According to the Athletic ....

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jedi_master
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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by jedi_master » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:07 pm

Murger wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:01 pm
And you're automatically blaming the owners. Have you not considered Saint Dyche might have done something to warrant getting potted?
There is absolutely nothing to evidence that Sean Dyche has done anything to warrant the sack bar performances/results. Anything else is total fantasy posted on here by people making it up and/or guessing.

It’s akin to asking if Ukraine did anything to warrant being invaded.
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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by DCWat » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:07 pm

Paul Waine wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:02 pm
We've only got the things we can see to go on. The owners will know about financial impact of relegation. They also know about Sean Dyche's record as manager, including his history of avoiding relegation in previous seasons. They've seen the points gained since January, including wins v Brighton and Sours. Then they've seen the losses, especially v Brentford and Norwich.

My speculation - I am not in Burnley, I have no inside knowledge - is that there's been discussions during the days after Norwich game. Logic says these include prospects of avoiding relegation with Sean Dyche continuing as manager, SD plans for squad over summer, OOC players to be retained, transfer window targets, SD plans for Championship. Somewhere in all this process SD has given Alan Pace reason to decide that the club will be better off terminating SD and his coaching team, and, doing it immediately gave a higher chance of staying up than delaying the decision to the end of the season.

Yesterday's team performance seems to give some support to my speculation. A point at West Ham is good. No signs of panic among any of the team, yesterday. A much better performance than Norwich and Brentford.

UTC
That would hold more water if there appeared to be a plan in place for bringing someone in. Perhaps not for the Norwich game, but certainly ahead of the Southampton game.

Their gamble on staying up can’t have been to have Jackson in charge for any length of time.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by Jakubclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:09 pm

TheFamilyCat wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 9:58 am
You've missed the point, unsurprisingly. This is a discussion about a reported interim manager. Nobody is going to leave a job for a five week contract.

Recruiting a permanent manager is an entirely different prospect.
The discussion is based upon interim/permanent without being specific it’s quite possible a competent interim manager could be appointed who’s a success & it ends up becoming something more, can you imagine a interim manager coming in winning every game or most of them managing to stop up & then the club at the end of the season saying thanks a lot see you later?

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by arise_sir_charge » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:12 pm

jedi_master wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:07 pm
There is absolutely nothing to evidence that Sean Dyche has done anything to warrant the sack bar performances/results. Anything else is total fantasy posted on here by people making it up and/or guessing.

It’s akin to asking if Ukraine did anything to warrant being invaded.
That’s a ridiculous comment.

The reality is nobody barring those involved know what’s happened but many are quick to point the finger at those pesky Yanks.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by Jakubclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:14 pm

claretandy wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 10:03 am
The report also says... "However, should they find the right long-term candidate immediately, then that plan might change."
Yes somebody has indeed missed the point or failed to even read the article in hand & the favourable course of action has resulted in a pompous inaccurate counter post.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by jedi_master » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:15 pm

arise_sir_charge wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:12 pm
That’s a ridiculous comment.

The reality is nobody barring those involved know what’s happened but many are quick to point the finger at those pesky Yanks.
It’s a ridiculous comment to say nothing tells us Dyche has done anything wrong (beyond results/performances) to justify the timing of his sacking, despite there being no evidence whatsoever that he has done?

So you’re literally believing any Tom, Dick or Harry who is posting garbage on here because that is less ridiculous?

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by elwaclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:22 pm

BabylonClaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:07 pm
Have to say the rumours are a but weird. If his position was untenable and the owners were totally right to pot him why not say so?

Smacks more like a bust up with Dyche saying something like "you think I've been sat on my arse waiting for you to pot me. I've got irons in the fire if need be"

The rumours have shifted fron an article (clearly I fluency from the club) saying the players weren't really behind him but that soon disappeared as total rubbish so now we have the Dyche was talking to other club - was Everton but that's now looking like unlikely.

I suspectvtehres been something happen but its clearly nor Dyche crossing the line but rather a " we expect you to work with who we bring in " and the management team have gone "no way" so they've potted him.
Are you forgetting how toxic life at the club got when Dyche and Garlick fell out, that nearly led to relegation… and something has happened again… but its not down to Dyche, are you sure?

