KV Kortrijk

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timshorts
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by timshorts » Sat May 27, 2023 6:20 am

CrosspoolClarets wrote:
Fri May 26, 2023 3:57 pm
Sounds like passionate atmosphere, old fashioned stadium, small town, traditional values and punching above their weight.
I think that it has probably benefited for a while because of the collapse of excelsior mouscron. Easy to get to, anyway, and a ground that I've not yet been to. :)

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Jimmymaccer » Sat May 27, 2023 6:42 am

Would this help (or dodge) any financial fair play rules? For example player owned by Belgium club, loaned to us on much lower wages with Belgium picking up the rest?

Tho if it’s a subsidiary or Group entity FFP may relate to the Group financials………

Just an early in the day thought!!!

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sat May 27, 2023 7:38 am

MalaysiaMo wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 2:28 am
Another example of "taking back control" .... In order to access just a fraction of what was freely available pre-Brexit (the deep pool of football talent playing in continental Europe), we'll borrow millions of £ to buy and then run a football club in Belgium that until recently few of us had ever heard of .... Brilliant.
Pretty sure clubs have been sending non-european players to clubs in mainland Europe on loan for years so they can meet visa requirements, or until they do, well before Brexit too.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by quoonbeatz » Sat May 27, 2023 8:05 am

Devils_Advocate wrote:
Fri May 26, 2023 3:00 pm
Are we for or against dual ownership and the multi-club model as I get confused? Historically it seems the consensus on here was that its a bit dodgy and shouldn't be allowed but if we decided to do it and benefit from it would that mean its now kosher?
100% against it. Should be banned.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by MalaysiaMo » Sat May 27, 2023 8:58 am

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 7:38 am
Pretty sure clubs have been sending non-european players to clubs in mainland Europe on loan for years so they can meet visa requirements, or until they do, well before Brexit too.
I didn't think we were talking about just "non-european players"....... So Burnley is thinking of buying a small town football club in Belgium that it can use to funnel non-european footballers to the UK? Wow. We'll be investing in small boats next.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sat May 27, 2023 9:17 am

MalaysiaMo wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 8:58 am
I didn't think we were talking about just "non-european players"....... So Burnley is thinking of buying a small town football club in Belgium that it can use to funnel non-european footballers to the UK? Wow. We'll be investing in small boats next.
Ah you're one of those, my bad for not spotting it earlier.
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Hedontplayforyou » Sat May 27, 2023 9:19 am

MalaysiaMo wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 8:58 am
I didn't think we were talking about just "non-european players"....... So Burnley is thinking of buying a small town football club in Belgium that it can use to funnel non-european footballers to the UK? Wow. We'll be investing in small boats next.
Not quite as dramatic as you made that sound .

If done correctly, this partnership or model will be beneficial for both sides.

If for example we sign a player who cannot gain a work permit yet to play in England, and said player is loaned out to our partner club, depending on the standard of the player , said club would strengthen their lineup for the season. The player will get a season of football at a half decent level, and the parent club , in this instance Burnley , would see the player gain a work permit and a years football.

There are other benefits obviously but this is just one aspect I see.
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by MalaysiaMo » Sat May 27, 2023 9:56 am

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 9:17 am
Ah you're one of those, my bad for not spotting it earlier.
yawn

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sat May 27, 2023 10:11 am

MalaysiaMo wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 9:56 am
yawn
I agree, it's tiring when people dump on everything the owners try to do

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by HistoricalClaret » Sat May 27, 2023 11:59 am

This model will allows us to sign foreign wunderkinds on the cheap that otherwise wouldn't have gotten work permits. Without this system we will continue to buy players when they have played 3 seasons and are worth 15 million. With it we get them when we first seem them for 1.5 million. I have three examples of this: One Bart Verbuggen, last season would have cost us about 5 million but fell through due to a failure in Work Permit. Two Jackson Muleka, A striker that we agreed a 2.5 million fee for who again fell through to work permit now would cost more due to a season in Turkey. Third Georges Mikautadze. Another Striker who is quality period who would have cost us 2 million last season now he is going to cost closer to 10 as has supposedly been bid by AC Milan (We are still interested in two of the above players). The examples above show why a feeder club that we directly control the policy, scouting and recruitment of its extremely beneficial to us and likely of them too as we will still want them to succeed. Furthermore it will save us more funds than it costs us in the long run. So to conclude if your against this your a mad man and in my opinion have a genuine agenda.
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by KRBFC » Sat May 27, 2023 12:29 pm

HistoricalClaret wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 11:59 am
So to conclude if your against this your a mad man and in my opinion have a genuine agenda.
Whilst I agree there are several potential benefits those players you used were really poor examples. Also where is the money coming from to run an ALK owned team? Is this even more money coming out of BFC cashflow?

