Jim Bentley

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ElectroClaret
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Jim Bentley

Post by ElectroClaret » Mon Mar 27, 2023 6:59 pm

Got the bullet at Rochdale, no surprise, Dale bottom of League 2, ten points adrift of safety.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by randomclaret2 » Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:17 pm

Be miraculous if they stay up given their current position

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by claretburns » Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:30 pm

Defender Jimmy McNulty in charge until end of season.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by Tricky Trevor » Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:38 pm

They were the bookies pre-season favourites for relegation so it’s not all on him.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by Quicknick » Mon Mar 27, 2023 11:04 pm

Rochdale in hot pursuit of Oldham. Sad for the area, but at least they can have a derby.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by BurnleyFC » Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:18 am

They had to try something.

It’s looking ominous for them.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by ŽižkovClaret » Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:30 am

claretburns wrote:
Mon Mar 27, 2023 7:30 pm
Defender Jimmy McNulty in charge until end of season.
Its really going down to the wire, huh?

Sheeeeeeeeiiiiiiiiiiittttttttt
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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by mdd2 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:36 am

Lost a shed load of Northern clubs to non league
Oldham likely Rochdale Bury Macclesfield Halifax Bradford PA Gateshead Chester York Notts Co Wrexham Chesterfield Darlington and gained a few too
Accy Morecambe Fleetwood Wigan Salford Harrogate spring to mind

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by tiger76 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:45 am

Rochdale another club who have rapidly plunged down the leagues in recent years.

Hope they get themselves sorted but I fear it will be tough for them to recover if they drop into the NL, that's a mighty tough league to get promoted from, as numerous ex league clubs will testify.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by ClaretTony » Tue Mar 28, 2023 10:45 am

mdd2 wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:36 am
Lost a shed load of Northern clubs to non league
Oldham likely Rochdale Bury Macclesfield Halifax Bradford PA Gateshead Chester York Notts Co Wrexham Chesterfield Darlington and gained a few too
Accy Morecambe Fleetwood Wigan Salford Harrogate spring to mind
Just looked through to see who has gone and who has arrived since automatic promotion/relegation was introduced in 1987.

In the League now but not in 1986/87

Accrington
Barrow
Burton
Cheltenham
Crawley
Fleetwood
Forest Green
Harrogate
MK
Morecambe
Salford
Stevenage
Sutton
Wycombe

Gone since 1986/87

Aldershot
Bury
Chester
Chesterfield
Darlington
Halifax
Hereford
Notts County
Oldham
Scunthorpe
Southend
Torquay
Wrexham
York

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by MrTopTier » Tue Mar 28, 2023 11:04 am

No real surprise, not a lot anyone can do Rochdale, been hovering near the bottom of the lowest league for what seems forever.

Bury, Oldham and Rochdale are on City and Uniteds doorstep so it’s difficult to attract people when you have the Premier league so close by.

Many years ago there was a proposal to merge Bury, Oldham and Rochdale and call them Manchester North End. Obviously didn’t happen.
Wonder if they are all thinking what if?

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by AfloatinClaret » Tue Mar 28, 2023 12:23 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 10:45 am

Gone since 1986/87

Aldershot
Bury
Chester
Chesterfield
Darlington
Halifax
Hereford
Notts County
Oldham
Scunthorpe
Southend
Torquay
Wrexham
York
I've watched both Oldham & Notts County playing in the EPL/1st Division; did any of the rest ever reach such dizzy heights?

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by Herts Clarets » Tue Mar 28, 2023 12:32 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 10:45 am
Just looked through to see who has gone and who has arrived since automatic promotion/relegation was introduced in 1987.

In the League now but not in 1986/87

Accrington
Barrow
Burton
Cheltenham
Crawley
Fleetwood
Forest Green
Harrogate
MK
Morecambe
Salford
Stevenage
Sutton
Wycombe

Gone since 1986/87

Aldershot
Bury
Chester
Chesterfield
Darlington
Halifax
Hereford
Notts County
Oldham
Scunthorpe
Southend
Torquay
Wrexham
York
The clubs gone since 86/7 account for 13 grounds i have been to. Never done Oldham, Torquay or Aldershot but done 2 grounds for Chester and Scunthorpe....