There are all kinds of reasonable rumours, some saying Dyche was looking to mug Burnley, others Burnley are waiting for Derby to relegated to not create ill-feeling with Derby, and allow Rooney to fulfil his wish to keep trying to save the Rams until relegation is confirmed, when a ‘Rooney dream team’ arrived… its all guess work. Only the people not yet disclosing anything REALLY KNOW.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by arise_sir_charge » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:23 pm

jedi_master wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:15 pm
It’s a ridiculous comment to say nothing tells us Dyche has done anything wrong (beyond results/performances) to justify the timing of his sacking, despite there being no evidence whatsoever that he has done?

So you’re literally believing any Tom, Dick or Harry who is posting garbage on here because that is less ridiculous?
On the contrary, I’m waiting before passing comment or apportioning ‘blame’. Nobody on this board has any idea of the specifics.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by TheFamilyCat » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:24 pm

Jakubclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:14 pm
Yes somebody has indeed missed the point or failed to even read the article in hand & the favourable course of action has resulted in a pompous inaccurate counter post.
Not really. If you are offering a five week contract you are only going to attract out of work managers. If they are open to a longer term contract and we are willing to offer them that then a permanent manager could come from that situation.

But making a permanent appointment opens up a much wider market.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by RVclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:25 pm

jedi_master wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:15 pm
It’s a ridiculous comment to say nothing tells us Dyche has done anything wrong (beyond results/performances) to justify the timing of his sacking, despite there being no evidence whatsoever that he has done?

So you’re literally believing any Tom, Dick or Harry who is posting garbage on here because that is less ridiculous?
Athletic article also pointed to players feeling stale / lost support of the dressing room. Added to myself having heard from a very good source that this was the case and senior players had become fed up. For ALK to sack the entire team and not have a replacement lined up immediately, suggests there is more to this than meets the eye, and if you don’t think that then fair enough but I find that naive.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by jedi_master » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:30 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:25 pm
Athletic article also pointed to players feeling stale / lost support of the dressing room. Added to myself having heard from a very good source that this was the case and senior players had become fed up. For ALK to sack the entire team and not have a replacement lined up immediately, suggests there is more to this than meets the eye, and if you don’t think that then fair enough but I find that naive.
Things can go stale, very possibly the case. You don’t sack your physio and goalkeeping coach for that (who predate Sean Dyche).

You certainly don’t do it on a whim with seven games left either. This decision, if it was coming, needed to be made after the Brentford game.

It is not naive to disregard conjecture and hearsay. The only people purporting to say there were off the field issues on here (and inventing stories in their head that Dyche was going to Everton, fighting people with Duncan Ferguson and X, Y, Z) are people who have wanted rid of Dyche for months (years, even) which is an interesting coincidence. In terms of articles, most say it was a shock to players, a couple by Jack Gaughan (who Alan Pace has a history of ‘using’) claim that there were ‘some’ players unhappy with the manager.
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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by DCWat » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:32 pm

RVclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:25 pm
Athletic article also pointed to players feeling stale / lost support of the dressing room. Added to myself having heard from a very good source that this was the case and senior players had become fed up. For ALK to sack the entire team and not have a replacement lined up immediately, suggests there is more to this than meets the eye, and if you don’t think that then fair enough but I find that naive.
The timing suggests that there may be something other than just results. Either that or they’ve made simply made a decision at a ridiculously late stage.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by dandeclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:55 pm

Paul Waine wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:02 pm
We've only got the things we can see to go on. The owners will know about financial impact of relegation. They also know about Sean Dyche's record as manager, including his history of avoiding relegation in previous seasons. They've seen the points gained since January, including wins v Brighton and Sours. Then they've seen the losses, especially v Brentford and Norwich.

My speculation - I am not in Burnley, I have no inside knowledge - is that there's been discussions during the days after Norwich game. Logic says these include prospects of avoiding relegation with Sean Dyche continuing as manager, SD plans for squad over summer, OOC players to be retained, transfer window targets, SD plans for Championship. Somewhere in all this process SD has given Alan Pace reason to decide that the club will be better off terminating SD and his coaching team, and, doing it immediately gave a higher chance of staying up than delaying the decision to the end of the season.

