PCP Query

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Steve1956
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PCP Query

Post by Steve1956 » Wed Sep 21, 2022 12:34 pm

Hello chaps we purchased a brand new car in April on a PCP,this morning we had a call from the dealer offering us exactly the same car,but a 72 plate for exactly the same monthly cost,we realise that the finance will start from scratch again (I think)sounds to good to be true....is it?
Car dealers are they to be trusted?
Any help will be greatly appreciated thanks Steve.

IanMcL
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Re: PCP Query

Post by IanMcL » Wed Sep 21, 2022 12:45 pm

I have no idea Steve! Just posting so it goes up the list again. I would think the key would be YOUR costs involved in the agreement changeover. I suspect the dealer would get a bonus from the company, for the sale and a commission for the PCP.

GodIsADeeJay81
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Re: PCP Query

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Wed Sep 21, 2022 12:46 pm

Just trying to boost sales of new registration numbers at a guess.

Tall Paul
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Tall Paul » Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:08 pm

Look at the total cost, not the monthly repayments.

It probably will be too good to be true.

Burnley1989
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Burnley1989 » Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:16 pm

They’re buggers but I guess we’ve all got to feed our family.
I get calls every year from VW asking if I want to trade in my partners car for new, I generally change it every 2-3 years. As much as I like the cars I think after 10 years this will be my last VW, I’m just fed up of their customer service, I was close to walking away last time but needed to find a car quickly so went with it.

beddie
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Re: PCP Query

Post by beddie » Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:18 pm

Hi Steve, I’ve heard if this and believe it’s as already suggested it helps them sell a car (unit) for their monthly target, plus it keeps you on their books for a longer period. I’d check there’s no added payment at the end of the term (small print) but if it’s a reputable company I’m sure it’s fine. I think we’re of similar circumstances you and I being retired, I didn’t realise they’d allow us pensioners to do pcp. Do you mind me asking what sort of car and roughly what you pay per month, if that’s not being too intrusive. I’ll fully understand if you want to keep that private. Thanks J.

Top Claret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Top Claret » Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:25 pm

beddie wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:18 pm
Hi Steve, I’ve heard if this and believe it’s as already suggested it helps them sell a car (unit) for their monthly target, plus it keeps you on their books for a longer period. I’d check there’s no added payment at the end of the term (small print) but if it’s a reputable company I’m sure it’s fine. I think we’re of similar circumstances you and I being retired, I didn’t realise they’d allow us pensioners to do pcp. Do you mind me asking what sort of car and roughly what you pay per month, if that’s not being too intrusive. I’ll fully understand if you want to keep that private. Thanks J.


My Dad was sold a PCP when he was 88 on a 3 year deal, he died at 90 and I had to carry on with the payments for a further 16 months

beddie
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Re: PCP Query

Post by beddie » Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:30 pm

Top Claret wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:25 pm
My Dad was sold a PCP when he was 88 on a 3 year deal, he died at 90 and I had to carry on with the payments for a further 16 months
Presumably then Top Claret you must have been guarantor? therefore allowing your Dad to do it.

warksclaret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by warksclaret » Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:43 pm

Helps them achieve their monthly/quarterly targets and their finance targets too. There is a big shortage of "nearly new " cars and private vehicles on PCP tend to be looked after. Dealer therefore makes two sales (one new/one used). Great deal for you. Make sure you are first owner and that the dealer is not selling you a car that is dealership registered in September

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Re: PCP Query

Post by Shaggy » Wed Sep 21, 2022 2:38 pm

PCP renting is one of the reasons car prices have rocketed. Ot many people actually own their cars these days.

Top Claret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Top Claret » Wed Sep 21, 2022 4:32 pm

beddie wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:30 pm
Presumably then Top Claret you must have been guarantor? therefore allowing your Dad to do it.
No I wasn't a guarantor and what would be the reason for one?
I wasn't happy with the garage in Blackburn who sold him the deal and I told them so later as it isn't ethical to sell an 88 year old a PCP no matter how good the deal.

I class car salesman in the same category as estate agents, lawyers and insurance doctors all dodgy and not to be trusted








I

what_no_pies
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Re: PCP Query

Post by what_no_pies » Wed Sep 21, 2022 4:43 pm

Top Claret wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:25 pm
My Dad was sold a PCP when he was 88 on a 3 year deal, he died at 90 and I had to carry on with the payments for a further 16 months
I'd be questioning on what legal grounds they can obligate you to your late Dad's finance commitment. Surely it's got nothing to do with you unless, as the other poster soeculated, you were down as a guarantor. I'd have told them to go forth and multiply.