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Rileybobs » Sat May 27, 2023 12:43 pm

HistoricalClaret wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 11:59 am
This model will allows us to sign foreign wunderkinds on the cheap that otherwise wouldn't have gotten work permits. Without this system we will continue to buy players when they have played 3 seasons and are worth 15 million. With it we get them when we first seem them for 1.5 million. I have three examples of this: One Bart Verbuggen, last season would have cost us about 5 million but fell through due to a failure in Work Permit. Two Jackson Muleka, A striker that we agreed a 2.5 million fee for who again fell through to work permit now would cost more due to a season in Turkey. Third Georges Mikautadze. Another Striker who is quality period who would have cost us 2 million last season now he is going to cost closer to 10 as has supposedly been bid by AC Milan (We are still interested in two of the above players). The examples above show why a feeder club that we directly control the policy, scouting and recruitment of its extremely beneficial to us and likely of them too as we will still want them to succeed. Furthermore it will save us more funds than it costs us in the long run. So to conclude if your against this your a mad man and in my opinion have a genuine agenda.
Maybe you have an agenda, maybe you don’t agree with the exploitative model. There are loads of things that I could see being beneficial to the club that I wouldn’t agree with, or do morals not come into this? I’m presuming all those without an agenda agree with Watford’s ownership model?

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Nori1958 » Sat May 27, 2023 12:52 pm

HistoricalClaret wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 11:59 am
This model will allows us to sign foreign wunderkinds on the cheap that otherwise wouldn't have gotten work permits. Without this system we will continue to buy players when they have played 3 seasons and are worth 15 million. With it we get them when we first seem them for 1.5 million. I have three examples of this: One Bart Verbuggen, last season would have cost us about 5 million but fell through due to a failure in Work Permit. Two Jackson Muleka, A striker that we agreed a 2.5 million fee for who again fell through to work permit now would cost more due to a season in Turkey. Third Georges Mikautadze. Another Striker who is quality period who would have cost us 2 million last season now he is going to cost closer to 10 as has supposedly been bid by AC Milan (We are still interested in two of the above players). The examples above show why a feeder club that we directly control the policy, scouting and recruitment of its extremely beneficial to us and likely of them too as we will still want them to succeed. Furthermore it will save us more funds than it costs us in the long run. So to conclude if your against this your a mad man and in my opinion have a genuine agenda.
What if the players identified don't want to play for the feeder club?

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sat May 27, 2023 12:53 pm

Nori1958 wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 12:52 pm
What if the players identified don't want to play for the feeder club?
Then they don't sign, that's as simple as it gets.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sat May 27, 2023 12:59 pm

KRBFC wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 12:29 pm
Whilst I agree there are several potential benefits those players you used were really poor examples. Also where is the money coming from to run an ALK owned team? Is this even more money coming out of BFC cashflow?
Are you asking if ALK will take money directly from the Burnley's coffers and transfer it to the accounts of Kortrijk or if ALK will withhold cash that it could give to Burnley and give to Kortrijk instead?
They're two different scenarios.

The likelihood is ALK have had this as part of their original plan when buying Burnley, they did try to buy the Italian club last season but missed out, they still may find a diff Italian club to buy to add to the collection.

The multi-club model is popular now, so it makes sense to do it if the clubs are available for the right price etc.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by distortiondave » Sat May 27, 2023 1:02 pm

How do you pronounce it? Court-Rike?

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Nori1958 » Sat May 27, 2023 1:57 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 12:53 pm
Then they don't sign, that's as simple as it gets.
Correct

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by trawlen » Sat May 27, 2023 2:36 pm

I also read somewhere that Belgium has some favourable rules when it comes to work permits for overseas players when compared with other countries, so getting players sent over there should be pretty easy no matter where they are from.