Yesterday's team performance seems to give some support to my speculation. A point at West Ham is good. No signs of panic among any of the team, yesterday. A much better performance than Norwich and Brentford.

UTC
Did Burnley play Everton 3 games ago?

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by deanothedino » Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:03 pm

gandhisflipflop wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 8:51 am
I paid a quid to subscribe, and it says the reason for the sacking was underperformance, which makes no sense really as surely you’d have had a replacement lined up!
Reads to me like there was a conversation along the following lines.

Board: ”Sean we’d like you to try and attack more”

Sean: “No, we’ll stick to my plan.”

Board: “Please Sean.”

Sean: “No”

Board: “Okay, thanks for everything in the past. Here is your P45”

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by deanothedino » Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:04 pm

beddie wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 8:47 am
Can’t read it due to the annoying advertisement that crops up as you scroll down.
Shock. Imagine having to pay people to do work :shock:

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by claretandy » Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:15 pm

jedi_master wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:30 pm
Things can go stale, very possibly the case. You don’t sack your physio and goalkeeping coach for that (who predate Sean Dyche).

You certainly don’t do it on a whim with seven games left either. This decision, if it was coming, needed to be made after the Brentford game.

It is not naive to disregard conjecture and hearsay. The only people purporting to say there were off the field issues on here (and inventing stories in their head that Dyche was going to Everton, fighting people with Duncan Ferguson and X, Y, Z) are people who have wanted rid of Dyche for months (years, even) which is an interesting coincidence. In terms of articles, most say it was a shock to players, a couple by Jack Gaughan (who Alan Pace has a history of ‘using’) claim that there were ‘some’ players unhappy with the manager.
Both Boden and Andy Jones have reported that certain players were unhappy/bored with Dyche's methods, and that training was upbeat on Friday.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by agreenwood » Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:37 pm

jedi_master wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:30 pm
Things can go stale, very possibly the case. You don’t sack your physio and goalkeeping coach for that (who predate Sean Dyche).

You certainly don’t do it on a whim with seven games left either. This decision, if it was coming, needed to be made after the Brentford game.

It is not naive to disregard conjecture and hearsay. The only people purporting to say there were off the field issues on here (and inventing stories in their head that Dyche was going to Everton, fighting people with Duncan Ferguson and X, Y, Z) are people who have wanted rid of Dyche for months (years, even) which is an interesting coincidence. In terms of articles, most say it was a shock to players, a couple by Jack Gaughan (who Alan Pace has a history of ‘using’) claim that there were ‘some’ players unhappy with the manager.
I don’t know much about the world of finance, nor the companies that dominate it. However, it seems just as naive to believe a group of businessmen who appear to have risen to high ranking positions in their chosen fields are prone to making rash and I’ll-thought through decisions without solid reasons, as it does to believe that disenchantment within the squad had risen to such an extent that it was time to part ways.

As for the full house clean, I agree it seems drastic and unfair on the likes of Mercer & Beattie, but maybe a clean slate is what’s needed after 10 years and maybe being able to bring in a full compliment of staff makes the job more attractive.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by paulatky » Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:46 pm

agreenwood wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:37 pm
I don’t know much about the world of finance, nor the companies that dominate it. However, it seems just as naive to believe a group of businessmen who appear to have risen to high ranking positions in their chosen fields are prone to making rash and I’ll-thought through decisions without solid reasons, as it does to believe that disenchantment within the squad had risen to such an extent that it was time to part ways.

As for the full house clean, I agree it seems drastic and unfair on the likes of Mercer & Beattie, but maybe a clean slate is what’s needed after 10 years and maybe being able to bring in a full compliment of staff makes the job more attractive.
That group of business men saw an opportunity to make, in their eyes, a killing without risking their own money.

They assumed they would be able to get additional investors into the club but that will be very difficult to achieve with relegation

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by elwaclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:59 pm

paulatky wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:46 pm
That group of business men saw an opportunity to make, in their eyes, a killing without risking their own money.

