Electric meters

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Burnley Ace
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Electric meters

Post by Burnley Ace » Fri Aug 12, 2022 2:57 pm

I’m sure the replies to my request for info can’t have so contentious or political that necessitated the thread being deleted so I will try again. Please try to keep a focus on the question:

Is it a good idea to have these meters installed, what are the disadvantages?

Lowbankclaret
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Re: Electric meters

Post by Lowbankclaret » Fri Aug 12, 2022 3:37 pm

You mean a smart meter??
Helped me reduce my usage of electric

I really don’t understand people being so opposed to them.
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Paul Waine
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Re: Electric meters

Post by Paul Waine » Fri Aug 12, 2022 3:39 pm

Burnley Ace wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 2:57 pm
I’m sure the replies to my request for info can’t have so contentious or political that necessitated the thread being deleted so I will try again. Please try to keep a focus on the question:

Is it a good idea to have these meters installed, what are the disadvantages?
SMETS 2 meters are intended to be better than the first version and compatible with all energy suppliers. I understand the earlier version could vary between suppliers and so, stopped working when you switched supplier. I've not yet got one installed. I still hear that they can go wrong and that those who experience problems may not be a priority for anyone to fix. I'd expect more pressure on the suppliers to sort this out. Generally, smart meters are valuable aid to understanding how much energy you are using and therefore can support you in deciding what you may choose to switch off to make savings. We are all paying for smart meters whether or not we have them installed, another add-on somewhere in the way our bills are calculated. Those that have ev can gain, with some suppliers, from "time of use" charges. Overnight recharging of an ev on the nights when the wind is blowing and the turbines are turning can provide very cheap electricity. I'm sure when more and more of us have EVs there will be more making use of overnight charging. In effect, the EV's battery becomes part of the electricity storage solution and can facilitate selling power back to the grid at peak times during the day - always assuming you aren't driving the EV at the time.

Bigvince
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Re: Electric meters

Post by Bigvince » Fri Aug 12, 2022 3:48 pm

Even if you’re not that fussed about watching how much energy you use, you’ll have the benefit of never having to send another meter reading to your supplier, as the meters do it automatically.

durhamclaret
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Re: Electric meters

Post by durhamclaret » Fri Aug 12, 2022 4:00 pm

Bigvince wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 3:48 pm
Even if you’re not that fussed about watching how much energy you use, you’ll have the benefit of never having to send another meter reading to your supplier, as the meters do it automatically.
I don’t have a smart meter and don’t want one, I don’t send any readings to my supplier, it’s estimated then read by them every 6 months and always seem to be accurate as near as damn.

Devils_Advocate
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Re: Electric meters

Post by Devils_Advocate » Fri Aug 12, 2022 4:11 pm

I work within the Smart Meter industry and have done on and off since its initial roll out back around 2010. I think the first thing to highlight that when people call out the disadvantages of them not working then the not working bit is just the Smart technology part. They still work perfectly fine as an elec or gas meter so having a Smart meter not working is no more a disadvantage than not having one at all.

The benefits that have always been pushed to the consumer are around having a better view and control of your energy usage so you can save money. This is true but only for people who are already engaged in these kind of behaviours and it can be limited. IMO pushing this as the main advantage was where the industry went wrong.

The real benefits that are in play today are around the supplier costs is removes which are all passed on to the end consumer. One of the biggest contact points for customers is around disputed bills be it Change of Supply, Change of Tenancy or estimated readings. It might seem obvious to most on here that it is sensible to keep a track of your meter reads especially if you move house or change supply but you would be amazed at how many people have no idea. The cost to serve of these calls are passed on to all consumers so just because you do the right thing does not mean it wont cost you. if we had 100% Smart meters queries and complaints around disputed reads would not exist because we would hold exactly what each meter read every day. The reduction in the cost to handling these calls would reduce everyones bills so moving to Smart helps everyone.