On a side note, they look to have a couple of good attacking players in their squad.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by KRBFC » Sat May 27, 2023 6:00 pm

GodIsADeeJay81 wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 12:59 pm
Are you asking if ALK will take money directly from the Burnley's coffers and transfer it to the accounts of Kortrijk or if ALK will withhold cash that it could give to Burnley and give to Kortrijk instead?
They're two different scenarios.

The likelihood is ALK have had this as part of their original plan when buying Burnley, they did try to buy the Italian club last season but missed out, they still may find a diff Italian club to buy to add to the collection.

The multi-club model is popular now, so it makes sense to do it if the clubs are available for the right price etc.
Where is the money coming from to buy this club? and where is the money coming from to run this club day to day?

Hopefully BFC is not footing the bills.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sat May 27, 2023 6:06 pm

KRBFC wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 6:00 pm
Where is the money coming from to buy this club? and where is the money coming from to run this club day to day?

Hopefully BFC is not footing the bills.
BFC 's regular income is paying for the day to day running of the club, that will eventually be shown in the accounts.

The money to buy this other club - unknown, assuming ALK have funds available that we're unaware of, maybe from investors, or even the money they've paid themselves from the club

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by HistoricalClaret » Sat May 27, 2023 9:42 pm

The money to buy the club will come from club accounts as was reported when our initial interest was made clear. "Burnley have decided to back off instead choosing to allocate funds to investing in Kompany's playing staff" Not verbatem but meh club funds will pay for it and thats fine due to the long term benefits it gives the club. Like it or not its an investment in Burnley FC

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by KRBFC » Sat May 27, 2023 9:58 pm

So we are using £13m plus yearly running costs from our promotion gains to buy ALK a new club?

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sat May 27, 2023 10:00 pm

KRBFC wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 9:58 pm
So we are using £13m plus yearly running costs from our promotion gains to buy ALK a new club?
We don't know.
The money is probably already in a bank account somewhere waiting to be used to buy a club, they've already tried once and missed out.
We don't know when that money was put into said bank account.

It doesn't really matter, the owners are growing the club and they want to go down the multi-club route.
It has potential to be a good thing, seems to work elsewhere and other clubs are looking to do the same.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by BurnleyFC » Sat May 27, 2023 10:01 pm

Shame we couldn’t have bought Helmond Sport. It would be a logical choice.
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Rileybobs » Sat May 27, 2023 10:11 pm

gandhisflipflop wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 10:06 pm
Clubs were doing it before brexit you bellend. You lost. Get over it
To be fair we all lost.
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by gandhisflipflop » Sat May 27, 2023 10:16 pm

Rileybobs wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 10:11 pm
To be fair we all lost.
Anyone who thought it was a short term thing is deluded. That said, it was before covid which ****** up many economies

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by timshorts » Sun May 28, 2023 7:18 am

distortiondave wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 1:02 pm
How do you pronounce it? Court-Rike?
Pretty much.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by MalaysiaMo » Sun May 28, 2023 7:26 am

gandhisflipflop wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 10:06 pm
Clubs were doing it before brexit you bellend. You lost. Get over it
Ahhh. You see, pre-Brexit clubs did it through choice. But now it seems it is a necessity. Not sure how that switch constitutes winning.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by MalaysiaMo » Sun May 28, 2023 7:32 am

Has anyone asked the supporters of KV Kortrijk how they feel about being a feeder club? Imagine the outrage if Burnley was bought to be a feeder club for one of the big clubs in Europe ..... and at the end of every season faced the prospect of losing the likes of Benson, Zaroury, Beyer etc to the consuming club ....

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Newcastleclaret93 » Sun May 28, 2023 7:36 am

I don’t know about this club. But Brightons feeder club love it, they are getting talent and quality they have never seen before and it’s made them very competitive in their respective league.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by frankinwales » Sun May 28, 2023 7:40 am

It would be great to get some of their fans over to see us if they are interested and supportive of our purchase.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by FeedTheArf » Sun May 28, 2023 7:45 am

KRBFC wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 9:58 pm
So we are using £13m plus yearly running costs from our promotion gains to buy ALK a new club?
Unless it’s another leveraged buyout?

