Google Contactless Pay

[Fretters]

Has anyone noticed a difference with this? Previously I just had to unlock my phone and tap it to pay, but now when I do that, the payment fails and I have to use my fingerprint in Google wallet before tapping again. It's a right faff at the checkout and has completely wiped out the convenience of it.

I can't see any changes in my settings so just wondering if this is happening with anyone else?

Ta!

[Ptangyangkipperbang]

All this cashless is going to end in disaster

[Devils_Advocate]

Has anyone noticed a difference with this? Previously I just had to unlock my phone and tap it to pay, but now when I do that, the payment fails and I have to use my fingerprint in Google wallet before tapping again. It's a right faff at the checkout and has completely wiped out the convenience of it.

I can't see any changes in my settings so just wondering if this is happening with anyone else?

Ta!

Yep, I notices this but I unlock my phone using a finger print so if I unlock my phone and then tap it doesnt make me do the finger recognition again.

[Fretters]

Yep, I notices this but I unlock my phone using a finger print so if I unlock my phone and then tap it doesnt make me do the finger recognition again.

I'll try that, thanks. Was it recently you first noticed it?

[Devils_Advocate]

Yep last few days I think and definitely within last week

[Pickles]

This has happened to me too. Started last week.

[Bosscat]

Isn't extra security a good thing

[beddie]

I blame China.

[Bosscat]

I blame China.

Edd China

[Fretters]

Isn't extra security a good thing

The phone had to be unlocked first (by fingerprint or face) before using contactless so it was still secure.

I've just been to Aldi and it was actually much smoother. Still the extra fingerprint requirement, but it didn't behave like the payment had failed and make me wait to do the fingerprint, so it looks like they've ironed out a bug (likely after reading this thread )

[Croydon Claret]

It's a recent change according to the documentation. Presume there's a time limit beyond which you have to re-authenticate yourself.

To prove the point you could try unlocking the phone then immediately re-locking it just prior to making a purchase. If it works then that confirms there's a time limit

[Bosscat]

Fancy needing to take a bunch of Irises in to scan every time you go shopping ... or is it for when you are at a Garden Centre

Screenshot_20240326-181253~2.png (299.18 KiB) Viewed 2296 times

[dsr]

Steal a phone, and if it has a good fingerprint anywhere on the case, you're in.

One worry about fingerprint technology is that once the thieves have it (and they will, because no system is foolproof) then you're a bit stuffed. you can change your PIN number, but you can't change your fingerprints. (A thief in America tried it once, because he knew he had left dabs all over a crime scene - he burnt his fingertips off with acid so the fingerprint was gone. When they grew back, the fingerprint grew back identical to what it was before.)

[Rileybobs]

Steal a phone, and if it has a good fingerprint anywhere on the case, you're in.

One worry about fingerprint technology is that once the thieves have it (and they will, because no system is foolproof) then you're a bit stuffed. you can change your PIN number, but you can't change your fingerprints. (A thief in America tried it once, because he knew he had left dabs all over a crime scene - he burnt his fingertips off with acid so the fingerprint was gone. When they grew back, the fingerprint grew back identical to what it was before.)

How exactly would you get into someone’s phone with a fingerprint from the case?

[Devils_Advocate]

Steal a phone, and if it has a good fingerprint anywhere on the case, you're in.

Nonsense, biometric data like anything can be hacked but the idea that anyone who robs a phone has the capability to use a fingerprint on the case to get into it is rubbish.

No doubt its possible but it will very much be the rare exception that the thief can do this themselves and by the time a thief can get it to someone to hack it you'll have had time to disable all you key stuff like banking, google account etc

[Bosscat]

How exactly would you get into someone’s phone with a fingerprint from the case?

They do it on Mission Impossible and other Documentaries like that

[Fretters]

How exactly would you get into someone’s phone with a fingerprint from the case?

That's what of those BS things people hear down the pub, or see online, and just repeat as gospel without actually thinking about it. Happens way too much these days.