They assumed they would be able to get additional investors into the club but that will be very difficult to achieve with relegation
How were they to ‘make a killing’? How many club owners ever make a killing? If they are guilty of anything it is wanting the Kudos of having a football club without the finance to support it. AS for making a killing; you don’t get a fast turnover by paying over the odds, as a Banker it is one thing we can be pretty sure Pace does know.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by agreenwood » Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:59 pm

paulatky wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:46 pm
That group of business men saw an opportunity to make, in their eyes, a killing without risking their own money.

They assumed they would be able to get additional investors into the club but that will be very difficult to achieve with relegation
You may well be right, but that doesn’t mean that they’d pull the trigger on Dyche without cause. The only published stories out there suggests elements of the squad had lost faith in Dyche. Fully accept that those stories may have been planted to take some of the heat off the ownership group, but it’s the only story being reported as to the reasoning.

In this day and age you’d think that if the playing staff felt as outraged by Dyche’s departure as large elements of the fanbase, it might have leaked out by now.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by Paul Waine » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:07 pm

DCWat wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:07 pm
That would hold more water if there appeared to be a plan in place for bringing someone in. Perhaps not for the Norwich game, but certainly ahead of the Southampton game.

Their gamble on staying up can’t have been to have Jackson in charge for any length of time.
Hi DCW, when I say "somewhere in this process..." I'm suggesting that when the discussions commenced Alan Pace/owners had no plans to let Sean Dyche do, that their thoughts were very much how SD would take the club forward beyond the end of the season, that "Alan Pace loves Sean Dyche" continued to hold. But, as those discussions progressed, the owners started to see things differently. I'm not going to suggest that SD did something that made Alan Pace "fall out of love" with him. Maybe there was a "falling out" maybe there wasn't. I don't know. However, there are other posters on this mb that suggest that SD previously fell out with Mike Garlick. So, maybe that is what happened this time.

So, my speculation, there was no plan in place when Sean Dyche and coaching team were let go on Friday because the owners weren't planning to let SD go. Just, that's how the discussions ended up.

UTC
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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by Paul Waine » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:11 pm

dandeclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 12:55 pm
Did Burnley play Everton 3 games ago?
Agree. Burnley's last 3 games: West Ham (A), 17th April, 1-1; Norwich (A), 10th April, 2-0; Everton (H), 6th April, 3-2. (Home team's score first, of course).

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by dandeclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:12 pm

agreenwood wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:37 pm
I don’t know much about the world of finance, nor the companies that dominate it. However, it seems just as naive to believe a group of businessmen who appear to have risen to high ranking positions in their chosen fields are prone to making rash and I’ll-thought through decisions without solid reasons, as it does to believe that disenchantment within the squad had risen to such an extent that it was time to part ways.

As for the full house clean, I agree it seems drastic and unfair on the likes of Mercer & Beattie, but maybe a clean slate is what’s needed after 10 years and maybe being able to bring in a full compliment of staff makes the job more attractive.
I don’t get the clean sweep is what’s needed theory. The club is still way above its natural position in the league ladder. Stripping out the management team that got the club there seems strange to me.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by agreenwood » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:18 pm

dandeclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:12 pm
I don’t get the clean sweep is what’s needed theory. The club is still way above its natural position in the league ladder. Stripping out the management team that got the club there seems strange to me.
Don’t disagree. Personally don’t find Dyche’s departure that strange or outrageous given the results and performances this season. Don’t agree with the timing, but think he was likely to go at some point in near future. Ten years is a very long time in football and there’s little loyalty when the results aren’t there.

Getting rid of the entire backroom staff is odd. Im just offering a possible explanation. It’s also possible that some of them chose to leave with Dyche, either because they want to be free when he gets his next job or didn’t fancy waiting to be pushed out by the next man in.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by Herts Clarets » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:19 pm

The way to make a small fortune out of a football club is to start with a large one. And without any inside info it is clear that something has gone on behind the scenes, some of which may come out sometime in the future and some may not. I can only think it is something serious given the scale of deck clearing that has taken place.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by paulatky » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:27 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:59 pm
How were they to ‘make a killing’? How many club owners ever make a killing? If they are guilty of anything it is wanting the Kudos of having a football club without the finance to support it. AS for making a killing; you don’t get a fast turnover by paying over the odds, as a Banker it is one thing we can be pretty sure Pace does know.
Well they certainly didn’t invest in Burnley just for the love of it.
I think they thought they were getting it cheap and would be able to multiply there investment many times based on other US franchise sports teams.

