being about ideas to save cash.

Fuel costs - last time I looked leasing electric vehicles and getting an Octopus Go electricity tariff was decent value for those who do average to high mileage (or buying through a business, and getting 19% corporation tax relief in year 1 - for some people the money can be “stuck” in a business and can’t be withdrawm without paying tax, this helps). Pop a few numbers on a spreadsheet and it could be quite revealing how much cash could be saved over the coming years. If you are paying thousands in petrol costs, don’t disregard it. There can be some range anxiety but if money is tight, needs must.

Gas costs - the biggie for most people. Hate to be boring but put on a jumper or put thermostatic valves on and turn off the heat in the rooms not used much. Get a smart thermostat with zones (e.g. if you work on the attic turn the heating off there at 5pm). It is amazing what can be saved. I have 5 double beds and spend less on gas than my parents who have a small bungalow.

Electric costs - the biggie here is lights and tariff timing. See Octopus Go above - between 12:30 and 4:30 if you have a leccy car the rate plummets so schedule the dishwasher, washing machine and tumble at this time. It may keep you awake, but that isn’t vital if desparate. Turn lights low or off but don't use LED because I find they blow quickly despite promises and are false economy.

Water costs - we worked out the big use if on a meter is toilet flushing. Cut that down especially if working at home all day or put a thing in the tank to reduce water use.

I bet 90% of houses in the country could save 20% off their bills by clever usage and / or tariff switching. For some it will be 50%. Relative to before, not including the price rises obviously. Best of luck to all.

Paul Waine wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 9:51 pm

It's good to understand the economic forces and the international political situation that has resulted in what is happening to energy prices. It may assist understanding and therefore assist with understanding what may be the best responses. I doubt there's any "morality" in ignoring these facts.

This is just an elaboration of your non-answer. We all know why energy prices are going up, people are asking why nothing is being done about it. If someone asks, "why is this allowed?" the appropriate answer is not, "I'm glad you asked, now let me introduce you to the concept of futures markets." This is a deflection from the question being asked, probably with the aim of recapitulating the purely ideological view of the logic of the market as an unassailable fact of life whose whims every single one of us must naturally be subjected to without protest.

Spiral wrote: ↑

Thu Aug 11, 2022 10:17 pm

This is just an elaboration of your non-answer. We all know why energy prices are going up, people are asking why nothing is being done about it. If someone asks, "why is this allowed?" the appropriate answer is not, "I'm glad you asked, now let me introduce you to the concept of futures markets." This is a deflection from the question being asked, probably with the aim of recapitulating the purely ideological view of the logic of the market as an unassailable fact of life whose whims every single one of us must naturally be subjected to without protest.

I wish I'd said that.