[dougcollins]

Fancy needing to take a bunch of Irises in to scan every time you go shopping ... or is it for when you are at a Garden CentreScreenshot_20240326-181253~2.png

Good of you to Flag that up.

[dougcollins]

How exactly would you get into someone’s phone with a fingerprint from the case?

MacGyver could probably make a nuclear device from a fingerprint on a case.

[dsr]

How exactly would you get into someone’s phone with a fingerprint from the case?

No idea, not my field. It is, however, possible to make a rubber finger with any given fingerprint on it, if you have the print. Any suggestion that it can't be done and never will be able to be done, is unlikely.

[dsr]

Nonsense, biometric data like anything can be hacked but the idea that anyone who robs a phone has the capability to use a fingerprint on the case to get into it is rubbish.

No doubt its possible but it will very much be the rare exception that the thief can do this themselves and by the time a thief can get it to someone to hack it you'll have had time to disable all you key stuff like banking, google account etc

But once your security system is compromised, can the same system with the same entry method, ever be called secure?

[Rileybobs]

No idea, not my field. It is, however, possible to make a rubber finger with any given fingerprint on it, if you have the print. Any suggestion that it can't be done and never will be able to be done, is unlikely.

But you said ‘Steal a phone, and if it has a good fingerprint anywhere on the case, you're in’, which suggests it’s quite a simple task and a valid security concern which it obviously isn’t. If someone stole my phone I think there’s a good chance I would be able to lock it before someone cloned my fingerprint and created a replica mould of my fingertip.

[dsr]

But you said ‘Steal a phone, and if it has a good fingerprint anywhere on the case, you're in’, which suggests it’s quite a simple task and a valid security concern which it obviously isn’t. If someone stole my phone I think there’s a good chance I would be able to lock it before someone cloned my fingerprint and created a replica mould of my fingertip.

Oh, I see. No, I wasn't saying that any thief can do it. But I suspect that there are some groups of quite clever thieves who could get systems in place to do it at speed.

Once they have your fingerprint, would they be able to use it with Google pay on a different phone? Long experience has taught me never to believe in foolproof software.

[dougcollins]

Every company has foolproof software, right up to the point when they suffer a cyber attack.

[Devils_Advocate]

But once your security system is compromised, can the same system with the same entry method, ever be called secure?

Well if amazingly you were somehow a victim of this you just wouldnt use it in the future. You decide whether you use face recognition, fingerprint, passcode, pattern etc so someone having your fingerprints doesnt give them access to anything.

Plus if you get a new device then that very same person would need to rob your new device so yes you could use the same entry method on your new device.

I think criminals with this level of sophistication wont be looking to randomly rob phones off every Tom, Dick or Harry

[Devils_Advocate]

Once they have your fingerprint, would they be able to use it with Google pay on a different phone? Long experience has taught me never to believe in foolproof software.

No, you can't just scan someones fingerprint on a random device and link to some remote bank account via google pay.

[Rileybobs]

Oh, I see. No, I wasn't saying that any thief can do it. But I suspect that there are some groups of quite clever thieves who could get systems in place to do it at speed.

Once they have your fingerprint, would they be able to use it with Google pay on a different phone? Long experience has taught me never to believe in foolproof software.

I’m not really sure where you’re going. Someone could sit behind me on the train and see me enter my phone password. Ditto my PIN number at the cash machine. Someone could beat me up, steal my house keys and rob all the money from my house (about £1.27). Nothing is foolproof, but I would say fingerprint technology is a fairly solid way of preventing someone from getting into your phone.

I don’t use Apple/Google pay as I find it a faff having to show my face to the phone or enter a number every time I want to get into it. But there’s no doubt that the technology is good.

[dsr]

No, you can't just scan someones fingerprint on a random device and link to some remote bank account via google pay.

Thank you, but that's not really what I am wondering what might happen. I was speculating that there may be sophisticated methods of internet fraud. I wasn't assuming that all criminals are thick as a brick.