They maybe businessmen but they are not football men.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by elwaclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:28 pm

paulatky wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:27 pm
Well they certainly didn’t invest in Burnley just for the love of it.
I think they thought they were getting it cheap and would be able to multiply there investment many times based on other US franchise sports teams.

They maybe businessmen but they are not football men.
Absolute tosh based on nothing but your personal perception.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by aclaretinstevenage » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:32 pm

Steve-Harpers-perm wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 10:26 am
To be fair it looks like he’s been out on the lash all weekend!
Doing the rounds down here; Dyche and Ferguson went on the lash after the Everton game and got into a spot of bother. Pace being Mormon called Dyche in to discuss / explain and the sacking came about from that meeting.

Perhaps the rumours about Dyche going to be the next Everton Manager actually had some legs and Pace felt he had to act.

Maybe just a rumour......maybe not!

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by taio » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:36 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:28 pm
Absolute tosh based on nothing but your personal perception.
elwaclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:27 pm
So why do you need to argue the point with someone you don’t know. I know quite a lot and never feel the need to argue with strangers who disagree, only to try to make them open their minds to other possibilities.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by dandeclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:36 pm

Lads…. Just cos you’ve heard a story, it doesn’t mean it’s true.

Dyche out with Ferguson, got into a scuffle, agreed to take over st Everton and now taking all the out of contract players with him……

I mean, it’s real life, this feels like a return if dream team ffs.
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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by BleedingClaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:38 pm

gandhisflipflop wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 9:04 am
The only way an interim comes in is if he is going to be moving upstairs in the summer
Word is we need to sell the stairs
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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by paulatky » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:40 pm

aclaretinstevenage wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:32 pm
Doing the rounds down here; Dyche and Ferguson went on the lash after the Everton game and got into a spot of bother. Pace being Mormon called Dyche in to discuss / explain and the sacking came about from that meeting.

Perhaps the rumours about Dyche going to be the next Everton Manager actually had some legs and Pace felt he had to act.

Maybe just a rumour......maybe not!
Yet no one with a mobile phone to take a pic saw them?

It’s 2022 not 1960 , just think about it

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by spt_claret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:41 pm

dandeclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:36 pm
Lads…. Just cos you’ve heard a story, it doesn’t mean it’s true.

Dyche out with Ferguson, got into a scuffle, agreed to take over st Everton and now taking all the out of contract players with him……

I mean, it’s real life, this feels like a return if dream team ffs.
Dream Team now there was a quality show. Let's hope Dyche's replacement isn't a Don Barker.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by GodIsADeeJay81 » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:43 pm

spt_claret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:41 pm
Dream Team now there was a quality show. Let's hope Dyche's replacement isn't a Don Barker.
My mate loves that show and would love to see it return, personally I never got into it.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by paulatky » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:44 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:28 pm
Absolute tosh based on nothing but your personal perception.
I would back my judgment against yours any day.

Why do you think they bought the club?
Because they liked the area and liked Holland’s pies and beni & hot.

No they did it to make a financial gain for themselves , albeit without risking much of their own money.
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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by Vegas Claret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:53 pm

Penwortham_Claret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 9:03 am
There will 100% be a NDA in place
I heard on he radio that Dyche can't make a statement until the compensation has been agreed and then it will be done through the League Managers Association - standard practice apparently

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by elwaclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:56 pm

paulatky wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:44 pm
I would back my judgment against yours any day.

Why do you think they bought the club?
Because they liked the area and liked Holland’s pies and beni & hot.

No they did it to make a financial gain for themselves , albeit without risking much of their own money.
Where have I may a judgement? I have more sense than judge something I know nothing about, unlike a lot on here.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by claret2018 » Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:08 pm

I have to say I’m loving these mad theories. It’s easy to see how people get suckered into believing all sorts they read online.

