Club re-apply for Academy Cat One status

[agreenwood]

From the website that brought news of the demotion.

https://trainingground.guru/articles/bu ... tegory-one

[jdrobbo]

Cheers for that ag. Good to hear.

[ClaretTony]

Brilliant news if we are successful

[arise_sir_charge]

It’s all well and good applying for Catehory One Status but have Kettering Capital filed their confirmation statement or whatever yet?

[bobinho]

Very balanced. I remember when it was announced that we’d lost it…. Seemed to me some on here were revelling in the loss of it. A bit “I told you so” if you know what I mean.

Let’s hope it’s successful and we get cat one status again. That’s gotta help in so many ways.

[RVclaret]

No chance without Pepper

[boatshed bill]

Jenkins has a decent track record. Let's hope we make the step up.

[DCWat]

That’ll be one of the sticks used to beat Pace with, broken, if as Tony says, we are successful. Whilst the big stick still remains, it doesn’t feel as worrying as it did six to twelve months ago.

I still have reservations, I’m still concerned, I do though have to give a decent amount of credit to Pace. He’s made big decisions, decisions questioned my many of us (myself included) and so far, he looks to have played a blinder on the football side.

[Raconteur]

No chance without Pepper

Let's hope we can poach him back from Lincoln

[Rowls]

Fingers crossed they've got everything done properly for a successful application.

[Vegas Claret]

No chance without Pepper

that seems a bit salty

[Chester Perry]

Brilliant news if we are successful

Indeed

It’s all well and good applying for Catehory One Status but have Kettering Capital filed their confirmation statement or whatever yet?

Not due until the 20th of this month

The accounts for them and Calder Vale Holdings Limited on the other hand... let's just say I hope the apparent confidence of many on here that the deadline of the 29th of this month does not pass without the appropriate submissions is met.

I am sure you would not be so tardy

[No Ney Never]

From what I remember, cat 1 was awarded provisionally pending a proper audit after covid. Clearly some things turned out to not be quite up to scratch when a full audit was conducted.
I'd like to think that we have addressed those short falls.

[Chester Perry]

From what I remember, cat 1 was awarded provisionally pending a proper audit after covid. Clearly some things turned out to not be quite up to scratch when a full audit was conducted.
I'd like to think that we have addressed those short falls.

there is plenty of information out there about the changes that occurred between the two events, some of it even provided by the club

[Lowbankclaret]

I know two sets of parents who have kids at the academy, both are searching for a new club due to the academy manager. Many lads are leaving if they can new clubs. Things are not good at our academy at the moment.

[agreenwood]

I know two sets of parents who have kids at the academy, both are searching for a new club due to the academy manager. Many lads are leaving if they can new clubs. Things are not good at our academy at the moment.

It’s amazing how much stuff people continue to tell you despite you freely posting all of it on here.

[Raconteur]

I know two sets of parents who have kids at the academy, both are searching for a new club due to the academy manager. Many lads are leaving if they can new clubs. Things are not good at our academy at the moment.

I have heard this as well.

I was also told that it wasn't all rosey up at Boro when Jenkins was let go. A lot of things went very sour.

[Steve-Harpers-perm]

I know two sets of parents who have kids at the academy, both are searching for a new club due to the academy manager. Many lads are leaving if they can new clubs. Things are not good at our academy at the moment.

’Many are leaving’. Have you got a number of how many have left?

[boatshed bill]

I have heard this as well.

I was also told that it wasn't all rosey up at Boro when Jenkins was let go. A lot of things went very sour.

I wouldn't take too much notice of parents, they all think their kids are the best.

[Lowbankclaret]

It’s amazing how much stuff people continue to tell you despite you freely posting all of it on here.

And perhaps they dare not not but are happy for me to take the abuse.

It was the same at RR, I took on the managers as the lads didn’t feel they could.

[No Ney Never]

I have no idea what's going on, but would like to know what or who is the issue at our academy?

[Lowbankclaret]

I wouldn't take too much notice of parents, they all think their kids are the best.

There’s a difference between parents feeling their kid is the best and other stuff.

I agree all parents see the money rolling in, but that’s not what is happening here.

[Aclaret]

I have no idea what's going on, but would like to know what or who is the issue at our academy?

Same here, what or who is wrong with our Academy ?