[dsr]

I’m not really sure where you’re going. Someone could sit behind me on the train and see me enter my phone password. Ditto my PIN number at the cash machine. Someone could beat me up, steal my house keys and rob all the money from my house (about £1.27). Nothing is foolproof, but I would say fingerprint technology is a fairly solid way of preventing someone from getting into your phone.

I don’t use Apple/Google pay as I find it a faff having to show my face to the phone or enter a number every time I want to get into it. But there’s no doubt that the technology is good.

The point was that if your PIN is stolen, you can get a new PIN and the thief is no better off. If your keys are stolen, you can change the locks. If your fingerprint is stolen, then some thief has that fingerprint for ever- if it's any use. Maybe it isn't, and the fingerprint system is in practice unbreakable.

[Rileybobs]

The point was that if your PIN is stolen, you can get a new PIN and the thief is no better off. If your keys are stolen, you can change the locks. If your fingerprint is stolen, then some thief has that fingerprint for ever- if it's any use. Maybe it isn't, and the fingerprint system is in practice unbreakable.

But that thief would have to continually steal devices from you to make use of the fingerprint. It seems unlikely they’d go to the effort.

[Devils_Advocate]

I was speculating that there may be sophisticated methods of internet fraud.

If there is it has nothing to do with google pay and fingerprint recognition. Your fingerprints are still on your phone case regardless of if you are using it to unlock your phone and so this has no baring on what internet fraud could take place following them stealing your phone and cloning your fingerprints.

Your original main comments about this were

Steal a phone, and if it has a good fingerprint anywhere on the case, you're in.

One worry about fingerprint technology is that once the thieves have it (and they will, because no system is foolproof) then you're a bit stuffed.

Both are wrong assumptions as the thief isn't in and the victim isn't stuffed. You've questioned something and people with a better understanding than yourself have answered you so why dont you just take it onboard rather try and twist it into different scenarios to somehow show your original assumptions were right

[ClaretTony]

I don’t use Apple/Google pay as I find it a faff having to show my face to the phone or enter a number every time I want to get into it. But there’s no doubt that the technology is good.

I use Apple Pay (never used Google Pay) which for some time was useable with a finger print. Then with my last couple of phones it's been facial recognition. I found that a faff (I like that word) at first but got used to it and find it much easier and quicker than getting cards out of my wallet. I can't remember when I last used my actual credit card.

I don't know about finger print theft, but, come on, no one would steal my face.

[dsr]

If there is it has nothing to do with google pay and fingerprint recognition. Your fingerprints are still on your phone case regardless of if you are using it to unlock your phone and so this has no baring on what internet fraud could take place following them stealing your phone and cloning your fingerprints.

...

Both are wrong assumptions as the thief isn't in and the victim isn't stuffed. You've questioned something and people with a better understanding than yourself have answered you so why dont you just take it onboard rather try and twist it into different scenarios to somehow show your original assumptions were right

Well, that's me told. I usually have you on ignore, for obvious reasons, and it was clearly a mistake taking you off it.

[Rileybobs]

I use Apple Pay (never used Google Pay) which for some time was useable with a finger print. Then with my last couple of phones it's been facial recognition. I found that a faff (I like that word) at first but got used to it and find it much easier and quicker than getting cards out of my wallet. I can't remember when I last used my actual credit card.

I don't know about finger print theft, but, come on, no one would steal my face.

Haha.

Apple Pay is v convenient but there are too many occasions where entering a password on my phone or lifting it to my face is inconvenient. On a run, when the phone’s on my bedside table and on the wireless charging dock etc. No doubt that I see more people using their phone than a card these days though.

[Bordeauxclaret]

Well, that's me told. I usually have you on ignore, for obvious reasons, and it was clearly a mistake taking you off it.

Looks like he’s taught you something.

[jrgbfc]

I'm all for technology if it makes life easier but personally don't see how this is any easier than cash or card. Drives me mad when you're stuck in a queue and somebody in front is struggling to pay with their phone holding everybody up.