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by MalaysiaMo » Sun May 28, 2023 8:29 am

Newcastleclaret93 wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 7:36 am
I don’t know about this club. But Brightons feeder club love it, they are getting talent and quality they have never seen before and it’s made them very competitive in their respective league.
I think Union Saint-Gilloise in Belgium benefits from Bloom (owner of BHA)'s money & expertise. He has a lot of both.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Sun May 28, 2023 8:43 am

Man City's 13-club group accused of 'stockpiling' players https://mol.im/a/12132045 via https://dailym.ai/android

Interesting article about the City group and the controversy around its behaviour

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Hipper » Sun May 28, 2023 9:37 am

distortiondave wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 1:02 pm
How do you pronounce it? Court-Rike?
I would say Court rake. The Dutch 'ij' is 'a' as pronounced in abc..

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by CaptainKirk » Sun May 28, 2023 9:39 am

KRBFC wrote:
Sat May 27, 2023 9:58 pm
So we are using £13m plus yearly running costs from our promotion gains to buy ALK a new club?
Whose promotion gains?

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by northeastclaret » Sun May 28, 2023 9:42 am

I think one of the messages this gives is that it emphasises the longer term commitment and planning of VK to Burnley particularly with it being a Belgium club. 😊

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Eyesofblue2 » Sun May 28, 2023 9:49 am

MalaysiaMo wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 7:32 am
Has anyone asked the supporters of KV Kortrijk how they feel about being a feeder club? Imagine the outrage if Burnley was bought to be a feeder club for one of the big clubs in Europe ..... and at the end of every season faced the prospect of losing the likes of Benson, Zaroury, Beyer etc to the consuming club ....
Any club our size faces the prospect of losing it's best players at the end of a season, feeder club or not.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by eastcoastclaret » Sun May 28, 2023 10:20 am

MalaysiaMo wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 7:32 am
Has anyone asked the supporters of KV Kortrijk how they feel about being a feeder club? Imagine the outrage if Burnley was bought to be a feeder club for one of the big clubs in Europe ..... and at the end of every season faced the prospect of losing the likes of Benson, Zaroury, Beyer etc to the consuming club ....
I would think the supporters would welcome stable ownership at this point. I wouldn't be surprised to see Kompany involved in some way either, which I'm sure they would see as a positive.

This type of link up, if done correctly, benefits both clubs.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by claretinkorea » Sun May 28, 2023 10:33 am

Hipper wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 9:37 am
I would say Court rake. The Dutch 'ij' is 'a' as pronounced in abc..
Not quite, the closest is Rye'k as in the word rye but then ending in a k. It isn't pronounced as an 'a' over here in NL by me or anyone I know ;) But is one of those letter combinations that throws a lot of non-native speakers off course!

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by ClaretTony » Sun May 28, 2023 10:52 am

claretinkorea wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 10:33 am
Not quite, the closest is Rye'k as in the word rye but then ending in a k. It isn't pronounced as an 'a' over here in NL by me or anyone I know ;) But is one of those letter combinations that throws a lot of non-native speakers off course!
Isn't it similar to the Dutch as in Virgil van DIJK or Frank RIJKAARD?

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by Hipper » Sun May 28, 2023 10:56 am

claretinkorea wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 10:33 am
Not quite, the closest is Rye'k as in the word rye but then ending in a k. It isn't pronounced as an 'a' over here in NL by me or anyone I know ;) But is one of those letter combinations that throws a lot of non-native speakers off course!
Maybe bit's an accent thing, like book and buke (as in Luke). My mum was Dutch and that's how she would have pronounced it although I agree it was not quite 'rake'.
Last edited by Hipper on Sun May 28, 2023 10:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by claretinkorea » Sun May 28, 2023 10:57 am

Yes, it is exactly the same. It's just that there isn't really an equivalent in English to this letter combination. It also sounds quite similar to the combination 'ei' (which on its own means 'egg' incidentally). And that one sounds a bit more like the a-i combination (but not quite). On its on, the 'IJ' also sounds somewhat like the word 'I' in English (when talking about yourself).