[boatshed bill]

I agree all parents see the money rolling in, but that’s not what is happening here.

Not just about money. Go to any junior game, there little superstars can do no wrong.

[claretonthecoast1882]

I know two sets of parents who have kids at the academy, both are searching for a new club due to the academy manager. Many lads are leaving if they can new clubs. Things are not good at our academy at the moment.

You been taking coaching sessions again ?


I heard all the strikers are leaving after your last few coaching sessions, they said you kept moving the goalposts every time they took a shot

[Burnley1989]

Not just about money. Go to any junior game, there little superstars can do no wrong.

Parents ruin junior football, kids think they’re untouchable at football due to their parents filling them with ****, the minute a manager shouts an instruction or puts them in positions they dont want to play, it goes in the parents WhatsApp group and the complaining starts

[boyyanno]

LowbankClaret is not wrong. You can search my posts on the other academy threads to see what i'm talking about. To recap the club hired a number of youth scouts, some of them previous and new employees and then a raft of them left due to sessions being cancelled for young lads that they had just brought in. The sessions were cancelled due to lack of coaches. Things may have improved but it was definitely in a real mess, Auxiliary coaches were being pulled in from Manchester just to help keep the wheels on the bus.

I actually think a poster on here was an employee at the time who left, not sure if he will want to post or not.

[arise_sir_charge]

I’m junior sport there is nothing worse than a ‘mad dad’. Sadly they are the downfall of many a promising player.

[Quickenthetempo]

Parents might be a big problem but they weren't the reason the club got demoted.

As it happens, I think it's a mistake re-applying for Cat 1 status. We simply can't attract the kids good enough to spend 5m a year on it.
The big clubs have got it sewn up.

Success is selling to League one for us but that doesn't pay the bills.

It's a fans dream for local lads to get in the first team but it's similar odds to winning the lottery.

Keep the u21s but buy in youngsters or sign rejects from the big clubs with a chance of making it.

[agreenwood]

Never takes UTC long to drag a positive news story into the mud.

[Clovius Boofus]

Never takes UTC long to drag a positive news story into the mud.

It seems to be a big thing on here. Turning a blue sky grey well before any clouds appear.

[superdimitri]

Parents might be a big problem but they weren't the reason the club got demoted.

As it happens, I think it's a mistake re-applying for Cat 1 status. We simply can't attract the kids good enough to spend 5m a year on it.
The big clubs have got it sewn up.

Success is selling to League one for us but that doesn't pay the bills.

It's a fans dream for local lads to get in the first team but it's similar odds to winning the lottery.

Keep the u21s but buy in youngsters or sign rejects from the big clubs with a chance of making it.

This is something I've argued before. But we have to go all in or all out with development and hopefully after some time it will start playing for itself through contract clauses and future sales of academy players.

The good thing nowadays is you can include all kinds of clauses in sales. Plus if a player is later sold for a fee the club already is entitled to a small cut even 3 or 4 clubs later. Albeit a very small percentage.

In some ways I feel the club and many fans don't want to leave behind the history of creating good home grown players but sadly nowadays it's very hard to do that when you're only pulling players who already have dropped out of other academies because they weren't deemed good enough.

Maybe, just maybe we can build a better reputation so lads choose us over others but it's going to be very, very hard given the competition.

[Lancasterclaret]

Well, I'm taking this to be a "good" thing

[Cooclaret]

Very balanced. I remember when it was announced that we’d lost it…. Seemed to me some on here were revelling in the loss of it. A bit “I told you so” if you know what I mean.

Let’s hope it’s successful and we get cat one status again. That’s gotta help in so many ways.

Exactly this! Some really wanted to dig at Pace and used this as the battering ram!

Thankfully, humble pie seems to be in plentiful supply!

[Cooclaret]

Parents ruin junior football, kids think they’re untouchable at football due to their parents filling them with ****, the minute a manager shouts an instruction or puts them in positions they dont want to play, it goes in the parents WhatsApp group and the complaining starts

Exactly this. I’ve got two lads in North West academies. The parents are horrendous.

Parent literally standing behind a goal telling his GK son to bollock the right back because he didn’t use him to switch the ball.

Kids messing up and true or heads snapping round to wherever their parents are stood.

Kids being encouraged to roll round and play act to get players carded or removed.