[Jakubclaret]

I use Google pay & the new changes haven't really made a difference, It's easier for me with a fingerprint sensor located at the side so it's all 1 handed that said I'd struggle with a bigger phone if the fingerprint sensor was on the screen itself located at the bottom where it's usually at.

[ClaretTony]

I'm all for technology if it makes life easier but personally don't see how this is any easier than cash or card. Drives me mad when you're stuck in a queue and somebody in front is struggling to pay with their phone holding everybody up.

Generally quicker than waiting for people to get a card out and definitely better than those paying cash which then might also involved change.

[Bosscat]

Generally quicker than waiting for people to get a card out and definitely better than those paying cash which then might also involved change.

Paying by cash in a queue, have wallet ready...

Paying by card when in a queue ... get card out of wallet ready to pay.

Paying by phone (or watch) in a queue, unlock phonewatch app then ready to pay.

Simple really but most seem to wait untill asked for payment then have to dig in pockets/handbag etc then open/unlock ...

Boy Scouts have it right ... "Be prepared"

[Fretters]

I'm all for technology if it makes life easier but personally don't see how this is any easier than cash or card. Drives me mad when you're stuck in a queue and somebody in front is struggling to pay with their phone holding everybody up.

It's more the not having to carry a wallet around with me that I like.

[ClaretTony]

I suppose it's all personal choice but I use Apple Pay whenever possible, be it in shops or online when available.

[dsr]

It's more the not having to carry a wallet around with me that I like.

On the other hand, with a card or cash you don't have to carry a phone. Even better.

[ClaretTony]

On the other hand, with a card or cash you don't have to carry a phone. Even better.

I'm sorry but I'd be lost without my phone

[dsr]

I'm sorry but I'd be lost without my phone

You can carry a map too.

My mobile phone is just that - a phone, not a smartphone - which means that I don't need to carry it. Which is just as well, because every time I want to use it I find I've left it switched on and the battery is flat.

[ClaretTony]

You can carry a map too.

My mobile phone is just that - a phone, not a smartphone - which means that I don't need to carry it. Which is just as well, because every time I want to use it I find I've left it switched on and the battery is flat.

You live in a different world to me

[dsr]

You live in a different world to me

I haven't found anywhere yet that absolutely refuses to deal with a smartphoneless person. Some American sports are getting dangerously close, though. I'll be at a Chicago Fire game in early May where the protocol for non-Smartphone possessors is to go to the box office with your email receipt, and one of the staff will escort me to the turnstile and use their smartphone to let me in!

Milwaukee Brewers and Chicago Cubs will both issue paper tickets at will call, for a $10 fee (for all tickets) at the Brewers, free at the Cubs. They don't advertise that, though.

[Clovius Boofus]

Sounds like you're making life needlessly hard work for yourself - and all because you think there's a possibility that someone will gain access to your phone by using a cloned fingerprint grafted onto a rubber-finger or some other nonsense.

[dsr]

Sounds like you're making life needlessly hard work for yourself - and all because you think there's a possibility that someone will gain access to your phone by using a cloned fingerprint grafted onto a rubber-finger or some other nonsense.

Hardly. It is possible to own a smartphone without putting all (or any) of your financial information onto it.

The reason I don't have one is because I'm not willing to spend bare minimum £120 per year, plus a capital outlay at the start, to suit other peoples' convenience. I don't see it providing that level of benefit for myself.

[Clovius Boofus]

Hardly. It is possible to own a smartphone without putting all (or any) of your financial information onto it.

The reason I don't have one is because I'm not willing to spend bare minimum £120 per year

Bare minium of £120 per year? You can get a sim card with unlimited text and minutes for £4.00 per month. Anyway, I'll leave you to it. Nearly every post you've made on this thread has been massively ill-informed.

[dsr]

Bare minium of £120 per year? You can get a sim card with unlimited text and minutes for £4.00 per month. Anyway, I'll leave you to it. Nearly every post you've made on this thread has been massively ill-informed.

Smartphone for £4 per month? You're sure that's internet access, not just phone calls and texts? I already have a phone that does calls and texts.