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Re: PCP Query

Post by Clarets4me » Wed Sep 21, 2022 4:52 pm

warksclaret wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 1:43 pm
Helps them achieve their monthly/quarterly targets and their finance targets too. There is a big shortage of "nearly new " cars and private vehicles on PCP tend to be looked after. Dealer therefore makes two sales (one new/one used). Great deal for you. Make sure you are first owner and that the dealer is not selling you a car that is dealership registered in September
It's good for them in that they get another unit sold towards meeting the manufacturer volume total, for which they'll be paid a bonus, and they get a quality nearly new car to resell through their network ... If you're going to carry on with PCP's and not keep the car after 3 years, I don't see that it being a pre-reg car makes any difference.

Top Claret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Top Claret » Wed Sep 21, 2022 4:59 pm

what_no_pies wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 4:43 pm
I'd be questioning on what legal grounds they can obligate you to your late Dad's finance commitment. Surely it's got nothing to do with you unless, as the other poster soeculated, you were down as a guarantor. I'd have told them to go forth and multiply.


I see were you are coming from as I got a little confused with the dates. My mother was still alive and died 11 months later and I picked up the tab for the outstanding months. I was her power of attorney

NRC
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Re: PCP Query

Post by NRC » Wed Sep 21, 2022 5:50 pm

Top Claret wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 4:59 pm
I see were you are coming from as I got a little confused with the dates. My mother was still alive and died 11 months later and I picked up the tab for the outstanding months. I was her power of attorney
following along on this topic within a topic...... well, trying to.

How does being your mother's PoA give you legal liability? As I understand law, as PoA you are not liable for financial decisions/debts prior to becoming PoA. Everything I've read so far suggests your role comes after the fact. Now, they can come to you as an estate administrator and ask you to honor the agreement, but you can determine to tell them to apply to the estate, together with any other creditors. At least that's how it would work in the USA, and USA law is predominantly built on UK law

beddie
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Re: PCP Query

Post by beddie » Wed Sep 21, 2022 6:01 pm

NRC wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 5:50 pm
following along on this topic within a topic...... well, trying to.

How does being your mother's PoA give you legal liability? As I understand law, as PoA you are not liable for financial decisions/debts prior to becoming PoA. Everything I've read so far suggests your role comes after the fact. Now, they can come to you as an estate administrator and ask you to honor the agreement, but you can determine to tell them to apply to the estate, together with any other creditors. At least that's how it would work in the USA, and USA law is predominantly built on UK law
Perhaps both Dad and Mum signed the agreement, therefore after Dads passing Mum became liable.

brunlea99
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Re: PCP Query

Post by brunlea99 » Wed Sep 21, 2022 6:13 pm

beddie wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 6:01 pm
Perhaps both Dad and Mum signed the agreement, therefore after Dads passing Mum became liable.
I would seriously check all the original PCP paperwork, selling a 3 year PCP deal to an 88 year old should not be the norm. The PCP people should be following legislative rules and have completed some form of due diligence. I'm pretty sure they have to go through a checklist with the purchaser for any type of finance.

Would be worth you looking through the following as a starter:

https://www.moneyhelper.org.uk/en/every ... rchase-pcp

IanMcL
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Re: PCP Query

Post by IanMcL » Wed Sep 21, 2022 6:40 pm

beddie wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 6:01 pm
Perhaps both Dad and Mum signed the agreement, therefore after Dads passing Mum became liable.
One way or the other the 'estate' would be liable, which i assume is you/your inheritance.

NRC
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Re: PCP Query

Post by NRC » Wed Sep 21, 2022 10:09 pm

IanMcL wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 6:40 pm
One way or the other the 'estate' would be liable, which i assume is you/your inheritance.
yes, but ultimately there's a pecking order of creditors on an estate, and notably with a car, there's an asset there that can go back to the creditor.

karatekid
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Re: PCP Query

Post by karatekid » Wed Sep 21, 2022 10:22 pm

Shaggy wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 2:38 pm
PCP renting is one of the reasons car prices have rocketed. Ot many people actually own their cars these days.
I have a 4 year old Peugeot and I own it outright. My partner has a ten year old mini and she owns that outright. Both run perfectly and we’ll be keeping them until they are no longer economically viable ie. Cost of repairs outweighs the value of the vehicle. Then I’ll see where we are up to with EV’s.
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MancunianClaret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by MancunianClaret » Thu Sep 22, 2022 8:26 am

karatekid wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 10:22 pm
I have a 4 year old Peugeot and I own it outright. My partner has a ten year old mini and she owns that outright. Both run perfectly and we’ll be keeping them until they are no longer economically viable ie. Cost of repairs outweighs the value of the vehicle. Then I’ll see where we are up to with EV’s.
Same, I've only ever owned my cars. If that means driving something a few years old, so be it.