He was sacked because we’ve been absolute toilet for 2 years.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by jedi_master » Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:09 pm

agreenwood wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:18 pm
Don’t disagree. Personally don’t find Dyche’s departure that strange or outrageous given the results and performances this season. Don’t agree with the timing, but think he was likely to go at some point in near future. Ten years is a very long time in football and there’s little loyalty when the results aren’t there.

Getting rid of the entire backroom staff is odd. Im just offering a possible explanation. It’s also possible that some of them chose to leave with Dyche, either because they want to be free when he gets his next job or didn’t fancy waiting to be pushed out by the next man in.
It’s not just the backroom staff in this one fell swoop which is the scary thing here though to me - it’s been the slow but steady removal of anyone with any historical connection/history with the club over our sustained period of success. Why have so many people that are viewed as very good at their jobs been removed without much (or any?) fanfare about their service, and either not been replaced at all or simply had their responsibilities shifted under someone else who already (theoretically) should have enough on their plate?

It’s that alongside the total removal of all of our football side people that is such bizarre behaviour, that you never really see. The physio for Gods sake!

Dyche was under performing, I love the bloke but if Pace had decided “we need to try something else” after the Brentford debacle, I’d have been very sad as I had hoped Dyche would stick around for the Championship - but I’d have at least understood, to an extent. A final dice throw if you will. The timing of this along with the manner of it is mental - and worrying when looked at in tandem with how Pace has already treated the off pitch team.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by JohnDearyMe » Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:09 pm

agreenwood wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 2:37 pm
I don’t know much about the world of finance, nor the companies that dominate it. However, it seems just as naive to believe a group of businessmen who appear to have risen to high ranking positions in their chosen fields are prone to making rash and I’ll-thought through decisions without solid reasons, as it does to believe that disenchantment within the squad had risen to such an extent that it was time to part ways.
Having watched those fairly recent fly on the wall documentaries at QPR & Sunderland, where both clubs were owned by high ranking businessmen, i wouldn't subscribe to that belief.
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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by paulatky » Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:18 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 3:56 pm
Where have I may a judgement? I have more sense than judge something I know nothing about, unlike a lot on here.
You judged my previous comment as “ total tosh”

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by elwaclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:23 pm

paulatky wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:18 pm
You judged my previous comment as “ total tosh”
Because it had no reliable source or grounding - I’ve just heard that Meagan Martell was back in the country so she could invest a billion pounds in Burnley football club for Harry’s birthday present and that she wants Brooklyn as manager with David Beckham ass General manager.

I have no proof whatsoever that I am right.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by taio » Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:26 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:23 pm
Because it had no reliable source or grounding - I’ve just heard that Meagan Martell was back in the country so she could invest a billion pounds in Burnley football club for Harry’s birthday present and that she wants Brooklyn as manager with David Beckham ass General manager.

I have no proof whatsoever that I am right.
It wasn't absolute tosh though. It was an entirely reasonable viewpoint. Why do you think they acquired the club?

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by elwaclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:37 pm

taio wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:26 pm
It wasn't absolute tosh though. It was an entirely reasonable viewpoint. Why do you think they acquired the club?
I have no doubt Alan Pace saw an opportunity to make money LONG TERM, was that the main driving force behind buying Burnley? Possibly, obviously they don’t hope to lose their shirts. BUT who do they sell to, the queue was not massive last time? Where does the quick turnaround happen? Why pay more than its valued unless you are buying ‘good will’, why do you need good will on a quick turnaround? Etc. etc. I’m not convinced Alan Pace will succeed and I’m not sure it was the wisest of sales… but I don’t know. One thing that makes not a jot of sense is they came in expecting not to have to speculate to accumulate and grow Burnley before seeing any return. Why an established Premier club… with wages and overheads that come with it rather than pumping a lot less money into a Salford type setup and develop that to maximise the opportunity for profit?

There are many many reasons Pace wanted a football club, I’m pretty certain a quick turn around was not one of them.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by Burnley1989 » Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:40 pm

jedi_master wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:09 pm
It’s not just the backroom staff in this one fell swoop which is the scary thing here though to me - it’s been the slow but steady removal of anyone with any historical connection/history with the club over our sustained period of success. Why have so many people that are viewed as very good at their jobs been removed without much (or any?) fanfare about their service, and either not been replaced at all or simply had their responsibilities shifted under someone else who already (theoretically) should have enough on their plate?