You then also need to factor in that the big energy companies of regulatory targets around installing Smart meters with huge fines if they dont meet the targets. Although the Smart meters are free at point of install the suppliers have Smart Programmes that have a multi million pound budget to deliver Smart meters in line with Ofgem and BEIS targets and again this cost is spread on everyone's bills. One of the largest costs is Suppliers have to continually market and try and contact customer to get them to have a Smart meter and this costs money. Suppliers try to install Smart meters whilst they come to your property to do other work like look at a meter fault but if customers refuse then eventually the Supplier will need to make a special one off visit to install Smart which is a lot more expensive than completing the work as part of another visit. Again all the people who refuse to have Smart are just increasing the costs for the suppliers Smart installation programme of work and again that goes on everyone's bills. If people just agreed to Smart meters then it would reduce supplier costs and reduce bills

There are then other industry costs that are avoided like sending people to read meters, identifying things like theft of gas and elec, managing debt effectively etc and again Smart meters would reduce this element of the cost to serve and again reduce the bills.

Finally there are all the future potential benefits Smart meters will provide around Time of Use tariffs for elec so we can smartly manage the elec grid and reward people for behaviours that support this. I've seen people post on here that they think this is where suppliers are going to stop you from using elec at certain times or make it more expensive at peak times but it is the opposite of this. Peak time is what it is but it will be reductions for using elec outside of peak hours rather than charging more for at the wrong hours

Smart metering has become a subject for the conspiracy brigade who think that whenever the state is trying to get people to do something that it is some kind of infringement of their rights and that they must be out to get people or monitor them or whatever batsh*t nonsense they get fed on Youtube and Facebook.

In summary Smart meters in principle of a simple idea to improve the way we manage our energy usage and reduce costs and there are many countrys who already have a full Smart grid and have had for some time. It isn't a magic wand to reduce your bills but it can help and more importantly the quicker we can move to a smart grid the quick we can reduce a lot of unnecessary costs that impact us all.

It is true there are a lot of issues with Smart meters not working as they should in terms of the Smart technology but one of the things holding back this being rectified is that the Suppliers have to focus on getting Smart meters on the wall. Once they can do that they can focus on the issue but just to reiterate when we talk about issues it is only the Smart part of the meter that communicates and not the actual meter itself.

So if you get chance get a Smart meter installed
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durhamclaret
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Re: Electric meters

Post by durhamclaret » Fri Aug 12, 2022 4:16 pm

Very good reply on this thread DA, you made some very good points, maybe I should reconsider my plans not to have one now!

Paul Waine
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Re: Electric meters

Post by Paul Waine » Fri Aug 12, 2022 4:26 pm

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 4:11 pm
I work within the Smart Meter industry and have done on and off since its initial roll out back around 2010.

So if you get chance get a Smart meter installed
Great post from someone in the industry. Worth me signing in to "like."

pauliopaulio
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Re: Electric meters

Post by pauliopaulio » Fri Aug 12, 2022 6:29 pm

Lowbankclaret wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 3:37 pm
You mean a smart meter??
Helped me reduce my usage of electric

I really don’t understand people being so opposed to them.
Exactly the same. Knocked about £60 off the bill per month just by being a lot more conscious about what we use as it’s always visible. Really helped that you can see it in £ used per hour too

Burnley Ace
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Re: Electric meters

Post by Burnley Ace » Fri Aug 12, 2022 7:22 pm

DA - too long to “quote” thanks for taking the time/effort!

No Ney Never
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Re: Electric meters

Post by No Ney Never » Fri Aug 12, 2022 7:40 pm

There is a downside to smart meters, the fact that they are smart.
I have been able to manipulate my readings just before the increase in the price cap, illegal I know, to gain a couple of months worth of dual fuel at the old price. I intend to do the same again soon, I couldn't do this with a smart meter.

Lowbankclaret
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Re: Electric meters

Post by Lowbankclaret » Fri Aug 12, 2022 7:57 pm

No Ney Never wrote:
Fri Aug 12, 2022 7:40 pm
There is a downside to smart meters, the fact that they are smart.
I have been able to manipulate my readings just before the increase in the price cap, illegal I know, to gain a couple of months worth of dual fuel at the old price. I intend to do the same again soon, I couldn't do this with a smart meter.
Eventually you will not be able to get away with not having one.
Just the way the world is going.

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