Generally speaking, financing a car purchase through car finance arrangements (PCP, HP) is a poor financial decision and does not offer value for money. It depends on the individual and their circumstances of course, but most would be better buying used and/or seeking more traditional financing such as a low interest loan from their bank.
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blackburnturfite
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Re: PCP Query

Post by blackburnturfite » Thu Sep 22, 2022 8:59 am

Top Claret wrote:
Wed Sep 21, 2022 4:32 pm
No I wasn't a guarantor and what would be the reason for one?
I wasn't happy with the garage in Blackburn who sold him the deal and I told them so later as it isn't ethical to sell an 88 year old a PCP no matter how good the deal.

I class car salesman in the same category as estate agents, lawyers and insurance doctors all dodgy and not to be trusted


I once came out with a statement on this board saying, always be wary of a man in a suit, and got slated, beware of the replies Top Claret.





I

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Re: PCP Query

Post by Boss Hogg » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:00 am

Agree with the posts by Mancunian Claret and karate kid. How does anyone know what their position will be in 3 or 4 years ? Surely Covid should have made people think about that. I’ve had mainly company cars but also done a lease, hp and pcp. Buy something with cash is my preferred route. Far too many people driving around in cars they can’t really afford unless they are financed up to the hilt just so it looks good on the drive. Sensible people can see through this. Buy cash or use a bank loan or loan on preferential rates that aren’t linked to the car. PCPs and Leases may work for some but really offer poor value and the latter are very strict even someone else dents or scratches your car.

claret2018
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Re: PCP Query

Post by claret2018 » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:10 am

It depends on circumstances. You used to be able to get amazing deals on personal leases, but not so much now.

Personally I’d be happy to never own a car ever again, spending a big chunk of cash on a heavily depreciating asset seems like a bad idea to me.

I like the idea of changing cars every 3-4 years so you don’t end up with big repair bills, and the tech moves so fast these days each new car seems like a big upgrade.

Burnley1989
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Burnley1989 » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:22 am

claret2018 wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:10 am
It depends on circumstances. You used to be able to get amazing deals on personal leases, but not so much now.

Personally I’d be happy to never own a car ever again, spending a big chunk of cash on a heavily depreciating asset seems like a bad idea to me.

I like the idea of changing cars every 3-4 years so you don’t end up with big repair bills, and the tech moves so fast these days each new car seems like a big upgrade.
Agree, I’ve not had to repair anything on a car for about 10 years, it’s all preference but those that buy them love the ‘you can’t really afford the car’ line.

taio
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Re: PCP Query

Post by taio » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:26 am

I buy upfront. Wife uses PCP. Not much in it between cash buyer, PCP or lease.

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Re: PCP Query

Post by Herts Clarets » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:46 am

I bought a 3 series BMW in 2019, 2013 plate with 75k on the clock using my previous car plus a low rate bank loan to finance it. I ran it for 3 years and the only thing i spent aside from fuel, servicing and MOTs was on brakes and tyres, consumables that you expect to replace. Oh and a headlight bulb. i put 40k miles on it and sold it for 1600 quid less than i paid for it. That works out at around 45 quid a month of ownership to finance it. I have done the same with my next car and although it cost a fair amount more than the BMW i expect when i do change that it will have cost me way less than any PCP deal.
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Boss Hogg » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:48 am

claret2018 wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:10 am
It depends on circumstances. You used to be able to get amazing deals on personal leases, but not so much now.

Personally I’d be happy to never own a car ever again, spending a big chunk of cash on a heavily depreciating asset seems like a bad idea to me.

I like the idea of changing cars every 3-4 years so you don’t end up with big repair bills, and the tech moves so fast these days each new car seems like a big upgrade.
I buy older outright and turn them around fast. Hardly lose any money and rarely spend much on repairs. If I had no job tomorrow I can still afford the car and to run it.

taio
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Re: PCP Query

Post by taio » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:50 am

All depends on personal circumstances and preferences.