It’s that alongside the total removal of all of our football side people that is such bizarre behaviour, that you never really see. The physio for Gods sake!

Dyche was under performing, I love the bloke but if Pace had decided “we need to try something else” after the Brentford debacle, I’d have been very sad as I had hoped Dyche would stick around for the Championship - but I’d have at least understood, to an extent. A final dice throw if you will. The timing of this along with the manner of it is mental - and worrying when looked at in tandem with how Pace has already treated the off pitch team.
Unfortunately it’s really common in business, the whole overhaul. It does often work out though so let’s see

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by taio » Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:42 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:37 pm
I have no doubt Alan Pace saw an opportunity to make money LONG TERM, was that the main driving force behind buying Burnley? Possibly, obviously they don’t hope to lose their shirts. BUT who do they sell to, the queue was not massive last time? Where does the quick turnaround happen? Why pay more than its valued unless you are buying ‘good will’, why do you need good will on a quick turnaround? Etc. etc. I’m not convinced Alan Pace will succeed and I’m not sure it was the wisest of sales… but I don’t know. One thing that makes not a jot of sense is they came in expecting not to have to speculate to accumulate and grow Burnley before seeing any return. Why an established Premier club… with wages and overheads that come with it rather than pumping a lot less money into a Salford type setup and develop that to maximise the opportunity for profit?

There are many many reasons Pace wanted a football club, I’m pretty certain a quick turn around was not one of them.
I think paulatky simply said they saw it as an investment opportunity and didn't stipulate a time frame.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by elwaclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 5:00 pm

taio wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:42 pm
I think paulatky simply said they saw it as an investment opportunity and didn't stipulate a time frame.
Also said Pace was not a football man. He himself states that he has wanted to get involved with football since he fell in love with the game as a student… and has many contacts/friends from that time working in the game. Their transfer record of bringing under the radar signing from Europe supports his claim - it was a standing joke SD did not look outside the Championship for signings for years prior.

Of course they saw an investment opportunity, does anyone ever buy a club they don’t see an opportunity in… is that to progress the club or fill their pockets? Admittedly I’m looking in from way outside these days, but where can you honestly point to an say they did not back SD in everything he was doing? Where were they not trying to move the club forward? And where was the alternative sale - the Egyptian? Garlick wanted out and the relationship with Dyche meant someone had to go. I really don’t get where people thought Burnley were heading with a manager and coach that couldn’t even talk to each other. Nor did I see many Arabs or Russians in the queue at the time.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by spt_claret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 5:06 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 5:00 pm
Their transfer record of bringing under the radar signing from Europe supports his claim - it was a standing joke SD did not look outside the Championship for signings for years prior.
You need to stop repeating this when for years it was reported that Dyche wanted to use the European market and GARLICK didn't, because he didn't trust our scouting ability overseas, and that this was cited as one of the reasons Dyche & Garlick would clash.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by elwaclaret » Mon Apr 18, 2022 5:12 pm

spt_claret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 5:06 pm
You need to stop repeating this when for years it was reported that Dyche wanted to use the European market and GARLICK didn't, because he didn't trust our scouting ability overseas, and that this was cited as one of the reasons Dyche & Garlick would clash.
Really, even I began to wonder why Dyche refused to play to our new players strengths and clearly didn’t trust WW or Cornet… both European signings on the cusp of seemingly better things… after both signings were met with gasps by the world looking in, in turn. And I thoroughly believed that Dyche would save us, so I’ve been accused far more often of being a happy clapper than anti-Dyche for years btw.

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Re: According to the Athletic ....

Post by paulatky » Mon Apr 18, 2022 5:20 pm

elwaclaret wrote:
Mon Apr 18, 2022 4:23 pm
Because it had no reliable source or grounding - I’ve just heard that Meagan Martell was back in the country so she could invest a billion pounds in Burnley football club for Harry’s birthday present and that she wants Brooklyn as manager with David Beckham ass General manager.

I have no proof whatsoever that I am right.
It’s seems to be your way or no way and when someone has a different opinion you become aggressive and abusive.

Good luck for the future with an attitude like that

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