I’d ban every parent attending academy training and games.

The problem is the pressure they’re under right from the start. Constantly told, if you’re not in the system, you’ll never get back in. I’ve got a kid who’s worried about going to a friends party and then Maccies because his academy coach told him that players don’t eat that kind of food. HE’S 10 and not got an ounce of fat on him. In his review (another thing I hate) they told him he could do with building some bulk.

There are some good even amazing people that are ruined by an oppressive system.

[Clive 1960]

I really hope that we are successful in replying for it . If coached well the kids will enjoy it but like some posters have said some parents think they are coaches , I helped out a long time ago why my Son was at the school of excellence and in the old days my lad was in a group for a few years but some of the young lads were taken to bigger clubs than us at that time it was so soul destroying and one or two made it and I always thought if they had stayed a few more might have made it as I always said play where you happy as when the time comes if you make it you will be ready . I just hope we can get back to cat 1 and fingers crossed it will be a success. UTC

[Clovius Boofus]

I can see a lot of kids, with pushy parents, going through the system and once out, never playing football again. Football should be fun for young kids, not oppressive and made to feel like an abject failure if they don't make the grade.

[aggi]

Interesting to see that they applied for it in September. That must have been pretty much straight after it was downgraded to Cat 2 which, to me, suggests that the issues must have been viewed as easily rectifiable.

Also interesting to see that Reading have applied to go back up to Cat 1. Rumours at the time seemed to be that they had a lot of internal issues

[arise_sir_charge]

Seems an odd time to apply if we have no coaches, no support staff and players are leaving in droves.

[ClaretTony]

Interesting to see that they applied for it in September. That must have been pretty much straight after it was downgraded to Cat 2 which, to me, suggests that the issues must have been viewed as easily rectifiable.

Also interesting to see that Reading have applied to go back up to Cat 1. Rumours at the time seemed to be that they had a lot of internal issues

Looking in from the outside, Reading was a big shock. They'd been a Cat 1 ever since EPPP was introduced. Not sure what happened there.

As for us, I think we were informed of the downgrade around March but we appealed it. Not sure exactly when it was all confirmed but obviously before this season kicked off. Hopefully, we've sorted things out because we definitely had everything in place when we got that temporary licence in 2020.

[Paul Waine]

Indeed

Not due until the 20th of this month

The accounts for them and Calder Vale Holdings Limited on the other hand... let's just say I hope the apparent confidence of many on here that the deadline of the 29th of this month does not pass without the appropriate submissions is met.

I am sure you would not be so tardy

HI CP, nothing to do with football, but I read last week that Revolut (a financial services company) hasn't filed accounts. I don't know all the 'ins and outs' but, seems being late filing isn't confined to limited companies in the chain of ownership of a professional football club.

[Chester Perry]

HI CP, nothing to do with football, but I read last week that Revolut (a financial services company) hasn't filed accounts. I don't know all the 'ins and outs' but, seems being late filing isn't confined to limited companies in the chain of ownership of a professional football club.

You have got me bamboozled here Paul, as for the need for your post, or indeed it's relevance to mine. It is really rather tangential to what was actually posted.

Further I don't believe I have ever said ours was a unique situation - It is not even unique in the EFL's recent history - which is a pool of less than 80 club's, not the tens of thousands that are registered at Companies House.

What I have said - and you have argued against that too - is that if our club wants to be better and regarded well (my interpretation of 'everyone's favourite underdog') then this is not the way to go about things, particularly as we appear to be going down a road of more robust financial regulation within the game, but from without.

[Paul Waine]

You have got me bamboozled here Paul, as for the need for your post, or indeed it's relevance to mine. It is really rather tangential to what was actually posted.

Further I don't believe I have ever said ours was a unique situation - It is not even unique in the EFL's recent history - which is a pool of less than 80 club's, not the tens of thousands that are registered at Companies House.

What I have said - and you have argued against that too - is that if our club wants to be better and regarded well (my interpretation of 'everyone's favourite underdog') then this is not the way to go about things, particularly as we appear to be going down a road of more robust financial regulation within the game, but from without.

Sorry for the bamboozle. I was a little surprised to read that Revolut was significantly late in filing accounts - a fintech start-up with big ambitions (don't they all).

The first link is to an article from Sept last year, the second from November.