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by ClaretTony » Tue Mar 28, 2023 1:06 pm

AfloatinClaret wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 12:23 pm
I've watched both Oldham & Notts County playing in the EPL/1st Division; did any of the rest ever reach such dizzy heights?
Notts County only just missed out on the Premier League, going down as it was introduced. Oldham got the first two years. I’ve not seen any of the others play in the top flight.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by AlargeClaret » Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:15 pm

Rochdale are surely doomed and potless ( almost ) been begging for investment for a while . Tragic that this triangle of lancs clubs ( Bury /Oldham /Roch ) should crumble . Though always poorly supported despite very decent sized populations. You have to fear for Rochdale’s future .

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by NottsClaret » Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:21 pm

I presume our last league game against them was that 3-1 win at theirs after we'd already won the fourth division. Enjoyable evening that. Shame really what's happened to them now.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by Funkydrummer » Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:28 pm

It's interesting to note from that list that none of those that went out
of the league ever got back in.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by ŽižkovClaret » Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:31 pm

AfloatinClaret wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 12:23 pm
I've watched both Oldham & Notts County playing in the EPL/1st Division; did any of the rest ever reach such dizzy heights?
I saw Oldham play Barnsley in the Premiership. Was the only game i ever saw with my brother, Dad and Grandad together. I suppose in another lifetime i could have ended up as an Oldham fan.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by ElectroClaret » Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:32 pm

Are Maidstone United still going in some form? I think they went bust and we picked Les Thompson up from them in the early Nineties?

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by NickBFC » Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:36 pm

ElectroClaret wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:32 pm
Are Maidstone United still going in some form? I think they went bust and we picked Les Thompson up from them in the early Nineties?
Finally moved back to Maidstone a few years ago with a new purpose built ground. Seem to flirt between National and National South league, looking certain to be relegated back to the South division this season. They get decent crowds usually so seems a bit strange they can't establish themselves in the 5th tier.
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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by CleggHall » Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:36 pm

Sad, I cut my teeth at Spotland prior to travelling to TM but the Dale have had little success and attendances have always been on the low side. Back in the late 50s I never thought that I would watch competitive matches between the Dale and Clarets, it just shows how far we fell. Oldham - Bury - Rochdale was never a golden triangle but had real fans and deserve league football.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by mdd2 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:53 pm

ClaretTony wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 10:45 am
Just looked through to see who has gone and who has arrived since automatic promotion/relegation was introduced in 1987.

In the League now but not in 1986/87

Accrington
Barrow
Burton
Cheltenham
Crawley
Fleetwood
Forest Green
Harrogate
MK
Morecambe
Salford
Stevenage
Sutton
Wycombe

Gone since 1986/87

Aldershot
Bury
Chester
Chesterfield
Darlington
Halifax
Hereford
Notts County
Oldham
Scunthorpe
Southend
Torquay
Wrexham
York
And quite a few promoted to the FL and then out again such as Kidderminster Rushden and Diamonds Scarborough Yeovil Boston Maidstone Macclesfield

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by tiger76 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 3:23 pm

Funkydrummer wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 2:28 pm
It's interesting to note from that list that none of those that went out
of the league ever got back in.
No although one of Notts County or Wrexham will this season.