Boss Hogg
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Boss Hogg » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:54 am

taio wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:50 am
All depends on personal circumstances and preferences.
Agree one solution doesn’t fit all. if you are getting a business off the ground for example , haven’t got the cash up front and need something reliable for a few years then you’d be daft not to consider finance.

Rileybobs
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Rileybobs » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:54 am

Always makes me laugh when people tell others how they should spend their money.

Billy Balfour
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Billy Balfour » Thu Sep 22, 2022 10:22 am

taio wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:50 am
All depends on personal circumstances and preferences.
Exactly. I prefer to own what I drive. My cars have been 6 to 18 months old with the manufacturer warranty still left on them. Keep them for around three years, then pass on to the missus. Suits us fine, but each to their own.

Top Claret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Top Claret » Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:11 pm

I always pay cash for something 12months old and keep a minimum of 5 years.

Last car was an Audi A4 which I kept for 10 years, I got shut 4 years ago and recently got compensation for a diesel litigation claim I made against them.

warksclaret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by warksclaret » Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:29 pm

Funny how we nearly all except a mortgage (in various formats) as a way of buying a house, and I appreciate values are much higher. When it comes to buying a car which is priced higher than the cash we have at our disposal a large number of people are very "anti-finance". I guess at least a property should appreciate when cars tend to do the opposite

claretblue
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Re: PCP Query

Post by claretblue » Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:40 pm

'...and recently got compensation for a diesel litigation claim I made against them...'

how much compensation TC? :?

I'm considering same claim but not sure what amounts are involved/expected if successful

Ta!

claret2018
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Re: PCP Query

Post by claret2018 » Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:49 pm

The best kind of PCP

https://youtu.be/vYlScxOxs5Y

Top Claret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Top Claret » Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:55 pm

claretblue wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:40 pm
'...and recently got compensation for a diesel litigation claim I made against them...'

how much compensation TC? :?

I'm considering same claim but not sure what amounts are involved/expected if successful

Ta!
VW litigation £2,600.00 took about 5 years

Ilkley claret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Ilkley claret » Thu Sep 22, 2022 5:03 pm

Salary sacrifice schemes for new EVs could prove popular tho.

IanMcL
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Re: PCP Query

Post by IanMcL » Thu Sep 22, 2022 6:30 pm

warksclaret wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:29 pm
Funny how we nearly all except a mortgage (in various formats) as a way of buying a house, and I appreciate values are much higher. When it comes to buying a car which is priced higher than the cash we have at our disposal a large number of people are very "anti-finance". I guess at least a property should appreciate when cars tend to do the opposite
Probably the timescale and rates have a bearing.

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Re: PCP Query

Post by IanMcL » Thu Sep 22, 2022 6:31 pm

Whatever happened to Steve who started the thread?

Stanbill05
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Stanbill05 » Thu Sep 22, 2022 8:35 pm

I once aspired to having a nice car then we had kids and pets. The idea of needing to keep a car perfect to hand it back without accruing charges sounds like torture. If I'd spent too much of my own money on it I'd be even worse. No, crap cars all the way for me. I can shrug when the dogs sick or the lad smashes the ball at it for the 19th time. And how could I do a tip run justice if I cared about the upholstery or a few bumps and scrapes. Crap cars equals freedom, at least until it breaks down again...

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Re: PCP Query

Post by Boss Hogg » Thu Sep 22, 2022 9:21 pm

Can relate to Stanbill’s post. We have an old car that we use for the supermarket. Don’t care or worry about anyone denting it. Some dreadful drivers in supermarkets and I once parked the one lease car I had there. It got dented by someone who drove off. The car company were very picky when it was handed back. Much more relaxing owning it.

karatekid
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Re: PCP Query

Post by karatekid » Thu Sep 22, 2022 10:33 pm

I know a Greek family on the island of Crete. One year on holiday I noticed that their car had a dent in the wing. Apparently someone knocked it in a car park at a local night club. I asked why he didn’t take it to a garage and get the dent pulled out. He looked at me inquisitively and simply replied “ Why waste money on that, the car still works ”.

dsr
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Re: PCP Query

Post by dsr » Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:35 am

warksclaret wrote:
Thu Sep 22, 2022 4:29 pm
Funny how we nearly all except a mortgage (in various formats) as a way of buying a house, and I appreciate values are much higher. When it comes to buying a car which is priced higher than the cash we have at our disposal a large number of people are very "anti-finance". I guess at least a property should appreciate when cars tend to do the opposite
That's pretty much the reason, I think. You buy a house on a mortgage, and when the mortgage is paid off, you own a valuable asset. You buy a car on HP, and when the HP is paid off, you own an asset worth less than you paid. You buy a car on PCP, and when the loan is paid off, you own nothing.