Revolut chief Nikolay Storonsky: We can still be banking’s super app
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/7399 ... 6f0fab361f

Revolut held up on the road to banking supremacy
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/d5f7 ... 3cab46b483

Revolut has a limited banking license in UK and has applied for, but not yet been granted, a full banking license by FCA. The articles report that Revolut also has a banking license from Lithuania which entitles Revolut to operate across the EU.

What I find surprising is that Revolut has ambitions for full banking license in UK and on the other hand is late filing accounts. The banking sector is the most heavily regulated of all sectors (maybe the only sector which is more regulated are the energy trading firms which are regulated as both financial sector companies and energy/commodity trading companies, but that's just a personal experience aside).

It puts Calder Vale and Kettering Capital late filings in some sort of perspective.

A little link to Burnley, btw, can be found with Revolut: Kitty Usher, ex-MP for Burnley, is on the board of Revolut.

For avoidance of doubt (and bamboozles) I'm not arguing that everything is fine with Revolut. Start-ups can 'crash and burn' very quickly. For all I know, Revolut may turn out to be on a similar trajectory as FTX or Wirecard...

[aggi]

Some background on the audits here
https://trainingground.guru/articles/ga ... udit-cycle
https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/ur ... 143093249/
I didn't twig that the audit function had moved from Double Pass (who John Pepper worked for before he came to Burnley) to an FA body.

[AlargeClaret]

Academy clubs become absolute magnets once they’re in the prem and cat 1 . For starters you become 1st call for the prem cast offs from city/Utd/Liverpool etc as well as being able to attract from the best of the cat 2 ‘s like Preston /Blackburn etc . Naturally you become a first call for a large northwest corridor as well .

Personally find it staggering that we’ve had another staff shortage /leaving crisis . Things were really getting together especially at the season start that turned into covid season .

Parents are hugely better behaved academy level on the touch line anyway , mainly utter turds at grassroots though .

[Lowbankclaret]

You been taking coaching sessions again ?


I heard all the strikers are leaving after your last few coaching sessions, they said you kept moving the goalposts every time they took a shot

No idea what your post means, I was just saying what I have been told.

[Lowbankclaret]

Academy clubs become absolute magnets once they’re in the prem and cat 1 . For starters you become 1st call for the prem cast offs from city/Utd/Liverpool etc as well as being able to attract from the best of the cat 2 ‘s like Preston /Blackburn etc . Naturally you become a first call for a large northwest corridor as well .

Personally find it staggering that we’ve had another staff shortage /leaving crisis . Things were really getting together especially at the season start that turned into covid season .

Parents are hugely better behaved academy level on the touch line anyway , mainly utter turds at grassroots though .

That’s never been different to be fair.
Problem is academy’s make their signings and then the prem cast offs come calling. Happened every year, whilst I was helping out some very very good players came calling but the academy was already full.
Many good lads end up out of the game because of this.

[Raconteur]

Academy clubs become absolute magnets once they’re in the prem and cat 1 . For starters you become 1st call for the prem cast offs from city/Utd/Liverpool etc as well as being able to attract from the best of the cat 2 ‘s like Preston /Blackburn etc . Naturally you become a first call for a large northwest corridor as well .

Personally find it staggering that we’ve had another staff shortage /leaving crisis . Things were really getting together especially at the season start that turned into covid season .

Parents are hugely better behaved academy level on the touch line anyway , mainly utter turds at grassroots though .

Blackburn are a cat 1 academy.

[Toby Carvery]

And PNE are Cat 3.

[AlargeClaret]

Blackburn are a cat 1 academy.

Both Blackburn and Preston ard prime examples of the vagaries in academy status. Burnley were cat 3 not many yrs ago playing the likes of accy/bury/Carlisle /Tranmere etc . Wigan were also Cat 3 for a time when they were in the prem and were bloody awful .

Preston were always miles ahead of the above clubs , However as far as recruitment was concerned , Preston were a “ steady 2” and pretty much creamed off the local ish cat 3 talents.

Even though Rovers did exceptionally well to keep their Cat 1 they’re roundly classed as “ a 2” within scouting /football networks in “ the ladder “ .

Coaches , parents , scouts and agents naturally go off league position , “ club size “ and future viability. One of the reasons we seriously struggled at to get high quality u13-u16’s through the door .