It's difficult now for FL sides who drop into the National League as there is many ambitious clubs who enjoy the backing of wealthy owners, well wealthy in terms of that level anyway, and most if not all the clubs are now full time, long gone are the days of the butcher, baker or candlestick maker lining up in the top tier of the non-league set up.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by mdd2 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 3:42 pm

Quite a few who went after1986/87 have come back up
Exeter Leyton Orient Bristol Rovers Tranmere Grimsby Lincoln
Hartlepool

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by mdd2 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 3:51 pm

to that there are Luton Oxford Cambridge Mansfield Carlisle Newport Colchester Doncaster Shrewsbury Stockport (Cheltenham but they were not in the FL in 1896/87

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by NickBFC » Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:17 pm

I would fear for Rochdale too. The smaller league clubs who are relegated always find it difficult - see Scunthorpe as one latest example. I would class Chesterfield as a much bigger club as Rochdale and they have found it difficult - look at how long it took Stockport to get back up.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by tiger76 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:42 pm

mdd2 wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 3:51 pm
to that there are Luton Oxford Cambridge Mansfield Carlisle Newport Colchester Doncaster Shrewsbury Stockport (Cheltenham but they were not in the FL in 1896/87
Luton's rise has been stunning it's incredible to remember they were a non-league team very recently, now there's a fair chance they will be playing in the PL next season, their journey has been similar to Burnley's, success followed by a rapid descent and now just as we did in the early 2000's working their way back through the divisions although far quicker then we managed.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by Jambounchained » Tue Mar 28, 2023 5:35 pm

Always had a soft spot for ‘dale. Living in Todmorden I have a few mates who support them, usually get to a few games a season.

They’ve been absolutely shocking this term, I do worry for them when they inevitably drop.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by ClaretTony » Tue Mar 28, 2023 6:56 pm

NickBFC wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:17 pm
I would fear for Rochdale too. The smaller league clubs who are relegated always find it difficult - see Scunthorpe as one latest example. I would class Chesterfield as a much bigger club as Rochdale and they have found it difficult - look at how long it took Stockport to get back up.
The one club I always thought would come back quickly was Wrexham. It looks as though they could be on the way back now with the two American actors in charge but they've been out of the league for around fifteen years.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by Big Vinny K » Tue Mar 28, 2023 7:13 pm

National League is very difficult to get out of. There’s a hell of a lot of ex league teams in there.
Those that do get out in recent years have been the richest clubs though - and tend to do ok when they go up. Stockport went up last year and started this season as favourites to win 2nd division.

When Barrow went up they were paying more in wages than other clubs - they were attracting a lot of the best non league players from the Manchester area. So much so that they even held all their training at Hopwood Hall college near Rochdale to make it easier for their players.

Wrexham since being taken over by the 2 Hollywood actors have been the richest club in the league. The documentary made about them shows the scale of this.
When they signed Mullin for example it was from Cambridge who had just been promoted to league one on the back of a fantastic season from Mullin. Wrexham blew them out of the water on his contract and he dropped down 2 divisions. It was similar when Wrexham signed Ollie Palmer who was at Wimbledon who were also in the 1st division at that time.

At whatever level money talks and whilst it’s no guarantee eventually and especially in lower leagues throw enough cash at your team you’ll usually go up even if it takes you a bit longer than you anticipated.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by ClaretTony » Tue Mar 28, 2023 7:18 pm

tiger76 wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 4:42 pm
Luton's rise has been stunning it's incredible to remember they were a non-league team very recently, now there's a fair chance they will be playing in the PL next season, their journey has been similar to Burnley's, success followed by a rapid descent and now just as we did in the early 2000's working their way back through the divisions although far quicker then we managed.
Luton's demise was dramatic - from the Championship to the National League with three successive seasons although they had a ten point deduction in their League One relegation and a thirty point deduction in their League Two relegation.

I think they've manage to rise without a benefactor.

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by DanH90 » Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:33 pm

Scunthorpe is the really big one - a club that we played not that long ago in the Championship potentially in Conference North next season. Surely they’d go to the wall?

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Re: Jim Bentley

Post by ClaretTony » Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:52 pm

DanH90 wrote:
Tue Mar 28, 2023 9:33 pm
Scunthorpe is the really big one - a club that we played not that long ago in the Championship potentially in Conference North next season. Surely they’d go to the wall?
We played Yeovil more recently in the Championship and they are in the relegation places in the National League too with Scunthorpe and two others.

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