And of course the difference between a house costing £400k and a house costing £40k, is significantly more than the difference between a car costing £40k and a car costing £4k. A house costing £40k is going to be in a rotten area and need a lot doing to it, but a car costing £4k will still get you about very nicely at the same speed as the £40k car, even if it does have a lower life expectancy. I accept there are fun elements to more expensive car (though they leave me cold) but there is a large element in car purchases of paying vast sums for not all that much extra benefit.
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Shaggy
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Shaggy » Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:05 am

It all depends on what you want/need the car for.

Iv never had a car on PCP but I have seen the structured deals and basically I find them far too restrictive for what I want. I do a lot of miles so PCP is no use as the monthly cost skyrockets past 12k miles. Basically you are renting the car for a reasonable amount and paying off the expected depreciation. The dealers want the cars back in tip top knick so they can sell them on again second hand. Any issues and guess who pays..

For me I like to tinker with a car or 2 and do some track work. I have a lovely 1989 Peugeot 205 1.9 gti which is in good condition and worth a lot more now than it’s ever been. Go figure.

Just wish id bought an escort Cosworth years ago when I could have afforded one.

And for the record nothing produced nowadays comes close to the driving experience/feel of cars like the 205 gti/escort cosworh etc etc.

For balance, If I was a 35 year old female driving to the office doing less than 10k miles then a Toyota Aygo with Bluetooth connectivity to play songs from my phone all on PCP would be ideal.

beddie
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Re: PCP Query

Post by beddie » Fri Sep 23, 2022 8:03 am

Shaggy wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:05 am
It all depends on what you want/need the car for.

For balance, If I was a 35 year old female driving to the office doing less than 10k miles then a Toyota Aygo with Bluetooth connectivity to play songs from my phone all on PCP would be ideal.
I never quite understand the need for people to play music at such a volume that you probably can’t hear anything else that’s going on around you, I much prefer to hear the engine purring in case there’s an issue. It also allows you to hear anything else on the road like the emergency services.

Darthlaw
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Darthlaw » Fri Sep 23, 2022 10:16 am

Only ever PCP'd one vehicle and that was because it was on a ridiculously low rate. Regardless, it seemed the finance company had massively screwed up as the final figure was way above what the car was valued at so I handed it back an walked away after benefitting from paying a low figure in the interim.

Since, I leased a Tesla as (again) it was a ridiculously good deal. I pay a figure and (for me ) it's stress free motoring as the vehicle is under warranty and Tires paid for - no unexpected bills. Also, I get a company car allowance and as part of my job need to travel a lot so need the reliability. Interestingly, I looked at another for the Mrs and have found the price has gone up by approx 33%, which suggests that it'll be interesting when mine expires in another 28 months.

Salary sacrifice would seem to be an option but on closer inspection, seems to be a huge con when you consider the gross prices charged pre tax.

Herts Clarets
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Herts Clarets » Fri Sep 23, 2022 10:21 am

Shaggy wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:05 am

Just wish id bought an escort Cosworth years ago when I could have afforded one.

And for the record nothing produced nowadays comes close to the driving experience/feel of cars like the 205 gti/escort cosworh etc etc.

Did you see the episode of 5th Gear where they put a modern day Fiesta ST around a track against an Escort Cosworth and the Fiesta was 3.5 seconds quicker? Saying that, if i had the choice of either motor i wouldn't be driving a Fiesta....

Rileybobs
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Re: PCP Query

Post by Rileybobs » Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:54 pm

I don't know why people need such lavish luxuries as cars. Anything within 10 miles I just walk, I just have to set off a few hours earlier and dress for the weather. I own my legs outright so don't have to worry about their financial depreciation - plus I can be really smug when I get to exercise my right of way at pedestrian crossings. For any trip over 10 miles I will just get a taxi. It works out miles cheaper than owning or leasing a car.

AfloatinClaret
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Re: PCP Query

Post by AfloatinClaret » Fri Sep 23, 2022 7:05 pm

Rileybobs wrote:
Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:54 pm
I don't know why people need such lavish luxuries as cars. Anything within 10 miles I just walk...
All the things that walk/run well have four legs and if God intended us to drive cars he'd have given us three legs so we'd one for each peddle. God settled on two because he wants us to ride motorbikes
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