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by claretinkorea » Sun May 28, 2023 10:59 am

Hipper wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 10:56 am
Maybe bit's an accent thing, like book and buke (as in Luke). My mum was Dutch and that's how she would have pronounced it although I agree it was not quite 'rake'.
Perhaps that is it then, there are indeed quite a lot of regional accents over here. Which region was your mum from?

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by KRBFC » Sun May 28, 2023 7:56 pm

CaptainKirk wrote:
Sun May 28, 2023 9:39 am
Whose promotion gains?
Guess its not that difficult

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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by kortrijk » Mon May 29, 2023 10:18 am

Most of the Kortrijk supporters are probably excited about the Burnley idea. Not to become a "feeder club" but the alternatives are worse. Tan has done very very little for the club and he want's to sell. It's, according to the press, between the kaminski group and Burnley. It sure worked for Union Saint Gilles when they got the premier league support to get better results. We don't expect miracles, we just want owners who care for the club and don't **** with the supporters.

about the club:

passionate supporters, youngest average crowd age in the Belgian first league. biggest rivalries are with Zulte Waregem (derby, next season in lower league) and club brugge.

the local beer is indeed bockor but in the stadium the beer is jupiler (or in some places stella artois). max capacity of the stadium is about 9300, average i guess around 6000. we need a new stadium but love the old, current one.
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ClaretTony
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by ClaretTony » Mon May 29, 2023 10:23 am

kortrijk wrote:
Mon May 29, 2023 10:18 am
Most of the Kortrijk supporters are probably excited about the Burnley idea. Not to become a "feeder club" but the alternatives are worse. Tan has done very very little for the club and he want's to sell. It's, according to the press, between the kaminski group and Burnley. It sure worked for Union Saint Gilles when they got the premier league support to get better results. We don't expect miracles, we just want owners who care for the club and don't **** with the supporters.

about the club:

passionate supporters, youngest average crowd age in the Belgian first league. biggest rivalries are with Zulte Waregem (derby, next season in lower league) and club brugge.

the local beer is indeed bockor but in the stadium the beer is jupiler (or in some places stella artois). max capacity of the stadium is about 9300, average i guess around 6000. we need a new stadium but love the old, current one.
Thanks for the info kortrijk - let's see what happens regarding this. You never know, we might be coming for a friendly game one day.

kortrijk
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by kortrijk » Mon May 29, 2023 10:31 am

if one would like to get an idea about the atmosphere and football

derby against zulte waregem 2022
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMCX8di7TrA

against anderlecht earlier this year
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cadAGd87Ge0

kvk - genk earlier this year
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jk_u6D8kw0I
This user liked this post: Bosscat

RVclaret
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by RVclaret » Mon May 29, 2023 10:39 am

kortrijk wrote:
Mon May 29, 2023 10:18 am
Most of the Kortrijk supporters are probably excited about the Burnley idea. Not to become a "feeder club" but the alternatives are worse. Tan has done very very little for the club and he want's to sell. It's, according to the press, between the kaminski group and Burnley. It sure worked for Union Saint Gilles when they got the premier league support to get better results. We don't expect miracles, we just want owners who care for the club and don't **** with the supporters.

about the club:

passionate supporters, youngest average crowd age in the Belgian first league. biggest rivalries are with Zulte Waregem (derby, next season in lower league) and club brugge.

the local beer is indeed bockor but in the stadium the beer is jupiler (or in some places stella artois). max capacity of the stadium is about 9300, average i guess around 6000. we need a new stadium but love the old, current one.
Thanks for your comments. I will say that our owners are a lot better than Tan, who hasn’t displayed any real ability to run a football club. On the other hand our owners have reshaped our club and you should particularly be excited about the recruitment model. The Belgian link (at least for now) with Kompany is interesting too, and I wonder if he’s playing a part in pushing for this move.

jedi_master
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Re: KV Kortrijk

Post by jedi_master » Mon May 29, 2023 10:45 am

Great post Kortrijk, very useful information and glad that your fanbase would hopefully be ‘for’ this move as opposed to wary.

Hope there is a way of watching Kortrijk games somehow (when not playing the same time as Burnley). May have to buy a shirt if this goes through :)

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